MAD
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The Official Detroit Pistons Thread
- Thread starter zjcvols
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n_huffhines
I want for you what you want for immigrants
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@zjcvols what did you think of Lowe on BS and what he said about Cade? I have always had Cade one tier behind the public position. I love Russillo and really trust him, and he is huge on Cade. Everybody is freaking out about Cade. BS has him right around the top 12. I've got him closer to the late 20's and had been starting to feel insecure about my position, but then Zach Lowe comes back from the grave to take my side.
And I'm not trying to **** on Cade. He's good. And you should be excited about him because he has taken such a leap, and he's still young and well on his way. All I'm saying is he's headed there but not as close as everybody seems to think.
And Dyson Daniels should be most improved player.
And I'm not trying to **** on Cade. He's good. And you should be excited about him because he has taken such a leap, and he's still young and well on his way. All I'm saying is he's headed there but not as close as everybody seems to think.
And Dyson Daniels should be most improved player.
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I respect Lowe and understand his position. I don't know if anyone other than maybe Trae has a bigger offensive load on him night to night. His efficiency isn't great, but he has to take 7-10 contested jumpers late in the shot clock (not the only guy) plus be the primary playmaker plus get everyone in the flow of the offense. I also would say, and this isn't just a me thing, this is a Pistons fandom gripe, he gets a terrible whistle for an All-Star lead ballhandler. He should easily be getting 8 FTA's with how aggressive he is but I guess because of the Pistons overall rep the refs give him a tough whistle, which is highly annoying.
My only real gripe is he's not a knockdown shooter when he's open. I don't think he's going to win a couple playoff series by himself this year. But I think he can definitely be the lead guy for consistent 50 wins teams moving forward, something I wasn't sure about. I think his ceiling has increased more than I thought. I figured he was a career 15-25 range player (Garland, basically) but now I think he could actually be a top 7 guy at some point in his career and make a 1st team All-NBA.
He's a solid defender. He rebounds like hell. His mid-range game is legitimately good, and he's gotten better/craftier around the rim. My hope is there is a little more in the jump shot and he continues to work on the turnovers (much better over the last few months than where he was). Maybe a good playoff run gives him a more beneficial whistle. Is he ever going to be the best player on a title team? Probably not. But they haven't had a truly legitimate, All-NBA scoring threat since Grant Hill so I can easily live with it.
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YankeeVol
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BigOrangeMojo
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I'm doing a Lions style breakdown of the Pistons season and upcoming playoff series. I can't believe this is my life.
1) I'm not going to look at pre-integration Tigers seasons and there might be a Red Wings season during the Original 6 days when they went last to first or something of that sort. This is the greatest season-to-season turnaround in Detroit modern sports history. To go from 14 wins to 44 wins without adding one all-star caliber player via offseason acquisition or draft is unheard of. Incredible what proper development and competent roster building does.
2) I don't live in Michigan or Detroit. But I follow the pulse of the city with sports closely and I think this is clearly the first Pistons team the city truly cares about since I've been an adult. There was an actual electricity in April home games I have never felt watching on my screen. The team enjoys the players and the style of play. Little Caesar's Arena hosted playoff games before in 2019 but as an 8 seed and 41-41 season, nobody embraced them. This team feels embraced. They feel so much like the 2022 Lions and 2024 Tigers, initially discarded that you slowly came back around to and fell in love with.
3) When Cade Cunningham was selected 1st overall, it made complete sense why you would draft a guy with (very timid) Luka Doncic comparisons. A big guard with maestro pick-and-roll skills, a good jump shot and athletic scores that catch your eye. It was a slow progress, and I actually think he's not exceedingly better than last year. I think the team was just so poorly coach and constructed he didn't have any place to shine. His ball handling is better; his passing is better and his finishing around the rim improved. When you combine all of those things and the better spacing/Duren improvement, you get an All-Star caliber player. I thought he had top 25 talent that could scratch out a 3rd team All-NBA selection here and there. Now I think he can be a consistent top 5-10 guy in the league. That means you go from play in games to winning playoff series. That's a massive difference.
4) Tragan Langdon might have had the best first-year GM year in the last 15 years of the NBA. For anyone that played more than 200 minutes, Langdon's acquisitions put together 18.3-win shares to Detroit this year. That is very impressive but it's even more astounding how he did it. He received 3 second round picks for Tim Hardaway and gave Quentin Grimes, who did find footing in Philadelphia but not in Dallas. He added Tobias Harris for a 2 year/$52M, which is insane value and not long-term. He added Malik Beasley for $6M on the FA market. He got Ron Holland with the 5th overall pick (in a "bad" draft). He acquired Paul Reed for $4M but only count as a vet minimum on the cap. And he got Dennis Schroder at the deadline for one second round pick and KJ Martin but somehow acquired two second round picks and Lindy Waters back. Now look, Langdon got a little luck. They had the cap space to take on Schroder without trading money back, they got Harris cheaper because his market cooled, Hardaway/Schroder were salary dumps. Doesn't matter. He added five rotation players while giving up zero first round assets, no deal longer than 2 years and less than $100M overall to do it. That's an offseason masterclass that will be studied by future NBA front office executives for a decade.
