The NCAA Rules Committee is at it again....

#151
#151
bamawriter said:
The rule will not affect tempo in the least. There is not now, nor has there ever been, an offense that comes anywhere close to snapping the ball every ten seconds. The fastest offense in the country last year was averaging over twice that.

This is about the offense rushing to get set so that the defense can't sub. Then, after getting set, they do the meerkat routine and get the play called in from the sideline.

To be clear, I do think this proposal is meant to address a very real issue. However, I'm not personally in agreement that it is the correct way to deal with that issue.
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I understand everything you posted. I also know offenses will quick snap to catch people on the field while trying to substitute. Instead of changing rules defenses could be ready to sub after a tackle and eliminate the chest bumping.
 
#152
#152
bamawriter said:
The rule will not affect tempo in the least. There is not now, nor has there ever been, an offense that comes anywhere close to snapping the ball every ten seconds. The fastest offense in the country last year was averaging over twice that.

This is about the offense rushing to get set so that the defense can't sub. Then, after getting set, they do the meerkat routine and get the play called in from the sideline.

To be clear, I do think this proposal is meant to address a very real issue. However, I'm not personally in agreement that it is the correct way to deal with that issue.
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Bingo.

Heh, meerkat...that's actually a pretty accurate way to describe it.
 
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#153
#153
I like the cerebral part of the game. I like that mental preparedness can offset physical superiority (OMG--I sound like Frasier Crane!). I like any sport where there are multiple ways to win--the rock/paper/scissors principle.

That said, with all our youth, I'm thinking Tennessee would benefit from such a rule. It would allow coaches to get our best players onto the field; players who will not be our most experienced or knowledgable, at least for a few more years.
 
#154
#154
crusse10 said:
Dense people making the same illogical come back abound in this thread.

First, the more plays, the more opportunities for injuries.
Second, the more plays without allowing substitutions, the more weaker players on the field, who are more likely to get injured.
Third, the more plays, the more likely players at the end of games will be even more weak, thus becoming even more liable to get injured.
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let me throw this in ...Texas Tech ran more plays per game than any other team last year but, they had fewer injuries....players more healthy and faster.

second...with close to 20 players on Alabama's roster over 300 lbs, most have or will have diabetes...less healthy, slower.

this is a ploy by the whining Sabans and the bawling Bielemeas to slow the Auburns and Texas A&Ms down to fit their style of play.

Has very little to do with injuries because data does not support it.....
 
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#155
#155
Here's what I think would be better than this new rule. Rather than changing the rulebook, evenly and fairly enforce two rules that are already on the books:

1. There needs to be a set amount of time that the ump stands over the ball once an offense substituties. Just because you want to play quickly doesn't mean that a defense should have a shorter sub window. Whenever an offensive sub happens, the defense gets X number of seconds regardless of their opponent's style of offense.

2. It is more than fine to rush up to the line and get set in order to prevent your opponent from subbing. It's also more than fine to signal in plays from the sideline in lieu of huddling. But you cannot get set in order to disadvantage your opponent, only for everyone on offense to get unset in order to see the play call. Once you get set, you have to stay set. No more meerkat stuff. If you get set and halt all substitutions, and anyone other than the QB or a man in motion moves, it's a false start.

I've never understood how #2 hasn't been enforced all along.
 
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#156
#156
bamawriter said:
Here's what I think would be better than this new rule. Rather than changing the rulebook, evenly and fairly enforce two rules that are already on the books:

1. There needs to be a set amount of time that the ump stands over the ball once an offense substituties. Just because you want to play quickly doesn't mean that a defense should have a shorter sub window. Whenever an offensive sub happens, the defense gets X number of seconds regardless of their opponent's style of offense.

2. It is more than fine to rush up to the line and get set in order to prevent your opponent from subbing. It's also more than fine to signal in plays from the sideline in lieu of huddling. But you cannot get set in order to disadvantage your opponent, only for everyone on offense to get unset in order to see the play call. Once you get set, you have to stay set. No more meerkat stuff. If you get set and halt all substitutions, and anyone other than the QB or a man in motion moves, it's a false start.

