The Gardening Thread

[zhangliao04]

Gourmet Garlic Gardens if you want a deep dive. They are no longer in business but there is a wealth of knowledge on their website. You will want to wait for fall as most specialty growers ship around Oct.

I noticed the fall shipping part last year when I initially looked into it. I decided against planting them last year since my plans for creating a raised bed got ruined. This year I’m going to look into it again. They seem pretty easy to grow. Keep a lot of organic and have good drainage seems to be the key.

 

[GVF]

I have a couple of questions for those who have tried these methods.

1) I have nothing but hard Tennessee red clay in my back and front yard. I’ve seen some in here say they would till theirs with compost and good dirt for a couple years to get it to where it was good enough to grow things in. What are peoples opinion on a raised garden bed? I’ve heard good things about raised beds but would like to hear from you all. I was thinking of doing a 50/50 blend of mushroom compost and top soil. Thoughts?

2) Making your own compost. Is it worth it? Also, how bad does the smell usually get? I have no leaves so all of my green parts would come from grass clippings.

My brother converted his garden to raised beds, except for his corn and a couple other veggies. Green beans, Tomatoes, Squash, Peppers, etc., all rasied beds now. He did it quite cheaply. Leftover hardi-plank siding form renovating house. His garden blows mine away in production. Made 2 arched arbors about 15 feet long out of pvc and field wire. Put a raised planter at the base of the four sides. That's for his green beans. He quits picking when he gets up around 70 jars canned.

 

[GVF]

I never heard of using wood until 20-30 years ago. People just hilled up rows, and understood the benefits of those raised beds. Seems like gardens used to be larger too. ?Smaller yards, less free time, kids after school activities, fast food? Things change.

The framing was a marketing ploy to create new sales for an old trick. My dad always mounded up the squash and melon plants. And the bean rows. It also required less watering as the "valleys" would retain the rain water instead of running off.

 

[GVF]

Tell me about “other Italian peppers”! I grew Jimmy Nardellos last year.

Not Italian, but I like making my own hot peeper sauce, so in the past I grew Cayenne, Jalapeno, and hot cherry. Those 3, I thought, made the most flavorful pepper sauce.

A little off topic but if you enjoy making things to can may I suggest:

-Summer Squash Relish (Recipe calls for yellow, but I added some Zuchinni and red bell for color) Superb Relish.
-Bread and Butter Pickles. My mom made the best. I thought it was a secret, and when we wanted to make them she whipped out a recipe she tore from a magazine many, many moons ago.
-If anyone has a sure fire pickled okra recipe, post it. I love fried okra and tomatoes, but for first time in my 56 years just put a pickled okra in my mouth. Boiled okra kept me from trying this tasty little secret.

 

[Go aeiou]

Not Italian, but I like making my own hot peeper sauce, so in the past I grew Cayenne, Jalapeno, and hot cherry. Those 3, I thought, made the most flavorful pepper sauce.

A little off topic but if you enjoy making things to can may I suggest:

-Summer Squash Relish (Recipe calls for yellow, but I added some Zuchinni and red bell for color) Superb Relish.
-Bread and Butter Pickles. My mom made the best. I thought it was a secret, and when we wanted to make them she whipped out a recipe she tore from a magazine many, many moons ago.
-If anyone has a sure fire pickled okra recipe, post it. I love fried okra and tomatoes, but for first time in my 56 years just put a pickled okra in my mouth. Boiled okra kept me from trying this tasty little secret.

Yeah, if you want good recipes get a cookbook that is at least 50 years old, and not an updated version of a 50 YO cookbook.

 

[GVF]

Yeah, if you want good recipes get a cookbook that is at least 50 years old, and not an updated version of a 50 YO cookbook.

Both parents have passed. I'd like to raid my mom's kitchen for her old recipe boxes and books. there was one from when I was a young teen that came out in my home town, the Stuffed Griffin. A recipe book assembled and published locally from kitchen masters all over town. Plus mom had the index card recipe box. I'd have to "acquire" them without my sister knowing. She's cray cray to the max and can't cook a decent pot of boiled water.