5. I wanted to speak on Jalen Duren's development because I thought no Pistons improved from game 1 to game 82 better than him. Duren was a year ahead in his draft class from an age experience and turned 21 in September (to put that into context, Zach Edey was drafted last summer and it 2 years older). Duren obviously had physical gifts and offensive skills to thrive, but the defense was lacking. It's not perfect still but the rim protection and pick-and-roll defense is night and day. J.B. Bickerstaff and company need to be commended for really installing belief in him. He is far from complete on that end, with the foul trouble and Detroit's struggles with stretch 5 players. But I feel more comfortable working on that extension than I did in December.
6. I think NBA coaches are way more about buy-in and locker room harmony than strategy and development in 2025, but J.B. Bickerstaff did well in both this season. This group was close to broken after the indifference and downright neglect that Monty Williams showed in the Pistons team last year. Williams' lack of passion and care after receiving his contract was disgusting and it infected the entire locker room. Bickerstaff had to rebuild and install a winning culture from scratch and build that entire room's confidence, which is no easy feat. Bickerstaff and company did a good job building a more than competent offense around Cade/Ivey, doing a good job implementing more stuff for Beasley after the Ivey injury and using Tobias' strengths to his advantage. The defensive turnaround (top 10 in net rating since January 1st) with only one truly elite defender also is worthy of major kudos. I can understand him not being the coach of the year, but he is definitely a deserving final top 3.
7. I'm really interested in the future of Ausar Thompson and Ron Holland when the season ends. I don't know if they are playable together. I believe Holland can become a decent shooter, despite the terrible numbers (I have zero faith in Ausar) but the potential for them to be such a dynamic defensive duo on the wings is tantalizing, especially if Holland's shot continues to improve. Thompson has all-world type talent, he just needs to harness that athleticism with that defensive intensity he brings. Holland has legitimate NBA skills to pair with his athleticism. Can those two play together in the future? Or is the lack of shooting make the skillset redundant?
8. I believe the Pistons can win this series versus the Knicks. Would I bet money on it? No. But this is not as big of a gap as some of the (biased) media want you to believe. The Pistons depth has been a big reason for their success. The Knicks will probably play 7 guys per game while the Pistons can run 9 out there for double digit minutes if Bickerstaff is feeling frisky. The Pistons offense was successful in every game they played, and Cade was dominant in three of the outings. The Pistons have zero small guards that will get minutes where Brunson can take advantage of isolations. They're size on the wings should give Anunoby and Bridges some issues. I am frightened by Karl-Anthony Towns pulling Duren away from the basket. I am also scared Malik Beasley and Tim Hardaway go cold. I am concerned Dennis Schroder goes 0-13 from 3 after 4 games and keeps shooting. With that being said, the Pistons will not play scared and the moment will not be too big for them.
1) I'm not going to look at pre-integration Tigers seasons and there might be a Red Wings season during the Original 6 days when they went last to first or something of that sort. This is the greatest season-to-season turnaround in Detroit modern sports history. To go from 14 wins to 44 wins without adding one all-star caliber player via offseason acquisition or draft is unheard of. Incredible what proper development and competent roster building does.
2) I don't live in Michigan or Detroit. But I follow the pulse of the city with sports closely and I think this is clearly the first Pistons team the city truly cares about since I've been an adult. There was an actual electricity in April home games I have never felt watching on my screen. The team enjoys the players and the style of play. Little Caesar's Arena hosted playoff games before in 2019 but as an 8 seed and 41-41 season, nobody embraced them. This team feels embraced. They feel so much like the 2022 Lions and 2024 Tigers, initially discarded that you slowly came back around to and fell in love with.
3) When Cade Cunningham was selected 1st overall, it made complete sense why you would draft a guy with (very timid) Luka Doncic comparisons. A big guard with maestro pick-and-roll skills, a good jump shot and athletic scores that catch your eye. It was a slow progress, and I actually think he's not exceedingly better than last year. I think the team was just so poorly coach and constructed he didn't have any place to shine. His ball handling is better; his passing is better and his finishing around the rim improved. When you combine all of those things and the better spacing/Duren improvement, you get an All-Star caliber player. I thought he had top 25 talent that could scratch out a 3rd team All-NBA selection here and there. Now I think he can be a consistent top 5-10 guy in the league. That means you go from play in games to winning playoff series. That's a massive difference.
