The Endzone Garden Thread

#2,001
#2,001
SlipKidVol said:
I usually buy my tomatoes and cucumber plants at Crabtree Farms in Chattanooga, but this year I'm starting seeds. I need suggestions for best place to purchase seeds online (or local)
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--if you buy from a retail outlet, be sure to check the bottom of the back of the packet for the "sell by" date. They should now be showing 12/2023 (not 2022.) Seeds don't automatically expire in a year (although some do), but retail establishments should have pulled last year's seeds.
 
#2,004
#2,004
SlipKidVol said:
I usually buy my tomatoes and cucumber plants at Crabtree Farms in Chattanooga, but this year I'm starting seeds. I need suggestions for best place to purchase seeds online (or local)
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Online:
Baker Creek (Rareseeds.com)
Victoryseeds.com
tomatofest.com
johnnyseeds.com
Gurney's
True Leaf Mkt
 
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#2,005
#2,005
82_VOL_83 said:
@VolNExile I've been drooling over my Johnny's seed catalog.

One thing I noticed is that a lot of their stuff are their own hybrids.
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Geez, if you drool over Johnny's, you'd probably do unspeakable things looking at Baker Creek's catalog. Should order you one. Could spice up the bedroom.


But, yes, you are right about Johnny's. They do alot of they're own hybrids, or they contract from someone to sell them a seed they don't have, and they grow it out for a cople years to build the seed up before they sell it. If it passes their trials, they will market it, pay the seed provider a fee, and make them sign an exclusive so it don't end up down at another seed company. But, their seed is dependable. It's the only place my step son buys his stuff. But, he is in Ag & seed trials/sales, so he is more dialed in to a place like Johnny's, where I prefer more heritage items like Baker Creek and Victory.
 
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#2,006
#2,006
VolNExile said:
You'll get lots of recommendations, all very personalized.

Have fun seed-starting! I'm about to dust off the lights and the heat mats myself. Note: for tomatoes (and peppers and other high-summer heat-lovers), start seeds on heat and keep the seedlings on heat, or they'll just sit there and look at you. Start your cukes in peat pots or other biodegradable containers - their roots are delicate, and they "resent" transplanting from a hard-sided plastic seed tray.

I order mostly from:
Sow True Seeds (local peeps)
Botanical Interests (best seed packets for information, hands down)
Johnny's Selected Seeds (pricey but great quality and variety - they grow for the market garden industry, so if all you want of a particular variety is one seed packet, order early, or you'll have to wait until they've filled orders from commercial growers. Unless you want 500 vines of the same tomato plant,etc.)
Baker Creek Rare Heirloom Seeds (free shipping! wide range of heirloom plant seeds)

When I can't find a particular seed I'm looking for from the first four, I order from:
Totally Tomatoes (not my first go-to, but they carry quite a variety, and I've found seeds there that I couldn't find elsewhere)
Urban Farmer (ordered from them for the first time this year - nice selection, great customer service, but you really have to smack them down to keep them from emailing you to death)

edited to clean up the comment on ordering from Johnny's
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the trick to Johnny's is to order everything in the off-season. I ordered everything I intended to order from Johnny's back in the fall. Great list. Baker Creek is my go to. They are tops on everything. Selection, service, delivery, free shipping....and they always throw in a pack of free seed on orders over like $12-15. If you like them, I'd also reccommend taking a look at Victory Seed. I haven't tried Totally Tomato, but Tomatofest is my back-up when I can't find something. THey have dang near every tomato on the planet. They just cost more, and charge $8 shipping.
 
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#2,007
#2,007
GVF said:
the trick to Johnny's is to order everything in the off-season. I ordered everything I intended to order from Johnny's back in the fall. Great list. Baker Creek is my go to. They are tops on everything. Selection, service, delivery, free shipping....and they always throw in a pack of free seed on orders over like $12-15. If you like them, I'd also reccommend taking a look at Victory Seed. I haven't tried Totally Tomato, but Tomatofest is my back-up when I can't find something. THey have dang near every tomato on the planet. They just cost more, and charge $8 shipping.
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Do you remember which month you ordered from Johnny’s? I ordered mid-December. I wanted to be sure to get this year’s seeds. I was afraid that if I ordered in October or so, I’d get 2022 seeds. (I try to spread a packet over three seasons, so the fresher, the better.)
 
#2,008
#2,008
GVF said:
Geez, if you drool over Johnny's, you'd probably do unspeakable things looking at Baker Creek's catalog. Should order you one. Could spice up the bedroom.


But, yes, you are right about Johnny's. They do alot of they're own hybrids, or they contract from someone to sell them a seed they don't have, and they grow it out for a cople years to build the seed up before they sell it. If it passes their trials, they will market it, pay the seed provider a fee, and make them sign an exclusive so it don't end up down at another seed company. But, their seed is dependable. It's the only place my step son buys his stuff. But, he is in Ag & seed trials/sales, so he is more dialed in to a place like Johnny's, where I prefer more heritage items like Baker Creek and Victory.
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Oh yes, I have the Baker’s Creek too! Gotta spice things up sometimes. 😉
 
#2,009
#2,009
VolNExile said:
Do you remember which month you ordered from Johnny’s? I ordered mid-December. I wanted to be sure to get this year’s seeds. I was afraid that if I ordered in October or so, I’d get 2022 seeds. (I try to spread a packet over three seasons, so the fresher, the better.)
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I ordered one squash in November, and one one in early december.
 
