The Ones that Got Away

#51
#51
OrangeSquare said:
Typical answer. Ignore the question, continue to bash.

I WILL say this, and this is one of those things I say from time to time that the NegaVols always ignore and pretend I never say.

I am, from time to time disapointed in the way that certain players are used or NOT used, as the case may be, by our coaching staff.

Does that mean Phil should be fired, or that he does it all the time? No. Am I smart enough to realize that there are coaches all across America that don't always utilize every player on their teams correctly? YES.
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A head coach is accountable for all aspects of the program. Before you commented on this present discussion we were commenting on Fulmer's recruiting ability. He is an excellent recruiter, however, the talent he brings in is not translated into success on the field when teams are evenly matched (and sometimes even when we are the far superior team). can you point out to me one game that Fulmer outcoached a superior opponent?
 
#53
#53
rexvol said:
A head coach is accountable for all aspects of the program. Before you commented on this present discussion we were commenting on Fulmer's recruiting ability. He is an excellent recruiter, however, the talent he brings in is not translated into success on the field when teams are evenly matched (and sometimes even when we are the far superior team). can you point out to me one game that Fulmer outcoached a superior opponent?
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He outcoached Tedford this year, and people seem to think he is a football god.
 
#54
#54
you dont really mean to propose that LSU last year was some masterful job of coaching by Fulmer do you? Watch the game, it was simply an LSU collapse.
 
#55
#55
rexvol said:
you dont really mean to propose that LSU last year was some masterful job of coaching by Fulmer do you? Watch the game, it was simply an LSU collapse.
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This is why I won't engage in discussion with you.

Everything is either Fulmer's fault, or when he does something positive, it's the other team or coaches fault they didn't succede.

You are hopeless.
 
#56
#56
no, Im actually hopeful that you'll pull your head out of the sand and face reality one day. Fulmer's best days are behind him.
 
#57
#57
OrangeSquare said:
This is why I won't engage in discussion with you.

Everything is either Fulmer's fault, or when he does something positive, it's the other team or coaches fault they didn't succede.

You are hopeless.
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O2, you're gonna want to save this one.....

I almost never agree with you. Based on your "Vol Fan Evaluation System", I'm a hard-core NegaVol, based (obviously) on my opinions on CPF. Having said that.....

There is one game that comes to mind that supports your stance. The 10-6 win over Miami. Say what you want, But what I saw was a seriously out-talented UT team play their hearts out, and knock off a heavily favored "U" team.

Had you asked about games where UT played below their talent level, I'd be here half the night.

Still, you asked the right question. Good for you.

Go Vols.
 
#58
#58
I will grant you that Miami game, but even a lame dog catches a rabbit once in awhile.
 
#59
#59
You could argue that Fulmer has worked over Mark Richt once or twice . . . in 2004 for sure.
 
#60
#60
GreyWolf1129 said:
O2, you're gonna want to save this one.....

I almost never agree with you. Based on your "Vol Fan Evaluation System", I'm a hard-core NegaVol, based (obviously) on my opinions on CPF. Having said that.....

There is one game that comes to mind that supports your stance. The 10-6 win over Miami. Say what you want, But what I saw was a seriously out-talented UT team play their hearts out, and knock off a heavily favored "U" team.

Had you asked about games where UT played below their talent level, I'd be here half the night.

Still, you asked the right question. Good for you.

Go Vols.
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You give ME too much credit. The evaulation system isn't mine. When I signed up here, they were already discussing NegaVols and Fulmerites. There was already a MULTI-PAGE thread bashing Fulmer when I got here.

I'm glad you are able to recognize positives. Careful though, the others might revoke your membership card. :p
 
#63
#63
I don't think you can blame LSU's defeat on a collapse. UT had about as bad a collapse in the first half as I've ever seen. Honestly, I thought our defense held LSU in check almost the entire game. Almost all of their points were from Ainge's turnovers. Beyond that, I think they maybe scored 10 points. Once we got the offense on track, the game was ours for the taking. Had Ainge just played poorly and not miserably the first half, we probably would have won the game more to the tune of 28-13.
 
