The strange case of Jose Guerena.

#27
#27
I'll bet they ran out of ammo!

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#29
#29
nbakerld said:
This same kind of thing happened in Utah this year. Did a no-knock entry on a USER and he didn't know who was rushing his house. He comes around the corner of the hall with a golf club raised and they pop off on him. Dead. The video and story here. It's disturbing.

Police Kill Man In Drug Raid Gone Wrong (VIDEO)
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It seems that the moral of these stories is when someone breaks into your house you should assume they're law enforcement, or you might get shot defending your house. This truly is the land of the free.

On a related note, how quickly do you think "cop killer" charges would have been raised if, during the garage of incoming gunfire, Guerena managed to get a shot off and hit an officer?
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#30
#30
"One death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic."
Josef Stalin


The sheriff in question seems to be echoing Napolitano about our main fear of terrorism is returning servicemen who have put their life on the line for America.

What a douchebag!!

Although most everyone will tell you Timothy McVeigh was the main culprit in the OKC bombing, the truth is that he was merely a dupe in the operation, it was a moslem operation from the getgo, they were just able to incorporate a 'lilly white' to be the fall guy.

Strangely the stupid sob kept his mouth shut about the whole thing all the way to his execution.

There is a cure of ignorance but so far science has found no remedy for stupidity.

On the contrary, with preschool programs rampant where supidity can be promoted at an early age, we seem to be on track to be living in an idiocracy sooner rather than later.

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#31
#31
gsvol said:
Although most everyone will tell you Timothy McVeigh was the main culprit in the OKC bombing, the truth is that he was merely a dupe in the operation, it was a moslem operation from the getgo, they were just able to incorporate a 'lilly white' to be the fall guy.

Strangely the stupid sob kept his mouth shut about the whole thing all the way to his execution.
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Give me a freaking break.

I just scoured Google finding anything I could on Hussain Al-Hussaini's connection to the OKC bombing, and literally the only things out there were right wing blogs quoting Jayna Davis, and the biggest extent of anything anybody could cite was that McVeigh was seen a few times with the guy. To be modest, that's a few steps shy of evidence of collusion on a terrorist attack and you're a few nickels short of a buck.

McVeigh and Nichols were both former-military, Christian raised NRA members that were incensed by what happened with the Branch Davidians and influenced by things like the Turner Diaries. People who believe the OKC bombing was an act by Muslims are the same level of batshiz crazy as those who believe 9/11 was perpetrated by the US government, but with a small fraction of the circumstantial evidence.

Got anymore retarded ideas you'd like to pull out of your ass?
 
#32
#32
gsvol said:
"One death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic."
Josef Stalin


The sheriff in question seems to be echoing Napolitano about our main fear of terrorism is returning servicemen who have put their life on the line for America.

What a douchebag!!

Although most everyone will tell you Timothy McVeigh was the main culprit in the OKC bombing, the truth is that he was merely a dupe in the operation, it was a moslem operation from the getgo, they were just able to incorporate a 'lilly white' to be the fall guy.

Strangely the stupid sob kept his mouth shut about the whole thing all the way to his execution.

There is a cure of ignorance but so far science has found no remedy for stupidity.

On the contrary, with preschool programs rampant where supidity can be promoted at an early age, we seem to be on track to be living in an idiocracy sooner rather than later.

jello-pudding-pop.jpg
Click to expand...

milohimself said:
Give me a freaking break.

I just scoured Google finding anything I could on Hussain Al-Hussaini's connection to the OKC bombing, and literally the only things out there were right wing blogs quoting Jayna Davis, and the biggest extent of anything anybody could cite was that McVeigh was seen a few times with the guy. To be modest, that's a few steps shy of evidence of collusion on a terrorist attack and you're a few nickels short of a buck.

McVeigh and Nichols were both former-military, Christian raised NRA members that were incensed by what happened with the Branch Davidians and influenced by things like the Turner Diaries. People who believe the OKC bombing was an act by Muslims are the same level of batshiz crazy as those who believe 9/11 was perpetrated by the US government, but with a small fraction of the circumstantial evidence.

Got anymore retarded ideas you'd like to pull out of your ass?
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Milo, Christians are incapable of committing any acts of violence, unless they have been brainwashed and exploited by Moslems.
 
#33
#33
Gs really stuck himself up ****ecreek ITT. Karma, imo.

Also, did I read correctly - he called one of you a bulldog/hummingbird chimaera? wtf at best.
 
#34
#34
Still waiting with bated breath to see if he mans up and calls Mandela a terrorist. I know he wants to.

Would then love to see his reaction to anybody who reacts violently against Sharia law.
 
#35
#35
Mandela can't be considered an angel. He even admitted that the actions of the MK movement violated human rights. I suppose that this is one of those cases in which "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter."
 