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#2,011
#2,011
VolNExile said:
Are they this year’s seeds? I’m being so curious because I like planning ahead. (Planning is half the fun! Then comes all the real work.)
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I forgot to check the dates at lunch, but I'll look and report back. Being that late in the year, I'd say prob seeds set to expire 2023. I suppose they could just as easily be 2022 expirees. In my quest for growing most, if not all from seed, I haven't had an bad luck planting seed from packs I've had for 2-3 years. That's FDA stuff on date labelling. I've had seeds from our green beans for several years at a time and they pop right up. THe only thing the last 2-3 years I buy plants instead is herbs. And I still mix that. If the herb seeds don't come up well, I go grab some plants.

I planted yellow squash from seed packets 3 years old and got plenty of squash. And 100% germination.
 
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#2,012
#2,012
I used to think seeds need to be frozen to keep very long.
The squash I planted last year were from 2017, I think. They did fine.
 
#2,013
#2,013
GVF said:
I forgot to check the dates at lunch, but I'll look and report back. Being that late in the year, I'd say prob seeds set to expire 2023. I suppose they could just as easily be 2022 expirees. In my quest for growing most, if not all from seed, I haven't had an bad luck planting seed from packs I've had for 2-3 years. That's FDA stuff on date labelling. I've had seeds from our green beans for several years at a time and they pop right up. THe only thing the last 2-3 years I buy plants instead is herbs. And I still mix that. If the herb seeds don't come up well, I go grab some plants.

I planted yellow squash from seed packets 3 years old and got plenty of squash. And 100% germination.
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Here in upper east TN once the temperature is right, basil from seeds will grow like crazy. We decided last year not to buy basil plants.

The sage and cilantro do very well from seed, also.

Once dill reseeds, it becomes a pestilence hahahaha I wish it transplanted better.
 
#2,014
#2,014
GordonC said:
Here in upper east TN once the temperature is right, basil from seeds will grow like crazy. We decided last year not to buy basil plants.

The sage and cilantro do very well from seed, also.

Once dill reseeds, it becomes a pestilence hahahaha I wish it transplanted better.
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Have never successfully grown a cilantro plant. Can't do it.
 
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#2,016
#2,016
GordonC said:
I used to think seeds need to be frozen to keep very long.
The squash I planted last year were from 2017, I think. They did fine.
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It helps to keeps seed in the freezer. Think humidity fluctuations are better controlled in the freezer. I do keep the family green bean seeds in the freezer, but all my others are in a box in the cabinet. If seeds truly "expired" how do they bring back long lost cultivars when they find a lone pack of seeds somewhere in Europe or Japan?
 
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#2,017
#2,017
GordonC said:
They're pretty easy to grow here (east Tennessee). Where are you?
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Cookeville. But couldn't grow them in GA either. I've just never had success.

Dill would be my #2. It's a little more finicky. I've had Dill start well but fizzle out and get really wispy. Maybe I just didn't keep it topped off well.
 
#2,018
#2,018
GVF said:
It helps to keeps seed in the freezer. Think humidity fluctuations are better controlled in the freezer. I do keep the family green bean seeds in the freezer, but all my others are in a box in the cabinet. If seeds truly "expired" how do they bring back long lost cultivars when they find a lone pack of seeds somewhere in Europe or Japan?
Click to expand...
Goodness, what a lot of responses.

Two things behind my thinking: (1) companies shouldn’t sell last year’s seed at this year’s prices. The date is on the label. (2) Many seeds last a good long while. Others barely a year or two. (I keep seeing sweet corn listed in that category.) But all eventually display lowered germination rates. So maybe you’ll have 90-95% the first year or two, then 80%, then 65% and do one. I don’t have anything approaching a decent-sized plot of land for growing and canning a ton of vegetables, so I only plant part of the packet and stretch it. I’d like year 3 or year 4 to still have a good enough germ rate that I’ll have enough health seedlings to transplant, allowing for some losses.

But mainly it’s (1). 🤪
 
#2,019
#2,019
VolNExile said:
Goodness, what a lot of responses.

Two things behind my thinking: (1) companies shouldn’t sell last year’s seed at this year’s prices. The date is on the label. (2) Many seeds last a good long while. Others barely a year or two. (I keep seeing sweet corn listed in that category.) But all eventually display lowered germination rates. So maybe you’ll have 90-95% the first year or two, then 80%, then 65% and do one. I don’t have anything approaching a decent-sized plot of land for growing and canning a ton of vegetables, so I only plant part of the packet and stretch it. I’d like year 3 or year 4 to still have a good enough germ rate that I’ll have enough health seedlings to transplant, allowing for some losses.

But mainly it’s (1). 🤪
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I concur. If you date it, then discount it. Expecially Johnny's. they charge more to begin with.

Maybe that's true on the sweeter variety corns. But, my non-chemistry mind can't explain why a dried corn, ar any dried seed, won't keep. Thought that was the whole point of drying and saving seed.
 
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#2,021
#2,021
82_VOL_83 said:
Me either. Either too wet or too hot or too dry. Can't figure it out.
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I don't lose sleep over the cilantro. I've just quit trying. But, I always have good luck with my basil. Can grow it like wild fire. And have to have it with my fresh tomatoes. And I plant it amongst my tomatoes anyway for pest control. Put enough basil and marigold around your tomatoes and you won't have any pests on them at all.
 
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#2,022
#2,022
The cilantro are not very heat tolerant, based on my experience.
Mine get probably four hours of direct morning sun during the summer. That's all they get.
I give them some water every other day.
Same with the dill, but the dill reseed everywhere. And on the back side of my garage, they grow pretty quickly and take over.
Sometimes the cilantro will reseed if I just leave it alone.
 
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