TN and UConn in talks to resume series

[WVU05UT09]

I am curious why we would ask Geno to revive the series if we had good reason to retire the series. What kind of response did we expect from Geno?
He does not need to play us. We have already given him the upper hand by looking like we were afraid to play him. This is perception.

I agree completely. Geno is smarter than our people by half. This is a game and he is two steps ahead of us at every turn.

Our program may be right and have the moral high ground on why we accused Geno of cheating but we refused to share our factual basis for this charge with the general public. Perhaps we did not share for good reasons (i.e. Pat protecting her former players) but when we refused to go there it made us look petty, scared, and like a brat that didn't get our way so we took our ball and went home. That's the perception outside of Tennessee. I'd say Geno is guilty as sin (along with many others in the game), but he knows the public doesn't know that. So Holly, comes and asks him if he wants to play? Of course he is going to ask for an apology...duh. Its in essence the 9th inning of this game and he is saying put up or shut up once and for all. What was Holly thinking? What was Tennessee thinking allowing her to (a) go forward with that question and (b) making it public.

 

[brassie]

The series usually went according to who had the superstar player(s). When Pat had the 3 'meeks' UT won, and again when she had CP. UConn won when Geno had Rebecca Lobo, then again with Diana Taurasi and Maya Moore. Right now UConn has the better players starting w/ Breanna Stewart, and if Geno gets A'ja Wilson, Holly should definitely not want any part of UConn.

Correct - and that leads to another speculation about why the series was cancelled. When Moore chose UConn Coach Summitt could see the writing on the wall. The possibility of another 3-4 championships going to UConn -further eroding her legacy was too much to stomach.

Not my theory but not outside the realm of possibility.

 

[Amb3096]

I can see this as being a one sided coin...We have nothing to win in this process. UConn will get some form of consideration for putting Tennessee in its place by beating them on a regular basis. Yes it would probably be good for UConn, not so much for Tennessee.

I agree. Tennessee gets enough quality non-conference games. They will get no benefit from putting UConn on their schedule and getting whipped by 40 pts every year...because Geno will be out to make a point.

Frankly speaking, UConn needs quality OOC games more than Tennessee does. Why do them a favor if it doesn't benefit Tennessee?

 

[Amb3096]

This is what SUPPOSEDLY happened. Maya Moore was all but committed to U.T. But Geno convinced her and her grandmother to visit UConn.

While there, Geno lied to Maya Moore's grandmother and told her that the entire Lady Vols coaching staff were lesbians. So, her grandmother told her to NOT go to U.T.

Negative recruiting!!!!!!!


Maya Moore at UConn and they win championships. Maya Moore NOT at U.T. and we don't go past the Sweet 16!


There is your big secret that nobody wants to talk about.

Since speculation passed off as facts seems to be the name of the game here, does anyone look at Maya Moore and NOT see a lesbian? So her "grandmother" didn't want her lesbian "grand daughter" to play at UT because the coaching staff is rampant with women just like her? Ok, then!

Like UT, UConn is a pre-eminent program in WCBB. Most girls would sell their left kidney to get a chance to play for a program of their caliber. Much like Pat, all Geno has to do is point at the banners hanging from the rafters and the WNBA rosters chock full of former players, and that would be enough to get the majority of players willing to leave home.

For a fanbase that supposedly likes to take the high road, there seems to be no shortage of people willing to stoop to the same levels that they accuse Geno of.

 

[Dave1967]

Since speculation passed off as facts seems to be the name of the game here, does anyone look at Maya Moore and NOT see a lesbian? So her "grandmother" didn't want her lesbian "grand daughter" to play at UT because the coaching staff is rampant with women just like her? Ok, then!

Like UT, UConn is a pre-eminent program in WCBB. Most girls would sell their left kidney to get a chance to play for a program of their caliber. Much like Pat, all Geno has to do is point at the banners hanging from the rafters and the WNBA rosters chock full of former players, and that would be enough to get the majority of players willing to leave home.

For a fanbase that supposedly likes to take the high road, there seems to be no shortage of people willing to stoop to the same levels that they accuse Geno of.

