Tea Party revolt within the GOP

#51
#51
Rand Paul isn't a social conservative (for one example).

I'd have to look race by race to see if your TP supports as social conservative over a fiscal conservative but I can't think of examples where this is true.

It is like from a candidate standpoint that fiscal conservatives are also likely to be social conservatives but that doesn't mean that is why they win the backing of the TP - my bet is that most cases see the TP choosing the candidate they see as most fiscally conservative (the primary concern) if they are socially conservative then so be it.

If the TP supported Mike Huckabee over say a Chris Christie then I might agree that social conservatism has over taken fiscal conservatism in the TP.
 
#52
#52
In the 2010 elections, Angle in Nevada and O'Donnell in Delaware cost the Rs control of the senate. Akin might keep the Ds in control of the senate in 2012. What all three have in common is they're all incredibly stupid which is a characteristic impossible to overcome. The sad (at least from perspective) fact is that there were relatively conservative primary candidates in all three primaries who would have won the general election but extreme social conservatives were able to motivate there members to get to the polls. Unfortunately, that's the nature of primary elections.
 
#53
#53
volinbham said:
Rand Paul isn't a social conservative (for one example).

I'd have to look race by race to see if your TP supports as social conservative over a fiscal conservative but I can't think of examples where this is true.

It is like from a candidate standpoint that fiscal conservatives are also likely to be social conservatives but that doesn't mean that is why they win the backing of the TP - my bet is that most cases see the TP choosing the candidate they see as most fiscally conservative (the primary concern) if they are socially conservative then so be it.

If the TP supported Mike Huckabee over say a Chris Christie then I might agree that social conservatism has over taken fiscal conservatism in the TP.
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I wonder about that. I kinda think he is. Not hardcore, but I think he is.
 
#54
#54
volinbham said:
Rand Paul isn't a social conservative (for one example).

I'd have to look race by race to see if your TP supports as social conservative over a fiscal conservative but I can't think of examples where this is true.

It is like from a candidate standpoint that fiscal conservatives are also likely to be social conservatives but that doesn't mean that is why they win the backing of the TP - my bet is that most cases see the TP choosing the candidate they see as most fiscally conservative (the primary concern) if they are socially conservative then so be it.

If the TP supported Mike Huckabee over say a Chris Christie then I might agree that social conservatism has over taken fiscal conservatism in the TP.
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That is a good one. I would normally give a pass to Libertarians but he does identify himself with the Tea Party. Kinda a chicken or the egg argument though.

There are a lot of elections where it happens on the local and state level. There will be a couple conservatives and the Tea Party backs the most social conservative.

Difference of perspective I guess.
 
#55
#55
Redstater said:
In the 2010 elections, Angle in Nevada and O'Donnell in Delaware cost the Rs control of the senate. Akin might keep the Ds in control of the senate in 2012. What all three have in common is they're all incredibly stupid which is a characteristic impossible to overcome. The sad (at least from perspective) fact is that there were relatively conservative primary candidates in all three primaries who would have won the general election but extreme social conservatives were able to motivate there members to get to the polls. Unfortunately, that's the nature of primary elections.
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The crazy thing is that the Dems helped get Angle and Akin elected in the primary.

I think it was a combo effect of some social conservatives and lots of Dem monies attacking the other R candidates to get the preferable general election candidate.

Akin never had much main stream conservative support.

The claims that O'Donnell, Angle and Akin represent some major split between the TP and the GOP and/or conservatives is simply ridiculous and contrived theater.
 
#56
#56
n_huffhines said:
I wonder about that. I kinda think he is. Not hardcore, but I think he is.
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Rand Paul is a social conservative? Compared to the other R candidate for KY senate that he beat in the primary?

You guys are smoking crack rock.

If anything, the TP made the GOP focus less on social conservatism and more on fiscal conservatism - to claim the TP is a hotbed of social conservatism is lunacy.

LG claiming that the FRC is a TP group is even more lunacy.
 
#57
#57
volinbham said:
Rand Paul is a social conservative? Compared to the other R candidate for KY senate that he beat in the primary?

You guys are smoking crack rock.

If anything, the TP made the GOP focus less on social conservatism and more on fiscal conservatism - to claim the TP is a hotbed of social conservatism is lunacy.

LG claiming that the FRC is a TP group is even more lunacy.
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I'd agree with this at their conception and during the mid-terms. Now, not so much.
 
#58
#58
PKT_VOL said:
I'd agree with this at their conception and during the mid-terms. Now, not so much.
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Again I ask for your evidence - all I've seen is a supposed list of social cons they supported over fiscal cons. Give me specifics and I might be swayed.

For the record I am not a social con or a TP member. I just think it's fantasy to claim that the TP has suddenly become overrun with social cons.
 
#59
#59
volinbham said:
Again I ask for your evidence - all I've seen is a supposed list of social cons they supported over fiscal cons. Give me specifics and I might be swayed.

For the record I am not a social con or a TP member. I just think it's fantasy to claim that the TP has suddenly become overrun with social cons.
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I am too lazy to do the leg work. As you have mentioned, there are lists out there that track this sort of thing.

I think the word "overrun" can be misleading. However, to act as if the tea party nowadays is strictly a fiscal conservative platform is a bit naive in my opinion.

You could ask yourself, on the national stage, why didn't the tea party outright endorse a candidate in the Republican primary for the Presidency? Regardless of how you feel about Ron Paul on a number of issues (I know your not a Paulite), he is by far the most fiscally conservative candidate out of the bunch and has the voting record to back up his rhetoric. The others in the field do not even come close to being as authentic as Paul on fiscal conservatism.