 

[Go aeiou]

The bell peppers got to be around 14” tall and a couple of them produced well enough, but the peppers were mostly sorta small. The poblanos were late in the season and I only got a 4-5 peppers. They were also on the small side. This year I’d like to try both again, but add some jalapeños in there as well. I hear there is a no-heat jalapeño so I might grab one for my wife (she is sensitive to spicy). I’ve thought about growing pepperoncini as I really like the taste, but can’t seem to find seeds or seedlings.

Another plant is like to learn to grow is garlic. I might try my hand at onions, but I am going to really look into garlic. I love garlic and I hear it is awesome and tastes even better than store bought.

Plant garlic and you should have it forever. I got my Elephant Garlic at the grocery store in the produce section. It is a very mild garlic.

A good source for seed and Garlic. There are people that offer more variety, but Southern Exposure offers seed and plants for the South.
Southern Exposure Seed Exchange, Saving the Past for the Future

 

[walkenvol]

The bell peppers got to be around 14” tall and a couple of them produced well enough, but the peppers were mostly sorta small. The poblanos were late in the season and I only got a 4-5 peppers. They were also on the small side.

My advice would be to focus 100% of your efforts on improving your soil. Go find as many bags of leaves as you can and plant a 6-8” layer of them about 1’ deep, put the soil back and then cover with about a 4” layer on top right now then fork (not till) in the top layer before you plant. Save enough bags to fully cover all the soil in your garden deep 2-3” deep after planting. Add organic fertilizer of your choice and fish heads (if you can find them) under the plants. Repeat steps 2&3 every year. After a few years I’ll bet you can cut way back or eliminate the fertilizer completely as your soil gets healthier. In gardening, I’m convinced it’s 99% about the soil.

 

[Tin Man]

In gardening, I’m convinced it’s 99% about the soil.

Amen, and pass the pickled okra.

 

[Tin Man]

For composting, I have a dark 30-gallon trash can with spaced holes drilled into it. Vegetable scraps from the kitchen, Fall leaves, and the stuff cleaned from the underside of my lawnmower deck go into it. It gets moved around. The contents are regularly turned with a pitchfork and moistened when needed. It's not unsightly, suits my situation, and produces compost for me every year.

My current vegetable garden is on a gently sloped part of my property. I've used staked cinder block caps to define and allow me to level the bed. Ten years of adding homemade compost has improved my soil. I continue to add compost every year. I've amended my soil with pelletized lime and the occasional sprinkling of 10-10-10, but my intent is to grow vegetables organically.

 

[Tin Man]

In Winter, I start peppers and tomatoes from seed in the sunny windows of the south-facing rooms of my house. These go into the garden in late April / early May, depending upon the weather patterns of each Spring.

 

[zhangliao04]

My advice would be to focus 100% of your efforts on improving your soil. Go find as many bags of leaves as you can and plant a 6-8” layer of them about 1’ deep, put the soil back and then cover with about a 4” layer on top right now then fork (not till) in the top layer before you plant. Save enough bags to fully cover all the soil in your garden deep 2-3” deep after planting. Add organic fertilizer of your choice and fish heads (if you can find them) under the plants. Repeat steps 2&3 every year. After a few years I’ll bet you can cut way back or eliminate the fertilizer completely as your soil gets healthier. In gardening, I’m convinced it’s 99% about the soil.

I couldn’t agree with you more about it being the soil. The problem with my yard is that it is such a hard clay I would need to rent a machine to get it to loosen enough so that I could pack it with the leaves. Another problem is I don’t have leaves. The neighborhood is new and there are no trees in any of the yards that have grown enough to produce enough leaves. That’s why I was thinking about doing the raised bed.

Are grass cuttings good for raised beds? I can imagine the weeds being produced from that, though.

 

[zhangliao04]

Plant garlic and you should have it forever. I got my Elephant Garlic at the grocery store in the produce section. It is a very mild garlic.

A good source for seed and Garlic. There are people that offer more variety, but Southern Exposure offers seed and plants for the South.
Southern Exposure Seed Exchange, Saving the Past for the Future

Inchelium Red’s are the ones I am looking at. I am also going to look at the peppers they have and see if there are any my wife and I would like to grow. I’ve thought about onions as well. The zucchini I tried this year didn’t really grow and I also had issues with the zucchini bug. They tore through my zucchini plants.