#64
#64
rexvol said:
A head coach is accountable for all aspects of the program. Before you commented on this present discussion we were commenting on Fulmer's recruiting ability. He is an excellent recruiter, however, the talent he brings in is not translated into success on the field when teams are evenly matched (and sometimes even when we are the far superior team). can you point out to me one game that Fulmer outcoached a superior opponent?
Click to expand...

As mentioned earlier, 10-6 over Miami was an outstanding job.

This year's humiliation of Jeff Tedford was priceless.

2001's victory in the swamp was a memorable coaching performance by Fulmer as well.

It was also a nice accomplishment to take a freshman qb into Athens in 04 as a double digit dog and knock off the 4th ranked Dawgs...

Of course, you've already chalked the Miami win up as a "lame dog" finding a rabbit...you'll probably say the Cal win this year should be credited to Cutcliffe, or that Cal was overrated...and I'm sure you'll counter the victory in the swamp with the subsequent loss to LSU in Atlanta that year...and who knows, maybe you think Georgia players intentionally lost the last 2 times we played them in Athens...

No one here will argue that we'd like to have top 5 recruiting classes every year, and SEC championship teams every year...but most of us understand that it's unrealistic to expect that every year. We don't accept mediocrity...we just don't expect flawless seasons...dynasties only happen in video games and at USC.

We enjoy the good...and in almost every year, there's a lot more positive than there is negative.

You just choose to view the negative all the time.
 
#65
#65
Jaytrain5 said:
No one here will argue that we'd like to have top 5 recruiting classes every year, and SEC championship teams every year...but most of us understand that it's unrealistic to expect that every year. We don't accept mediocrity...we just don't expect flawless seasons...dynasties only happen in video games and at USC.

We enjoy the good...and in almost every year, there's a lot more positive than there is negative.

You just choose to view the negative all the time.
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It has never been said better. This is EXACTLY how I feel. :clapping: :good!:
 
#67
#67
rexvol said:
no, Im actually hopeful that you'll pull your head out of the sand and face reality one day. Fulmer's best days are behind him.
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Who knows maybe Fulmer's best days are behind him. But, I do not understand how you know that. He has not been at the level we expect him to be at lately. Granted. But he was capable before, so why is he all the sudden not capable anymore? How do you know that this season was not a turn back in the right direction? Recruiting is back to normal. We played up to our potential with a young team that was hurt by key injuries. We return a lot of talent and have many young players who are primed to step up next seaoson. You are saying you can be sure Fulmer is no longer capable of winning big at UT? Its not possible that with the new staff and young talent we have (and are getting this year in recruiting) we can't win big in the very near future? I certainly do not know for a fact that we can, but I like our chances. I do not think this is the same coaching staff (or same Philip Fulmer) of the '05 season.
 
#68
#68
therickbol said:
Who knows maybe Fulmer's best days are behind him. But, I do not understand how you know that. He has not been at the level we expect him to be at lately. Granted. But he was capable before, so why is he all the sudden not capable anymore? How do you know that this season was not a turn back in the right direction? Recruiting is back to normal. We played up to our potential with a young team that was hurt by key injuries. We return a lot of talent and have many young players who are primed to step up next seaoson. You are saying you can be sure Fulmer is no longer capable of winning big at UT? Its not possible that with the new staff and young talent we have (and are getting this year in recruiting) we can't win big in the very near future? I certainly do not know for a fact that we can, but I like our chances. I do not think this is the same coaching staff (or same Philip Fulmer) of the '05 season.
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You make some good points. In my opinion, the Vols trend in the last several years has been undeveloped talent. We have had recruiting classes rated among the top 20 just about every year I can remember. What we do with that talent is suspect. For example, we out-recruit teams like Kentucky and Vanderbilt every year. Yet, Kentucky and Vanderbilt are able to stay with us in games and the scores are appearing to get closer and closer especially, in the last couple of years. As a coach, I always hoped to get the better talented players but, it is what I did with the players that was more important. Talent alone doesn't guarantee wins. It is the combination of talent and player development.
 