The heart of my point is that if there are two equally fiscal conservatives in a Republican primary, they both have their no new taxes and cut spending drums going, and one happens to be more socially conservative than the other, the tea party is going to back the more socially conservative candidate. You can call it want you want, but the tea party is not strictly fiscal conservative this election cycle as it was in the mid-terms.
 
#60
#60
I think it's worth noting that there isn't a national "Tea Party" per se. While there are national organizations that are affiliated with or support the Tea Party, these same organizations do not necessarily represent the Tea Party platforms in the same sense that the RNC and DNC represent Republicans and Democrats repspectivley.

As I understand it, TP chapters share fiscal conservatism as a common goal, but beyond that the chapters may have additional emphases based on their districts.
 
#61
#61
dreVol said:
I think it's worth noting that there isn't a national "Tea Party" per se. While there are national organizations that are affiliated with or support the Tea Party, these same organizations do not necessarily represent the Tea Party platforms in the same sense that the RNC and DNC represent Republicans and Democrats repspectivley.

As I understand it, TP chapters share fiscal conservatism as a common goal, but beyond that the chapters may have additional emphases based on their districts.
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They share that as their ANNOUNCED goal, I would agree. But if you look at the rallies and who speaks and what gets said, there is more often than not at least some significant message about values-based political positions.

Sarah Palin, by some accounts a key TP leader and icon, is decidedly a social conservative and gets big cheers at TP events when she talks about her social issues positions.

I am not buying into the notion that simple fiscal conservatism is their singular goal. I think that is a bit of a ruse.
 
#63
#63
Mods should just change the title to "LG's wouldn't this be neat thread" or "LG's wishful thinking thread" or.......
 
#64
#64
BigPapaVol said:
LG knows dramatically more about the TP than I do.
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TNGlen said:
Mods should just change the title to "LG's wouldn't this be neat thread" or "LG's wishful thinking thread" or.......
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Orly1.jpg



A recent poll shows that 81 % of the TP self-identify as Christian, and almost half say they are a member of the religious right. 63 % say abortion should be illegal. Just 18 % say gay marriage should be allowed.

Tea Party mostly Christian, socially conservative | Believe It or Not | a Chron.com blog
 
#65
#65
You should be the white house sexretary.....you speak in circles just like that goofball concarney.
 
#66
#66
LG are you worried that all that illicit activity that you are having with the Georgetown law students that claim they need $3,000 while they are in law school for birth control (for zits, not birth control) will make you a baby daddy if abortion rights are affected?
 
#68
#68
TNGlen said:
LG are you worried that all that illicit activity that you are having with the Georgetown law students that claim they need $3,000 while they are in law school for birth control (for zits, not birth control) will make you a baby daddy if abortion rights are affected?
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Huh?
 
#69
#69
PKT_VOL said:
I think the word "overrun" can be misleading. However, to act as if the tea party nowadays is strictly a fiscal conservative platform is a bit naive in my opinion.
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You've been ready too many of LG's posts. No one here (particularly me) has suggested it is a strictly fiscal conservative group. I even specifically said that social conservative issues have infiltrated the TP to some extent.

When I see the FRC trotted out as a mouthpiece for or incarnation of the TP though I've have to call BS.
 
#70
#70
lawgator1 said:
Sarah Palin, by some accounts a key TP leader and icon, is decidedly a social conservative and gets big cheers at TP events when she talks about her social issues positions.

I am not buying into the notion that simple fiscal conservatism is their singular goal. I think that is a bit of a ruse.
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Interesting that Sarah Palin has called for Akin to get out of the race - kinda puts a damper on that TP revolt notion.

As I answered PKT - no one has claimed fiscal conservatism is the singular goal; another strawman. Plenty have suggested that TP is not fully overrun by social conservatives or sc ideals.
 
#71
#71
volinbham said:
Interesting that Sarah Palin has called for Akin to get out of the race - kinda puts a damper on that TP revolt notion.

As I answered PKT - no one has claimed fiscal conservatism is the singular goal; another strawman. Plenty have suggested that TP is not fully overrun by social conservatives or sc ideals.
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I submit she wants him out so that the GOP has a better chance of winning the Senate than that she felt the need to bash him for the weirdness.

While I suspect that she would have to sit down for an hour or two at a desk with paper and crayons to figure out how many is a majority out of 100, I imagine someone on her staff boiled the math down for her.
 
#72
#72
#73
#73
lawgator1 said:
The divide over this is worsening for the GOP as the Convention approaches. Key GOP conservative leaders are blasting the institutional leadership for abandoning Akin after his remarks. Some very strong language here, lots of accusations. This is going to get talked about a lot amongst the convention coverage.



Conservative Christians rally around Akin in face of GOP criticism – CNN Belief Blog - CNN.com Blogs
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What a load of crap. Key leaders made me laugh.
 
#74
#74
Two new points.

First, Huckabee has written an email absolutely trashing the party leadership on calling for Akin to withdraw. Incendiary. Will link later when I can. And he was your second place finisher in 2008 and is one of the leaders of the religious wing of the GOP. In fact, I'd say he is THE leader of the religious component of the party.

You going to slough that off BPV?

Second, Romney is now making it a condition of giving an interview that he will not talk about Akin or abortion. Wow.

Coming just before the convention, this is a huge story, especially given the gap Romney has with women voters versus Obama.
 
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