I think most of the women coaches in women's college basketball are lesbian or bisexual. It's probably been that way since it became a big time sport in the late 70s-early 80s.:hi:

 

[Amb3096]

I think most of the women coaches in women's college basketball are lesbian or bisexual. It's probably been that way since it became a big time sport in the late 70s-early 80s.:hi:

Exactly. So the notion that Geno used the "Fear the Lesbos" scare tactic for recruiting players over Tennessee is ridiculous...considering many of those players were lesbians themselves.

I was always of the notion that Geno purchased Maya. It seems people here think otherwise and are instead adding fire to a what I see is a ridiculous rumor.

 

[Dave1967]

Exactly. So the notion that Geno used the "Fear the Lesbos" scare tactic for recruiting players over Tennessee is ridiculous...considering many of those players were lesbians themselves.

I was always of the notion that Geno purchased Maya. It seems people here think otherwise and are instead adding fire to a what I see is a ridiculous rumor.

Geno bought Maya it goes on a hell of a lot in college basketball and football.

 

[Amb3096]

Geno bought Maya it goes on a hell of a lot in college basketball and football.

Right...Maya's mom has a house in CT and a store on UConn's website. I mean, you can't prove anything, but it sure looks that way. So why people here are saying this is NOT the case and that the real reason is that Geno was bad mouthing lesbians to a lesbian player and the lesbian player's mom is just :crazy:

 

[SGMVols]

“I asked him if he wanted to play,” Warlick said. “He said he would if I apologized to his fans, former players, Maya Moore, her mother. I’m not going to do that.”

When asked Tuesday if an apology was a prerequisite, Auriemma said: “I want to make sure that we set the record straight.

It appears to me Geno is not really interested in resuming the series. In asking for an apology before the series could resume, he put a requisite out there that he knew HW would have to refuse.

What incentive does he really have to play us now? He's so far ahead of everyone that from his perspective, Tennessee might as well be Tennessee Tech.

 

[SGMVols]

The series usually went according to who had the superstar player(s). When Pat had the 3 'meeks' UT won, and again when she had CP. UConn won when Geno had Rebecca Lobo, then again with Diana Taurasi and Maya Moore. Right now UConn has the better players starting w/ Breanna Stewart, and if Geno gets A'ja Wilson, Holly should definitely not want any part of UConn.

If he gets Wilson then he'll be the first coach to ever have a triple-digit win streak.

 

[Amb3096]

What incentive does he really have to play us now? He's so far ahead of everyone that from his perspective, Tennessee might as well be Tennessee Tech.

He's playing in a weak @ss conference. He needs marquee OOC games. No telling how long Duke will continue to play them for their annual blow out, and Kim may elect to follow their lead now that Sims is gone. If UConn doesn't get ND, then they will be in really tough shape.

Tennessee may have taken a step down, but they still have the name. Geno knows he needs as many big names as possible leading up to January.

Personally, I think Holly should pass. If you can't beat 'em, starve 'em!

 

[WVU05UT09]

Right...Maya's mom has a house in CT and a store on UConn's website. I mean, you can't prove anything, but it sure looks that way. So why people here are saying this is NOT the case and that the real reason is that Geno was bad mouthing lesbians to a lesbian player and the lesbian player's mom is just :crazy:

If it revolved around a house in Connecticut and a store for her on UConn's website then why in the world do we continue to perpetuate this "we aren't talking about it" line. Just say it and all the speculation, all the back and forth between the programs goes away. UConn will disagree with those reasons but at least it provides some support and sufficient justification to what Pat has been saying all of these years.

Could it have been we didn't have the hard evidence to support this? Possibly, in which case I think we would have been better advised to just be quiet.

Its the lack of justification for the cheating line that perpetuates the rumors and theories. Typically if you throw a charge out like that you bring the ammo to back it up.

 

[Amb3096]

If it revolved around a house in Connecticut and a store for her on UConn's website then why in the world do we continue to perpetuate this "we aren't talking about it" line. Just say it and all the speculation, all the back and forth between the programs goes away. UConn will disagree with those reasons but at least it provides some support and sufficient justification to what Pat has been saying all of these years.

Could it have been we didn't have the hard evidence to support this? Possibly, in which case I think we would have been better advised to just be quiet.

