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#51
#51
McDad said:
I hope this is all oversight on teacher's part. Right now, it sounds lazy or almost like she has an ax to grind against your kiddo. I had some teachers treat me that way in school. It sucked.
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Not to play devil's advocate but this type of grading system is not unique or uncommon. I looked at my son's Powerschool and 5/14 of his teachers his 2 years of HS use this method. In the past, I've coached at HS level (at various schools) and when evaluating grades and trying to see which players are eligible, I ran into this grading system a fair bit. I would say as the teachers have got accustomed to the technology, there has been an increase in non-traditional grading systems.

The main thing is did the teacher properly communicate the grading system. I would think with a weighted system, a student would have seen the impact in the first quarter back in September or October so anything in May should not be a surprise.
 
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#52
#52
BigOrangeMojo said:
Not to play devil's advocate but this type of grading system is not unique or uncommon. I looked at my son's Powerschool and 5/14 of his teachers his 2 years of HS use this method. In the past, I've coached at HS level (at various schools) and when evaluating grades and trying to see which players are eligible, I ran into this grading system a fair bit. I would say as the teachers have got accustomed to the technology, there has been an increase in non-traditional grading systems.

The main thing is did the teacher properly communicate the grading system. I would think with a weighted system, a student would have seen the impact in the first quarter back in September or October so anything in May should not be a surprise.
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I'd bet many teachers dont even understand there are 2 different answers possible here. If you have a category and in that category every assignment has the same number of possible questions, then the issue never arises. And that is feasible to see a teacher give quizzes or tests where each one has the same number of questions.

The surprise is seeing a term "average" on a screen and then seeing it does not calculate average. The front screen has weighted averages, so that makes sense. When you click into the next screen to look at a particular category of weighted average, it uses the term average. There is a combination of poorly designed software and/or poor understanding by the teacher.
 
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#53
#53
I understand your pain @allvol123. Here was my son's first quarter English. An "A" is a 90. Assessments counted for 55% and Daily Grades counted for 45%.

If you add up the GRADES and divide by 16, he gets a 94
If you add up the assessment GRADES and divide by 5, that's a 90 and the Daily GRADES by 11 (95). If you do the 55/45 assessment/daily weight, that a 92% average

If you add up the SCORE and then apply the 55/45 weight, that's an 89, which is what his average was.


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#54
#54
I had this happen in my criminal justice class in college.

I ended up with a B instead an A (my only B ever in college).

I dropped that major immediately after as she taught quite a bit of the CJ classes.
 
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#55
#55
BigOrangeMojo said:
I understand your pain @allvol123. Here was my son's first quarter English. An "A" is a 90. Assessments counted for 55% and Daily Grades counted for 45%.

If you add up the GRADES and divide by 16, he gets a 94
If you add up the assessment GRADES and divide by 5, that's a 90 and the Daily GRADES by 11 (95). If you do the 55/45 assessment/daily weight, that a 92% average

If you add up the SCORE and then apply the 55/45 weight, that's an 89, which is what his average was.


View attachment 370447
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But it sounds like you knew assessments and daily grades counted differently.

I dont think that is my issue here.
 
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#56
#56
BigOrangeMojo said:
Not to play devil's advocate but this type of grading system is not unique or uncommon. I looked at my son's Powerschool and 5/14 of his teachers his 2 years of HS use this method. In the past, I've coached at HS level (at various schools) and when evaluating grades and trying to see which players are eligible, I ran into this grading system a fair bit. I would say as the teachers have got accustomed to the technology, there has been an increase in non-traditional grading systems.

The main thing is did the teacher properly communicate the grading system. I would think with a weighted system, a student would have seen the impact in the first quarter back in September or October so anything in May should not be a surprise.
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I was responding to her counting the assignment as late 2 times and attempted to do it a 3rd.

I have no issue with the method of grading.
 
#57
#57
It’s not a math question. It is an English question. Was the grading formula described as using the average of the QUIZ GRADES or the average of the QUIZ QUESTIONS answered correctly? If there is no mention of weighting or the number of questions then I would assume the averaging of the quiz grades is correct. If each of the quizzes was covering the same period of time studied, such as being given on every other Friday, then that further supports equally weighted quizzes. No mention of the exact quiz weighting is a communication fail.
 
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#60
#60
allvol123:

I haven't read all of the responses you've gotten but let me make a few suggestions on how I would address this with the teacher. I speak from experience having a spouse who has taught over 25 years in both middle and high school.