4) Tragan Langdon might have had the best first-year GM year in the last 15 years of the NBA. For anyone that played more than 200 minutes, Langdon's acquisitions put together 18.3-win shares to Detroit this year. That is very impressive but it's even more astounding how he did it. He received 3 second round picks for Tim Hardaway and gave Quentin Grimes, who did find footing in Philadelphia but not in Dallas. He added Tobias Harris for a 2 year/$52M, which is insane value and not long-term. He added Malik Beasley for $6M on the FA market. He got Ron Holland with the 5th overall pick (in a "bad" draft). He acquired Paul Reed for $4M but only count as a vet minimum on the cap. And he got Dennis Schroder at the deadline for one second round pick and KJ Martin but somehow acquired two second round picks and Lindy Waters back. Now look, Langdon got a little luck. They had the cap space to take on Schroder without trading money back, they got Harris cheaper because his market cooled, Hardaway/Schroder were salary dumps. Doesn't matter. He added five rotation players while giving up zero first round assets, no deal longer than 2 years and less than $100M overall to do it. That's an offseason masterclass that will be studied by future NBA front office executives for a decade.
5. I wanted to speak on Jalen Duren's development because I thought no Pistons improved from game 1 to game 82 better than him. Duren was a year ahead in his draft class from an age experience and turned 21 in September (to put that into context, Zach Edey was drafted last summer and it 2 years older). Duren obviously had physical gifts and offensive skills to thrive, but the defense was lacking. It's not perfect still but the rim protection and pick-and-roll defense is night and day. J.B. Bickerstaff and company need to be commended for really installing belief in him. He is far from complete on that end, with the foul trouble and Detroit's struggles with stretch 5 players. But I feel more comfortable working on that extension than I did in December.
6. I think NBA coaches are way more about buy-in and locker room harmony than strategy and development in 2025, but J.B. Bickerstaff did well in both this season. This group was close to broken after the indifference and downright neglect that Monty Williams showed in the Pistons team last year. Williams' lack of passion and care after receiving his contract was disgusting and it infected the entire locker room. Bickerstaff had to rebuild and install a winning culture from scratch and build that entire room's confidence, which is no easy feat. Bickerstaff and company did a good job building a more than competent offense around Cade/Ivey, doing a good job implementing more stuff for Beasley after the Ivey injury and using Tobias' strengths to his advantage. The defensive turnaround (top 10 in net rating since January 1st) with only one truly elite defender also is worthy of major kudos. I can understand him not being the coach of the year, but he is definitely a deserving final top 3.
7. I'm really interested in the future of Ausar Thompson and Ron Holland when the season ends. I don't know if they are playable together. I believe Holland can become a decent shooter, despite the terrible numbers (I have zero faith in Ausar) but the potential for them to be such a dynamic defensive duo on the wings is tantalizing, especially if Holland's shot continues to improve. Thompson has all-world type talent, he just needs to harness that athleticism with that defensive intensity he brings. Holland has legitimate NBA skills to pair with his athleticism. Can those two play together in the future? Or is the lack of shooting make the skillset redundant?
8. I believe the Pistons can win this series versus the Knicks. Would I bet money on it? No. But this is not as big of a gap as some of the (biased) media want you to believe. The Pistons depth has been a big reason for their success. The Knicks will probably play 7 guys per game while the Pistons can run 9 out there for double digit minutes if Bickerstaff is feeling frisky. The Pistons offense was successful in every game they played, and Cade was dominant in three of the outings. The Pistons have zero small guards that will get minutes where Brunson can take advantage of isolations. They're size on the wings should give Anunoby and Bridges some issues. I am frightened by Karl-Anthony Towns pulling Duren away from the basket. I am also scared Malik Beasley and Tim Hardaway go cold. I am concerned Dennis Schroder goes 0-13 from 3 after 4 games and keeps shooting. With that being said, the Pistons will not play scared and the moment will not be too big for them.
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You were 100% right on Stewart. He's the best backup C in the league and he'd start for at least 10 teams on the right night and when Duren gets in foul trouble/torched by stretch 5, he gives you a different look. Also does not care about minutes, has no problem sacrificing and teams are legitimately afraid of him. It's $16M and it goes up very little overall. That was a great contract. Not bad Troy Weaver.
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If you want to know how shocking this Pistons run has been…
Girlfriend asked me in November about going to a wedding in Charlottesville (2 hours from me) and grabbing a hotel and staying the weekend. She gave me the date, we’re driving back home Sunday morning. Didn’t even cross my mind NBA playoffs would start. “Yeah sure babe no problem.”
So guess who is gonna be at a wedding during the Pistons first playoff game in six years lol
So
Girlfriend asked me in November about going to a wedding in Charlottesville (2 hours from me) and grabbing a hotel and staying the weekend. She gave me the date, we’re driving back home Sunday morning. Didn’t even cross my mind NBA playoffs would start. “Yeah sure babe no problem.”
So guess who is gonna be at a wedding during the Pistons first playoff game in six years lol
So
BigOrangeMojo
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YankeeVol
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TBrown
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