I've never understood how #2 hasn't been enforced all along.
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hey bamawriter lets just face the facts...Saban can not stand Auburn and Malzahn having an edge with the fast paced offense, so what does he do hire a pro set offensive snake in Kiffin and try to slow the fast pace offenses down...let alone the fact he has close to 20 players on his roster he recruited over 300 lbs.
Bielema just has the Big Ten offense mindset, ground and pound, and knows he can't change if he wanted to...
 
#157
#157
slickstirs said:
hey bamawriter lets just face the facts...Saban can not stand Auburn and Malzahn having an edge with the fast paced offense, so what does he do hire a pro set offensive snake in Kiffin and try to slow the fast pace offenses down...let alone the fact he has close to 20 players on his roster he recruited over 300 lbs.
Bielema just has the Big Ten offense mindset, ground and pound, and knows he can't change if he wanted to...
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Why did you quote my post if you weren't actually going to respond to a single word in it?
 
#158
#158
slickstirs said:
hey bamawriter lets just face my opinions...Saban can not stand Auburn and Malzahn having an edge with the fast paced offense, so what does he do hire a pro set offensive snake in Kiffin and try to slow the fast pace offenses down...let alone the fact he has close to 20 players on his roster he recruited over 300 lbs.
Bielema just has the Big Ten offense mindset, ground and pound, and knows he can't change if he wanted to...
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None of those were really "facts"
 
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#159
#159
slickstirs said:
hey bamawriter lets just face the facts...Saban can not stand Auburn and Malzahn having an edge with the fast paced offense, so what does he do hire a pro set offensive snake in Kiffin and try to slow the fast pace offenses down...let alone the fact he has close to 20 players on his roster he recruited over 300 lbs.
Bielema just has the Big Ten offense mindset, ground and pound, and knows he can't change if he wanted to...
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Can't beat Malzahn? Had that game gone to OT, Bama wins it. And he beat A&M this year, too.
 
#160
#160
bamawriter said:
Why did you quote my post if you weren't actually going to respond to a single word in it?
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simply because your first issue is being enforced, when offense subs ref stands over ball til def subs.

second if you do away with the hurry to line and then call play, you have no hurry up offense thus doing away with it completely, which is what Saban wants.
 
#162
#162
slickstirs said:
simply because your first issue is being enforced, when offense subs ref stands over ball til def subs.
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I never said it wasn't being enforced at all, only that it isn't being enforced evenly. Refs are getting off the ball quicker when HUNH offenses sub than they do for their pro-style counterparts. There needs to be a set amount of time. I don't know if it's 10 seconds or however long, but it needs to be set in stone rather than discretionary.

second if you do away with the hurry to line and then call play, you have no hurry up offense thus doing away with it completely, which is what Saban wants.
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I'm not saying that teams can't hurry up and get a play called without a huddle, only that they should not be allowed to get completely set and then completely unset. If a pro-style team were to get set and have an offensive lineman stand straight up, they'd be flagged. How you choose to call your plays should not exempt you from the rules.
 
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#163
#163
slickstirs said:
the key word in your statement is "had", and yes Bama did beat A&M this year barely. barely being my key word.
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"Barely" huh? From half way through the second quarter until the end of the game, A&M never had the ball with a chance to tie.

That said, Bama's defense sucked hard in that one.
 
#164
#164
slickstirs said:
the key word in your statement is "had", and yes Bama did beat A&M this year barely. barely being my key word.
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A fluke play that could have been avoided doesn't mean that one team and coach is superior to a superior coach
 
#166
#166
slickstirs said:
the key word in your statement is "had", and yes Bama did beat A&M this year barely. barely being my key word.
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Bama was up by 21 at the start of the 3rd quarter. Manziel and company just managed to score enough in the last quarter to make it look like it wasn't a one-sided game.

At worst it really should have been a two score win save for a garbage TD by Manziel in the last 15 seconds.
 
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#167
#167
crusse10 said:
All these coaches saying "where's the proof?!?"