#69
#69
secfanclub said:
You make some good points. In my opinion, the Vols trend in the last several years has been undeveloped talent. We have had recruiting classes rated among the top 20 just about every year I can remember. What we do with that talent is suspect. For example, we out-recruit teams like Kentucky and Vanderbilt every year. Yet, Kentucky and Vanderbilt are able to stay with us in games and the scores are appearing to get closer and closer especially, in the last couple of years. As a coach, I always hoped to get the better talented players but, it is what I did with the players that was more important. Talent alone doesn't guarantee wins. It is the combination of talent and player development.
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While I will never argue that there's definitely been some underdeveloped talent in Knoxville, I don't think you can attribute our close games with the Dores and Wildcats to poor coaching and player development.

Georgia had losses to both of those teams this year, and we're not bashing Richt for the same things we're bashing our coaching staff for. Urban Meyer needed 3 OT's and a questionable celebration penalty against Vanderbilt to escape a loss to the Dores last year.

Similarly, Auburn escaped Ole Miss by the narrowest of margins this year, and was dealt the same type of thumping from Arkansas that we got.

I'm not saying we should expect to play close with the bottom teams in the league...I'm just saying the talent gap isn't that far divided between the top of the league and the bottom of the league anymore. You need to strap on your helmet every week in this conference.
 
#70
#70
Jaytrain5 said:
As mentioned earlier, 10-6 over Miami was an outstanding job.

This year's humiliation of Jeff Tedford was priceless.

2001's victory in the swamp was a memorable coaching performance by Fulmer as well.

It was also a nice accomplishment to take a freshman qb into Athens in 04 as a double digit dog and knock off the 4th ranked Dawgs...

Of course, you've already chalked the Miami win up as a "lame dog" finding a rabbit...you'll probably say the Cal win this year should be credited to Cutcliffe, or that Cal was overrated...and I'm sure you'll counter the victory in the swamp with the subsequent loss to LSU in Atlanta that year...and who knows, maybe you think Georgia players intentionally lost the last 2 times we played them in Athens...

No one here will argue that we'd like to have top 5 recruiting classes every year, and SEC championship teams every year...but most of us understand that it's unrealistic to expect that every year. We don't accept mediocrity...we just don't expect flawless seasons...dynasties only happen in video games and at USC.

We enjoy the good...and in almost every year, there's a lot more positive than there is negative.

You just choose to view the negative all the time.
Click to expand...


I would say Cutcliffe had alot to do with the Cal victory this year.
 
#75
#75
Jaytrain5 said:
As mentioned earlier, 10-6 over Miami was an outstanding job.

This year's humiliation of Jeff Tedford was priceless.

2001's victory in the swamp was a memorable coaching performance by Fulmer as well.

It was also a nice accomplishment to take a freshman qb into Athens in 04 as a double digit dog and knock off the 4th ranked Dawgs...

Of course, you've already chalked the Miami win up as a "lame dog" finding a rabbit...you'll probably say the Cal win this year should be credited to Cutcliffe, or that Cal was overrated...and I'm sure you'll counter the victory in the swamp with the subsequent loss to LSU in Atlanta that year...and who knows, maybe you think Georgia players intentionally lost the last 2 times we played them in Athens...

No one here will argue that we'd like to have top 5 recruiting classes every year, and SEC championship teams every year...but most of us understand that it's unrealistic to expect that every year. We don't accept mediocrity...we just don't expect flawless seasons...dynasties only happen in video games and at USC.

We enjoy the good...and in almost every year, there's a lot more positive than there is negative.

You just choose to view the negative all the time.
Click to expand...


What he said! :clapping:
 
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