The End of Democracy in America, If you can’t win by the rules then change them!

#27
#27
BigPapaVol said:
First and foremost, exit polling data is absolutely worthless. Second, the majority of Americans no more believe in cutting and running than Teddy Roosevelt would. Withdrawing some or all troops as a question to a voter is just stupid. Think about the quality of the question, then remember the fact that it doesn't allow a qualifying response, just a yes or no. Change in the handling of Iraq and lower troop levels, I'll grant you, but leaving a disaster in Iraq, nobody wants.

The real driver in that election was the lack of Republican turnout, which was a referendum on Bush being an incompetent CINC and his utter inability to grasp that his constituents want controls on spending.
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at least we agree on one thing.
 
#29
#29
Pelosi is just finding our how it is when a woman tries to run a house that is dominated by men. When she finally decides that the house is made up of two parties and not just flaming liberal democrats, she will do a better job.
 
#30
#30
thank goodness bush is the bi-partisan chap that he is! Hell, he won't even listen to his own party with regard to Iraq, how can we expect him to work with the House?
 
#33
#33
CSpindizzy said:
Actually voters who call themselves Republicans did turn out. There was no huge drop-off in GOP turnout.

Exit polls are not absolutely worthless. They are good indicators of the mood of the voters. Show me some scientific evidence that backs up your claim that they are worthless.

I hate to tell you this but there is already disaster there. there are already terrorists there. Al Qaeda already has a foothold there. Sectarian warfare is already there. So all of the threats on what will happen if we leave are absolutely worthless. If 160K US forces cannot prop up the security of the country can we rely on staying there with that same number for years HOPING the Iraqis will step up? Because right now all we're relying on is hope. And when you rely on HOPE to win, you have crappy odds to say the least.
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Republican turnout was clearly down and many of those actually arriving voted against the GOP, but it was over inability to control spending moreso than it was about Iraq.

Exit polls can be 100% skewed by simply asking poorly formulated questions and asking them in precincts where the responses are predictable. I don't need scientific anything. Exit polling is a self-fulfilling business. I, no professional poller here, can construct a set of questions to make the answer anything I'd like. That is the non-scientific reason that exit polling is worthless. You cannot ask people questions that allow for reasoned response because they won't take the time to respond. So we end up with squadoosh for data. One thing the polls do well is identify voting trends, but there's no need for that since we'll be counting the votes immediately upon closing the polls.

I'm not disagreeing that it's a disaster in Iraq, but leaving it this way is not a viable option. We are going to have a long term presence in Iraq much like we did in Germany and we need to become accustomed to that.
 
#34
#34
On the original issue - is it any surprise that Pelosi who promised to bring accountability and bi-partisanship to the House is doing neither?
 
#35
#35
I guess Ms. Pelosi forgot about this:

Pelosi's document, which she vows to honor if Democrats regain the majority, says: "Too often, incivility and the heavy hand of the majority" have silenced Democrats and choked off "thoughtful debate." She called on the majority to let the minority offer meaningful amendments and substitutes to important bills; to limit roll-call votes to the normal 15 minutes rather than keeping them open to round up needed votes; and to let all appointees to House-Senate conference committees participate in meetings and decisions.


"When we are shut out, they are shutting out the great diversity of America," Pelosi said in an interview. "We want a return to civility; we want to set a higher standard."
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washingtonpost.com: Pelosi Seeks House Minority 'Bill of Rights'
 
#37
#37
BigPapaVol said:
Republican turnout was clearly down and many of those actually arriving voted against the GOP, but it was over inability to control spending moreso than it was about Iraq.

Exit polls can be 100% skewed by simply asking poorly formulated questions and asking them in precincts where the responses are predictable. I don't need scientific anything. Exit polling is a self-fulfilling business. I, no professional poller here, can construct a set of questions to make the answer anything I'd like. That is the non-scientific reason that exit polling is worthless. You cannot ask people questions that allow for reasoned response because they won't take the time to respond. So we end up with squadoosh for data. One thing the polls do well is identify voting trends, but there's no need for that since we'll be counting the votes immediately upon closing the polls.

I'm not disagreeing that it's a disaster in Iraq, but leaving it this way is not a viable option. We are going to have a long term presence in Iraq much like we did in Germany and we need to become accustomed to that.
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It wasn't due to low gop turnout the largest reason for their defeat was that 7 out of ten self described independents broke Dem and that is a fact and any party that gets 70% of the independent vote will win regardless.
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#42
#42
I'm pretty sure you already know but just in case, I was referring to Bush..
 
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