The stock market thread part 2

#77
#77
truefan said:
So you don't like them because they are liberals?
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i don't like em because they pretend to be unbiased. their defense of everything obama every day is disgusting and ridiculously partisan. that gasperino guy is a jackass and slams obama regurally, but at least he says he is a republican.
 
#78
#78
anyone ever trade FAZ or any of the 3x etfs??

Whew that was fun!!

Gotta do something to salvage my BAC position
 
#79
#79
I read somewhere that a noted economist was predicting the bottom to hit around 6800. Can't remember his name.
 
#81
#81
Fidelity... welcome to the club

Bloomberg.com: Worldwide

Fidelity Investments, the world’s largest mutual-fund company, more than doubled its stake in Citigroup Inc. in the fourth quarter, ahead of a 63 percent slide in the stock this year.

Fidelity bought 104 million shares of Citigroup in the quarter ended Dec. 31, bringing its stake in the bank to 171 million shares, or 3.1 percent, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.
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#82
#82
VolsNSkinsFan said:
anyone ever trade FAZ or any of the 3x etfs??

Whew that was fun!!

Gotta do something to salvage my BAC position
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Trade them all the time.

Yeah, they're fun when you're in the right one..at the right time....I bought fas last Friday @ $8.45.:banghead2:

And like the dumbazz that I am, instead of getting out of the 3x at the end of the day, I'm still holding.

Still waiting for that m2m suspension. That should be coming any minute......right?:clapping:
 
#83
#83
I guess they'll wait until we hit 700 s&p......too late.
This is freaking ridiculous.


Sucks being long right now, but surely the shorts will cover today.......:ermm:
 
#84
#84
Im watching 730 on the S&P. Nobody is wanting to put any $$$$ to work right now. It's still a traders markets.
 
#85
#85
Futures are down a horrible 110

And like the dumbazz that I am, instead of getting out of the 3x at the end of the day, I'm still holding.
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Yea I have never held them over 48 hours

Still waiting for that m2m suspension. That should be coming any minute......right?
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Its the only hope us longs have
 
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#86
#86
Now we are looking at an open of down 155, which means we open up to new lows, which makes this day very interesting.


Should have held FAZ some more... up 13% in premarket trading... Frick
 
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#87
#87
judging from the way my clients are acting i.e. hysterical, if this isn't the bottom i may have to find a new profession. if i had any money not invested i'd buy like crazy
 
#88
#88
droski said:
judging from the way my clients are acting i.e. hysterical, if this isn't the bottom i may have to find a new profession. if i had any money not invested i'd buy like crazy
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I'm in mostly commercial real estate and I see a very similar mindset. I don't think we're far from the bottom of that barrel. In fact, we just started buying as fast as we can get deals closed.
 
#89
#89
the same can be said for the apartment market I bet. cap rates are 3 times what they were 2 years ago.
 
#90
#90
droski said:
the same can be said for the apartment market I bet. cap rates are 3 times what they were 2 years ago.
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one of our buys is a 228 unit apartment complex that I haven't even bothered with a cap rate valuation. The price is so low that it doesn't matter. If I can use the cap rate in the 6 month old appraisal come three years from now, I'll be one helluva happy guy.
 
#91
#91
droski said:
the same can be said for the apartment market I bet. cap rates are 3 times what they were 2 years ago.
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you might be surprised that apartment cap rates have held up as well as any because renting has become a huge trend. While houses are aplenty, apartments have done extremely well relative to the rest of the real estate markets.
 
#92
#92
BigPapaVol said:
you might be surprised that apartment cap rates have held up as well as any because renting has become a huge trend. While houses are aplenty, apartments have done extremely well relative to the rest of the real estate markets.
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precisesly why i bought a bunch of apartment reits for clients a couple of months ago. i now have 50-60% losses in them. :cray:

AIV, BRE, and EQR are ridiculously cheap (unless they are going bankrupt)
 
#93
#93
droski said:
precisesly why i bought a bunch of apartment reits for clients a couple of months ago. i now have 50-60% losses in them. :cray:

AIV, BRE, and EQR are ridiculously cheap (unless they are going bankrupt)
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reits have just been crushed by inertia. People hear Real Estate right now and run for the hills.

Precisely why I can buy these at roughly 55% of their cap rate valuation. Makes no sense that these are available where they are, but even the apartment guys are out of the business right now.

The irrational have taken over for the time being and I'm going to do everything I can to take advantage.
 
#94
#94
AIV is trading at 25% of even a heavily discounted asset value. I actually tried ot convince a real estate guy recently that he is far better off buying reits than actual real estate at this point (assuming you don't include leverage of course).
 
#95
#95
I dont understand why people continue to rent apartments with interest rates where they are. Rates for a 15 yr fixed mortgage are 4.5% today. It's a cheaper monthly payment to buy a house at those rates then it is to rent an apartment. And you own the house eventually. People just arent thinking clearly.
 
#96
#96
oklavol said:
I dont understand why people continue to rent apartments with interest rates where they are. Rates for a 15 yr fixed mortgage are 4.5% today. It's a cheaper monthly payment to buy a house at those rates then it is to rent an apartment. And you own the house eventually. People just arent thinking clearly.
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well that is probably true is some areas, but definetly not true here in la. the other problem is many lenders are now forcing people to put 20% down to buy, which can be a pretty sizable amount of change particurally in this economy.
 
#97
#97
droski said:
well that is probably true is some areas, but definetly not true here in la. the other problem is many lenders are now forcing people to put 20% down to buy, which can be a pretty sizable amount of change particurally in this economy.
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and that would be your answer. Need high credit scores and a pile of cash to get in. That has historically been the barrier to entry in homes, and rightfully so, necessary to keep the credit risks to a minimum. We're back to the 40 year ago view of housing and it will remain that way for some time.
 
#98
#98
droski said:
AIV is trading at 25% of even a heavily discounted asset value. I actually tried ot convince a real estate guy recently that he is far better off buying reits than actual real estate at this point (assuming you don't include leverage of course).
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but right now, utilizing all the leverage your cash will allow lets you buy enormous levels of assets with built in ridiculous coverage ratios. Further, the asset prices are so low, that should you, for some crazy reason default, the likely deficiency after bank sale would be 0 at worst. It's a rare event and is going to generate enormous wealth for some over the next 10 years.
 
#99
#99
droski said:
well that is probably true is some areas, but definetly not true here in la. the other problem is many lenders are now forcing people to put 20% down to buy, which can be a pretty sizable amount of change particurally in this economy.
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Don't forget about all the layoffs and rumors of scaling back jobs, people just do not want to get into such a large investment when unsure about their job security.
 
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