#36
#36
It's not like somebody could apply apartheid and expect Mandela and MK to come out all MLK going "We don't believe this is right." They tried civil discourse, and when it was clear there was no civil or legal alternatives, they armed themselves and fought for human rights. They also committed terrorist acts along the way, but that's the kind of cluster-eff that happens when that extremity of legal racism is applied.
 
#37
#37
Still, I would love to know if there are any cases of groups or individuals reacting violently to sharia law and if he'd be willing to call them murderous scumbags as well, or if he would in any hypothetical situation.

My money says he's going to see the trap he set for himself and ignore me.
 
#38
#38
so, if gs were to call Mandela a "terrorist", by your own admission, he would be correct? Regardless of the motivation, acts of terrorism should never be excused. Mandela himself insisted that the ANC not cover-up or censor the actions of the MK.
 
#39
#39
MG1968 said:
so, if gs were to call Mandela a "terrorist", by your own admission, he would be correct? Regardless of the motivation, acts of terrorism should never be excused. Mandela himself insisted that the ANC not cover-up or censor the actions of the MK.
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Disagree. The Boston Tea Party was a terrorist act, IMO.
 
#41
#41
MG1968 said:
perhaps by your definition of terrorism it was, but not mine nor most other peoples'
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I'd say it easily falls under the broad definition.

There is no universally agreed, legally binding, criminal law definition of terrorism.[1][2] Common definitions of terrorism refer only to those violent acts which are intended to create fear (terror), are perpetrated for a religious, political or ideological goal, deliberately target or disregard the safety of non-combatants (civilians), and are committed by non-government agencies.
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Terrorism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
#42
#42
so throwing crates of tea over the side of a ship to protest taxation is violent?
 
#43
#43
Well they did it with force, so it technically is violent. But regardless you don't have to comply with every part of the definition. For instance it says "by non-government agencies" but I'm pretty sure government can commit acts of terror.

Also, I would argue that terrorism has committed a lot less violence against civilians than conventional war has. Civilian body count in Iraq is up to 101,000 (most conservative estimate). That's like 33 9/11's.

Maybe we should be saying, "conventional war should never be excused."
 
#44
#44
MG1968 said:
so, if gs were to call Mandela a "terrorist", by your own admission, he would be correct? Regardless of the motivation, acts of terrorism should never be excused. Mandela himself insisted that the ANC not cover-up or censor the actions of the MK.
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Where is the line drawn? Mandela and MK armed themselves to fight for human rights and the ability of native south Africans to be self-governed. Were the Patriots terrorists? IRA? How does one define who is terrorist vs. freedom fighter?
 
#45
#45
much of that civilian body count is a direct result of insurgent actions against people and villages who were thought to be cooperating with the US and it's coalition partners.

War is hell and civilian casualties are an unfortunate side-effect of armed conflict, but the US has gone out of it's way to minimize civilian casualties. So much so that the ROE sometimes put our own personnel at risk.
 
#46
#46
milohimself said:
Where is the line drawn? Mandela and MK armed themselves to fight for human rights and the ability of native south Africans to be self-governed. Were the Patriots terrorists? IRA? How does one define who is terrorist vs. freedom fighter?
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did the Patriots target innocent civilians? did the IRA?

seems to me that terrorists will always engage and kill soft targets first. Shopping malls, school buses, etc.
 
#47
#47
MG1968 said:
did the Patriots target innocent civilians? did the IRA?

seems to me that terrorists will always engage and kill soft targets first. Shopping malls, school buses, etc.
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Firstly, weaponry has advanced exponentially during the time span between the revolution and the existence of the IRA and MK. The Patriots and IRA did carry out violent actions against civilians at various points, though neither to the extent of the MK. The comparison is apples to oranges though.

I think one could make a case that without armed rebellion and guerrilla warfare, apartheid governance would still exist in South Africa or at least carried on for much longer, and that armed rebellion that happened to occur in a time and place when civilian casualties were practically unavoidable. Do I find some actions by the MK abhorrent? Yes. Do I subscribe to the idea that continuation of apartheid was the best option for the sake of non-violence? No. It's very much a 'do the ends justify the means' type of situation.

Back to the thread at hand, perfect example of why the 2nd amendment is a good thing.
 
#48
#48
milohimself said:
Firstly, weaponry has advanced exponentially during the time span between the revolution and the existence of the IRA and MK. The Patriots and IRA did carry out violent actions against civilians at various points, though neither to the extent of the MK. The comparison is apples to oranges though.

I think one could make a case that without armed rebellion and guerrilla warfare, apartheid governance would still exist in South Africa or at least carried on for much longer, and that armed rebellion that happened to occur in a time and place when civilian casualties were practically unavoidable. Do I find some actions by the MK abhorrent? Yes. Do I subscribe to the idea that continuation of apartheid was the best option for the sake of non-violence? No. It's very much a 'do the ends justify the means' type of situation.

Back to the thread at hand, perfect example of why the 2nd amendment is a good thing.
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2nd ammendment is a great thing when used correctly.
 
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