The Culture War That The Rightwingers Are Trying To Lose

#26
#26
KB5252 said:
Would legalizing meth really be a good idea though? I agree with weed and prostitution etc, but meth and heroin etc are so harmful and destructive. But i can't get behind that.
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Destruction and harm are factors in personal freedom?
 
#28
#28
DinkinFlicka said:
Destruction and harm are factors in personal freedom?
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I understand the point but there is a line. For example you can't build and detonate most explosive devices, even on your land.

The destruction and harm are not just inflicted on those who use but family, friends and society in general. Should your personal freedom trump the rights and freedom of those around you? I think that is the question here, where do you draw the line? For what it's worth the line as drawn currently is flawed and needs to be adjusted but we don't need to overcorrect. JMO though.
 
#29
#29
KB5252 said:
I understand the point but there is a line. For example you can't build and detonate most explosive devices, even on your land.

The destruction and harm are not just inflicted on those who use but family, friends and society in general. Should your personal freedom trump the rights and freedom of those around you? I think that is the question here, where do you draw the line? For what it's worth the line as drawn currently is flawed and needs to be adjusted but we don't need to overcorrect. JMO though.
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With that precise line of logic in terms of intoxicants, do you believe alcohol should be illegal?
 
#34
#34
DinkinFlicka said:
Oh, is there a method of measurement? If so, where is the line drawn?

I'm genuinely curious.
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Do you know anyone who has struggled with addiction to heroin? Or know someone who overdosed? Left their family, tore it apart and let their youngest daughter find them cold and dead in the house they share?

I've known plenty of alcoholics, even been one myself in a former life. But what I've witnessed heroin do to people is far worse alcohol abuse. Both can be destructive but there aren't many "casual" heroin users.
 
#35
#35
#36
#36
NEO said:
I don't have a single friend in TN who doesnt vote republican. I also dont have a single friend who doesnt smoke weed. This is stupid and really out of touch.
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I checked out his donors and unsurprisingly his top donors are private prisons and Jack Daniels (although on paper it’s not that much $2500). We have to quit taking politicians stated reasons for action as the intended reason and accept as a rule that action is determined by personal gain alone. They deserve no benefit of doubt.
 
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#37
#37
KB5252 said:
Do you know anyone who has struggled with addiction to heroin? Or know someone who overdosed? Left their family, tore it apart and let their youngest daughter find them cold and dead in the house they share?

I've known plenty of alcoholics, even been one myself in a former life. But what I've witnessed heroin do to people is far worse alcohol abuse. Both can be destructive but there aren't many "casual" heroin users.
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Yes, I have. I know the smell of a body that's choked on their own vomit just before *****ing themselves and being left undiscovered for hours.

Can still easily say booze has had a more negative effect on society than smack. It's a much more acutely acquired taste than booze that draws in a group of users that are often already neck deep in a bevy of other vices and addictions. However, I'm not going to sit here and wax poetic on the esoteric nature of substance abuse, because at the end of the day I believe peiple deserve the agency to make decisions that physically affect themselves, for better or worse.

The argument that decriminalization or legalization will result in a surge of new users has been effectively proven false several times in the last few decades.
 
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#40
#40
The GOP has put itself between a rock and a hard place. It is reliant on a demographic which is simultaneously shrinking in size buy also more strident in its demand that its political position be maintained.

The GOP has done a good job of stacking the deck at the state legislature level but the numbers don't lie. Sooner than later even that advantage will slip away from them
 
#41
#41
DinkinFlicka said:
Yes, I have. I know the smell of a body that's choked on their own vomit just before *****ing themselves and being left undiscovered for hours.

Can still easily say booze has had a more negative effect on society than smack. It's a much more acutely acquired taste than booze that draws in a group of users that are often already neck deep in a bevy of other vices and addictions. However, I'm not going to sit here and wax poetic on the esoteric nature of substance abuse, because at the end of the day I believe peiple deserve the agency to make decisions that physically affect themselves, for better or worse.

The argument that decriminalization or legalization will result in a surge of new users has been effectively proven false several times in the last few decades.
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I don't think it will create more users are a rule, just give those users the ability to cause more destruction in their lives and those around them.

My dislike of harder drugs like meth and heroin is a personal one. I agree that as an aggregate alcohol is more destructive due to the sheer number of users but heroin is much more destructive. There are plenty of functioning alcoholics, heroin users typically don't function very long before addiction consumes them.

I'm not attempting to wax poetic just want to make sure that first hit of heroin is as difficult to get a possible, because unfortunately that's all it takes for way too many.
 
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#42
#42
DinkinFlicka said:
Yes, I have. I know the smell of a body that's choked on their own vomit just before *****ing themselves and being left undiscovered for hours.

Can still easily say booze has had a more negative effect on society than smack. It's a much more acutely acquired taste than booze that draws in a group of users that are often already neck deep in a bevy of other vices and addictions. However, I'm not going to sit here and wax poetic on the esoteric nature of substance abuse, because at the end of the day I believe peiple deserve the agency to make decisions that physically affect themselves, for better or worse.

The argument that decriminalization or legalization will result in a surge of new users has been effectively proven false several times in the last few decades.
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I don't necessarily agree with your stance here but you wording was impressive. You dont see the word esoteric used often.
 
#43
#43
KB5252 said:
I don't think it will create more users are a rule, just give those users the ability to cause more destruction in their lives and those around them.

My dislike of harder drugs like meth and heroin is a personal one. I agree that as an aggregate alcohol is more destructive due to the sheer number of users but heroin is much more destructive. There are plenty of functioning alcoholics, heroin users typically don't function very long before addiction consumes them.

I'm not attempting to wax poetic just want to make sure that first hit of heroin is as difficult to get a possible, because unfortunately that's all it takes for way too many.
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How would legalization give them more opportunity to cause destruction? It's still illegal to steal. It's still illegal to be under the influence in public. It's still illegal to drive.

You should look into Portugal's drug laws and their effects before attempting to posit any further arguments.on this subject.
 
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#44
#44
DinkinFlicka said:
How would legalization give them more opportunity to cause destruction? It's still illegal to steal. It's still illegal to be under the influence in public. It's still illegal to drive.

You should look into Portugal's drug laws and their effects before attempting to posit any further arguments.on this subject.
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I don't really have a dog in this fight but thought I'd share this tidbit. Ozzy Osbourne said it was harder to quit cigarettes than heroin because they were so easy to get.
 
#46
#46
midnight orange said:
I checked out his donors and unsurprisingly his top donors are private prisons and Jack Daniels (although on paper it’s not that much $2500). We have to quit taking politicians stated reasons for action as the intended reason and accept as a rule that action is determined by personal gain alone. They deserve no benefit of doubt.
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That shouldn't even be a thing.
 
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#48
#48
DinkinFlicka said:
Yep. Was definitely referring to weed.

I guarantee at least 1 in every 5 friends you have tokes and doesn't say sh*t about it.
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Reread my post again.

All my friends in TN smoke weed.

Well 2 dont. One is a doctor and the other is in chemicals and both get drug tested.

But the rest are either business owners or executives and smoke daily.
 
#49
#49
NEO said:
Reread my post again.

All my friends in TN smoke weed.

Well 2 dont. One is a doctor and the other is in chemicals and both get drug tested.

But the rest are either business owners or executives and smoke daily.
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Whoops!

Well, if it's any consolation, I was probably stoned when I wrote that.
 
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