 

[Go aeiou]

I couldn’t agree with you more about it being the soil. The problem with my yard is that it is such a hard clay I would need to rent a machine to get it to loosen enough so that I could pack it with the leaves. Another problem is I don’t have leaves. The neighborhood is new and there are no trees in any of the yards that have grown enough to produce enough leaves. That’s why I was thinking about doing the raised bed.

Are grass cuttings good for raised beds? I can imagine the weeds being produced from that, though.

Use a spade or shovel(not a tiller) and dig the area for your beds 6-12'' deep. The red clay should be moist now, and you should be able to use those tools. Your red clay soil should be worked into your beds. Usually about 50/50 with organic matter. This year I would probably buy ''premium'' garden soil and compost from a reputable garden center. Not cheap stuff from a big box store. Well maybe 10-20%cheap stuff.
You should be able to get leaves next fall. Some people in town will put them in bags to be picked up. Maybe your local gov't? If you can find someone who raises rabbits get bags full of manure from them. Yes your grass clippings unless you are using chemicals on your lawn. Pre-emergent and seeds don't work.
You are 100% correct in working on your soil.

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

Plant garlic and you should have it forever. I got my Elephant Garlic at the grocery store in the produce section. It is a very mild garlic.

A good source for seed and Garlic. There are people that offer more variety, but Southern Exposure offers seed and plants for the South.
Southern Exposure Seed Exchange, Saving the Past for the Future

Elephant garlic is so mild I tend to just grill or eat fresh

Use a spade or shovel(not a tiller) and dig the area for your beds 6-12'' deep. The red clay should be moist now, and you should be able to use those tools. Your red clay soil should be worked into your beds. Usually about 50/50 with organic matter. This year I would probably buy ''premium'' garden soil and compost from a reputable garden center. Not cheap stuff from a big box store. Well maybe 10-20%cheap stuff.
You should be able to get leaves next fall. Some people in town will put them in bags to be picked up. Maybe your local gov't? If you can find someone who raises rabbits get bags full of manure from them. Yes your grass clippings unless you are using chemicals on your lawn. Pre-emergent and seeds don't work.
You are 100% correct in working on your soil.

Speaking of rabbits, sometimes you can get big bags of alfalfa very cheap. It makes for a great fertilizer / soil additive.

 

[Go aeiou]

Elephant garlic is so mild I tend to just grill or eat fresh

Speaking of rabbits, sometimes you can get big bags of alfalfa very cheap. It makes for a great fertilizer / soil additive.

I got a big bag of something at the farm supply store at exit 81 on I-75 about 15 years ago. Out of business now? I think it was alfalfa. I added that to mushroom compost that got from Loudon. Also the existing soil. first year in a new house, and too much nitrogen in my beds. The tomato leaves looked great.

 

[VolNExile]

I got a big bag of something at the farm supply store at exit 81 on I-75 about 15 years ago. Out of business now? I think it was alfalfa. I added that to mushroom compost that got from Loudon. Also the existing soil. first year in a new house, and too much nitrogen in my beds. The tomato leaves looked great.

How does Tennessee do soil tests for consumers (rather than farmers)?

Soil tests are free in NC to non-professional growers from April 1 through generally end of November. I’ve got so much soil amendments in my garden though that so areas are way off. We’re (local Extension Master Gardeners) pushing for different target ranges for those who do container gardening, etc.

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

A master gardener? You don't say!


Haha jk, they say it everytime.

 

[VolNExile]

A master gardener? You don't say!


Haha jk, they say it everytime.

Just an intern, lol. I have one more year to get my front yard respectable!

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

Just an intern, lol. I have one more year to get my front yard respectable!

Lots of cool things to grow in NC. You should have no problem. I am personally jealous of some of the bulbs you guys can grow. The soil, rain, climate. It's a great state to be in if you like gardening. I've given thought to moving to Raleigh. Some of the best gardens in the US can be found there.

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

You ought to visit Plant Delights this spring. Talk about a nursery! Tony Avent is a hero of mine.