The proof is in the amount of plays run, therefore more chances to get injured on both sides.
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No, doesn't matter. If during those extra plays there aren't additional injuries it's a moot point. There's evidently no data to support that the hurry up style leads to more injuries. None.

Additionally, if it's really about player safety, why would they allow offenses to run under current rules without penalty during the last 2 minutes of each half? Are they saying playing "fast" during those 4 minutes of the game doesn't lead to player safety concerns but it does the rest of the game? Hypocrisy.
 
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#168
#168
bamawriter said:
Here's what I think would be better than this new rule. Rather than changing the rulebook, evenly and fairly enforce two rules that are already on the books:

1. There needs to be a set amount of time that the ump stands over the ball once an offense substituties. Just because you want to play quickly doesn't mean that a defense should have a shorter sub window. Whenever an offensive sub happens, the defense gets X number of seconds regardless of their opponent's style of offense.

2. It is more than fine to rush up to the line and get set in order to prevent your opponent from subbing. It's also more than fine to signal in plays from the sideline in lieu of huddling. But you cannot get set in order to disadvantage your opponent, only for everyone on offense to get unset in order to see the play call. Once you get set, you have to stay set. No more meerkat stuff. If you get set and halt all substitutions, and anyone other than the QB or a man in motion moves, it's a false start.

I've never understood how #2 hasn't been enforced all along.
Click to expand...

Good sensible post. Were you raised somewhere other than Alabama?
 
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#171
#171
Sin City Vol said:
How can you say that?? Who knows what could have happened in overtime...damn you sound like Bama homer
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I'm a huge Bama homer and I'm convinced we would have lost in OT.

But we were in scoring position more often than Auburn, and we outgained them by 100 yards. If Cade Foster hadn't gone all Cade Foster, OT doesn't become an issue.
 
#172
#172
Some of you hate the idea of a rule change allowing the defense to sub, whether or not injuries are an issue, ONLY because Saban is one of the sponsors of the idea., and are regardless of any merits it might have. Possibly blinded by your hatred, me thinks.

Was not the original rule put in place when teams stopped playing both ways and offensive/defensive 'two platoon system' came in? And wasn't that because OFFENSIVE COORDINATORS WERE WHINING THAT THE DEFENSE WAS SUBSTITUTING TOO MUCH AND GASSING OUT THEIR OFFENSIVE LINE?

Now OC's have found a way to turn a rule made in their favor, BECAUSE OF THEIR OWN WHINING, upside down; turn it against the D, and then accuse DC's of whining that the offense is gassing the D.

Talk about hypocritical!!!!!!!

Well I say tit-fer-tat, good fer the goose is good fer the gander. Find a way to let the D sub as often as needed so they are as fresh as the O, and both sides of the ball are competing on their ability to execute football.

Not because the O is able to turn a rule upside down, gas the D, and win against players who can't execute to their own abilities.

It's just whinnybrook supporters of the HUNH fast paced game that like to see plays run against a gassed defensive line, that like to see scores run up, that are opposed to finding a middle ground in this bru-ha-ha! Kwitcher whinning about making the game fair for the defense!
 
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#173
#173
bamawriter said:
I'm a huge Bama homer and I'm convinced we would have lost in OT.

But we were in scoring position more often than Auburn, and we outgained them by 100 yards. If Cade Foster hadn't gone all Cade Foster, OT doesn't become an issue.
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the real issue for this discussion, however, was that a hurry up offense ISN'T the reason Auburn won the game. That is the side these people are arguing, which is false.
 
#174
#174
Annnd!

Far as rules to prevent injuries go:

Let's just toss em all out and go back to the early years, the real early years. I mean, we're not playing REAL football. Not like it's supposed to be played. Let's reinstate the ol' momentum plays like the flying wedge, where O-line men sewed suitcase handles to their belts, grabbed on to each other and flew downfield with the ball carrier behind 'em. Bones were broke in most every game. H3ll, one year 18 kids died! But who cares, it's all 'bout that the rules for player safety suck, real men play football, donchaknow!

Let's just goe back to THAT, get rid of a rules committee, and freeze football in stone.
 
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