1. Ask to have someone else present at the meeting with the teacher - his/her direct supervisor perhaps or principal.
2. Write out the issue beforehand and email it to everyone so that they can read the background.
3. When you meet, stay cool and calm. Blowing up will almost inevitably be seen as negative. Here is how I would argue it:

Calculating things like how the teacher is doing it is giving more weight to the quizzes that have more points. BUT, that information is NOT given to students beforehand. Students probably assume that a quiz is a quiz
and that all quizes count equally (thats how I would operate). The only way it is fair under the current systems is if all students KNOW the number of points for all quizzes before the start of the first quiz. Since this was
NOT known, you think that equally weighting each quiz is MORE FAIR. Then propose the following: For each student, calculate the overall both ways and give each student the highest score from the two. That way
no one is penalized (i.e. someone else isn't going to be downgraded by the unweighted average).

Good luck.
 
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#61
#61
Thunder Good-Oil said:
It’s not a math question. It is an English question. Was the grading formula described as using the average of the QUIZ GRADES or the average of the QUIZ QUESTIONS answered correctly? If there is no mention of weighting or the number of questions then I would assume the averaging of the quiz grades is correct. If each of the quizzes was covering the same period of time studied, such as being given on every other Friday, then that further supports equally weighted quizzes. No mention of the exact quiz weighting is a communication fail.
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This. There is no mention of weighting.

And since you specifically mention weighting in your overall grade and dont mention it in each specific area, then the normal assumption is average the quiz grades.
 
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#63
#63
OldandStillaVol said:
allvol123:

I haven't read all of the responses you've gotten but let me make a few suggestions on how I would address this with the teacher. I speak from experience having a spouse who has taught over 25 years in both middle and high school.

1. Ask to have someone else present at the meeting with the teacher - his/her direct supervisor perhaps or principal.
2. Write out the issue beforehand and email it to everyone so that they can read the background.
3. When you meet, stay cool and calm. Blowing up will almost inevitably be seen as negative. Here is how I would argue it:

Calculating things like how the teacher is doing it is giving more weight to the quizzes that have more points. BUT, that information is NOT given to students beforehand. Students probably assume that a quiz is a quiz
and that all quizes count equally (thats how I would operate). The only way it is fair under the current systems is if all students KNOW the number of points for all quizzes before the start of the first quiz. Since this was
NOT known, you think that equally weighting each quiz is MORE FAIR. Then propose the following: For each student, calculate the overall both ways and give each student the highest score from the two. That way
no one is penalized (i.e. someone else isn't going to be downgraded by the unweighted average).

Good luck.
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I hear you and you preach so much that is correct.

But already been down this road with same teacher and admin and was basically told to suck it.

I wanted my child's unit tests, after everyone had taken it, so I could review mistakes with my child. Not to question the grade or any other nefarious reason, but to be a damn parent and work with my child on their mistakes and improve them. I was told i couldnt have it. Admin backed the teacher. Teacher claimed if I got the test, they would have to make a new one next school year to prevent cheating.
 
#64
#64
allvol123 said:
I hear you and you preach so much that is correct.

But already been down this road with same teacher and admin and was basically told to suck it.

I wanted my child's unit tests, after everyone had taken it, so I could review mistakes with my child. Not to question the grade or any other nefarious reason, but to be a damn parent and work with my child on their mistakes and improve them. I was told i couldnt have it. Admin backed the teacher. Teacher claimed if I got the test, they would have to make a new one next school year to prevent cheating.
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Well that sucks. Is this a public school? If so, probably not much more you can do.
 
#65
#65
OldandStillaVol said:
Well that sucks. Is this a public school? If so, probably not much more you can do.
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Yes. My view, after dealing with this for the past 9 months, is that admin will protect teachers on any and all issues. There is no real interest in what is best for the student.
 
#66
#66
allvol123 said:
Yes. My view, after dealing with this for the past 9 months, is that admin will protect teachers on any and all issues. There is no real interest in what is best for the student.
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Unfortunately, I think you are right. Don’t want to turn this into a political topic but when my wife started teaching, this is what drove her to private schools. Things aren’t perfect in private schools by a long shot but that is the direction we have taken.
 
#67
#67
OldandStillaVol said:
Unfortunately, I think you are right. Don’t want to turn this into a political topic but when my wife started teaching, this is what drove her to private schools. Things aren’t perfect in private schools by a long shot but that is the direction we have taken.
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I agree. My wife was a teacher when we got married and she got out. Her libertarian beliefs couldnt handle it.
 
#68
#68
McDad said:
I would make that bet too. Teachers are using terminology they poorly understand or don't understand at all.

Regardless how it turns out, we're all accomplices in the effort. Updates are needed as it plays out.
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Dated a jr. high math teacher years ago. She did not know what the Pythagorean theorem was. Did I mention she was blonde?
 
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