 

[VolNExile]

Lots of cool things to grow in NC. You should have no problem. I am personally jealous of some of the bulbs you guys can grow. The soil, rain, climate. It's a great state to be in if you like gardening. I've given thought to moving to Raleigh. Some of the best gardens in the US can be found there.

Ah, but the (in)famous WNC heavy grey clay! It’s incredibly fertile, but until you can get the organic matter integrated and the pore spaces open, it’s heavy going.

I do love gardening in 7a, although I’m sad (for a lot of reasons) that we’re no longer 6b. Still hoping to turn the front yard into a cottage garden, once the city determines the extent of the massacre of the hundred year old maples on our street. (The trees are killing the sidewalks, and the sidewalks are killing the trees.)

— I’ll have to check out Plant Delights if I ever get to Raleigh. It sounds great! For most of us 828-ers, Raleigh is just an I-40 Hellmouth that we have to navigate on the way to the Outer Banks.

 

[Go aeiou]

Ah, but the (in)famous WNC heavy grey clay! It’s incredibly fertile, but until you can get the organic matter integrated and the pore spaces open, it’s heavy going.

I do love gardening in 7a, although I’m sad (for a lot of reasons) that we’re no longer 6b. Still hoping to turn the front yard into a cottage garden, once the city determines the extent of the massacre of the hundred year old maples on our street. (The trees are killing the sidewalks, and the sidewalks are killing the trees.)

— I’ll have to check out Plant Delights if I ever get to Raleigh. It sounds great! For most of us 828-ers, Raleigh is just an I-40 Hellmouth that we have to navigate on the way to the Outer Banks.

You have Mr. Maple in your back yard. I enjoy visiting, but I have 14 Japanese Maples.
Buy Japanese Maples - MrMaple
Did they just change your Zone? Asheville seems considerably cooler than Nashville(7a).

 

[VolNExile]

You have Mr. Maple in your back yard. I enjoy visiting, but I have 14 Japanese Maples.
Buy Japanese Maples - MrMaple
Did they just change your Zone? Asheville seems considerably cooler than Nashville(7a).

I met Mr Maple’s father (huh, this makes him sound like an Ent) at the big annual spring plant sale at WNC Farmers Market 4-5 years ago. With a whopping 0.15 acre city lot (half of which is house), I have to be jealous of my garden space, but Japanese maples are definitely on the list. I’d forgotten about Mr.Maple. Thanks for reminding me! He also carries ginkgos, which I’d like to plant (hoping for male-only!) Our neighborhood is mostly Arts and Crafts houses built in the 1920’s, and ginkgos are one of the common a&c motifs.

I think USDA changed us from 6b to 7a four years ago, maybe. When my daughter and son-in-law moved to AVL 10 years ago, they didn’t need air conditioning. When we followed about three years later, there might be 5-6 days in the summer where you’d have all the fans going nonstop. Now, it’s AC land. And except for our big snow this past weekend, we don’t get a lot of real winter any more. Heartbreaking.

I didn’t realize Nashville was also 7a. But then, these zones are reflecting winter lows. I wish USDA would give another whack at creating heat zones. That’s way more relevant for most veg gardening. We’d definitely be in different heat zones!

 

[walkenvol]

I couldn’t agree with you more about it being the soil. The problem with my yard is that it is such a hard clay I would need to rent a machine to get it to loosen enough so that I could pack it with the leaves. Another problem is I don’t have leaves. The neighborhood is new and there are no trees in any of the yards that have grown enough to produce enough leaves. That’s why I was thinking about doing the raised bed.

Are grass cuttings good for raised beds? I can imagine the weeds being produced from that, though.

Most any organic matter is good. The thing you have to be careful about with grass clippings is most folks use pesticides and other chemicals on their lawns and I don’t want those things on the food I’m eating.

I started out in a new neighborhood like yourself with terrible soil. Drove around each fall and picked up bags of leaves on the curbs. The city used to give away leaf mulch but some company started buying it so no more. Just have to keep your eyes open and you’ll find stuff. Back then there was no extra money to buy quality soil for us. If you’ve got the extra cash buying good soil will provide faster results.