Its the lack of justification for the cheating line that perpetuates the rumors and theories. Typically if you throw a charge out like that you bring the ammo to back it up.

I agree. I remember hearing about the anti recruiting tactics in an article a few years back, but I didn't think anyone gave serious consideration to it. However, it seems that in the absence of evidence, there are some bitter fans who are now spinning a different (and utterly ridiculous) tale and demanding that naysayers provide evidence that it ISN'T true.

Continued behavior like this makes our fanbase look bad, not theirs.

 

[livefaith]

This can't be serious? Please explain under what premise you think YOU or any of the fans are entitled to that information. I would love to know the exact details about what happened to quench my curiosity. Outside of curiosity, there is certainly no 'claim' fans have over this information. Get over yourself.

It's not that complicated. But here goes.
IF what caused this cancellation is a coaches rift (we all assume this), then here are the two possibilities that I can see:

Possibility #1: It's a personal offense or offenses based on personalities of coaches. Nothing illegal, just a pi$$ing contest. If this is the case, then the ADs should do their job and keep the program > than the personality. This is akin to having a salesman at a store / dealership who gets offended and tells your best customer to go look elsewhere. The idea that a personality is > program should never be accepted, whether its CPS or Derek Dooley. It matters not.
In no way should this scenario be accepted. It should be resolved by professionals.

Possibility #2: Something "illegal" (violation of rules) took place and caused someone (UT or UConn staffs) to object and refuse to partake. Then by covering a known violation(s), the one who covers the violation and refuses to have it dealt with under the light becomes a type of shieldbor protector of the transgression(s).
Furthermore, why would either staff throw their program under the bus because the other was "cheating"? That is a ridiculous solution. Almost like not doing business with people who you think break the law. Why punish your business (program) b/c of the moral weakness of your customer (competitor). IMO, if the ADs of each school saw this happening, then they are obligated to make it right by rectifying the violations and immediately continuing the series.

If another scenario is in play, then I'm all ears. I can't foresee one. This ain't @ me, its @ being a fan of UT and how fans view the leadership of their team.

Dooley failed as a coach and I (and a few others I might add) thought we needed a change. When something appears wrong, then fans who invest in the product have be very right to express their displeasure.

When two staffs are playing a " Were punishing our programs (and the sport BTW) over something that we won't actually talk about (read, just trust me.)" game, then fans of both profs should cry BS immediately. What if Dooley were somehow able to cancel the Bama game over a fued "caused" by Nick? Would you be OK with him when he justified it by saying "just trust me BC they are wrong, but I'm not telling why"? No way on earth!!!

Regardless of whether Pat killed the first cow to hand stitch the first women's bball, went undefeated her whole career, and beat Geno by 60+ every game, this is still REDICULOUS.

There is no justification for silence in either case above. Fans should stop being blinded by hall of famers who are not acting properly in this situation. It's not personal when you cancel the hallmark series of WCBB. It's business, so act professional. Its your job.

 

[livefaith]

Personally, I think Holly should pass. If you can't beat 'em, starve 'em!

Mr. Hamilton, is that you?

 

[bamacheats]

Ripping on people for "baseless rumors" and then constantly calling someone a lesbian as a matter of fact, who to my knowledge hasn't admitted it, takes dumbassery to a level I thought not possible.

 

[Amb3096]

Mr. Hamilton, is that you?

Not sure who the Mr. Hamilton you are referring to is, and admittedly I made my comment tongue in cheek...but at this point Holly nor Tennessee has anything to gain.

Once Holly puts together a solid team that isn't losing to practically every top 10 team they play, THEN she can consider putting UConn on the schedule if she has a chance to knock them down a peg.

For all the talk about Geno's shady recruiting tactics, if I were him and was looking for ways to diminish Tennessee during recruiting, all I'd have to say is, "Look at my OOC schedule. I'm not afraid to play the best. In fact, Tennessee cancelled our series because they were afraid of us." THAT would be more effective recruiting then saying that UT is a lesbian factory when probably half of his team are dykes to begin with :banghead2:

 

[livefaith]

Exactly. So the notion that Geno used the "Fear the Lesbos" scare tactic for recruiting players over Tennessee is ridiculous...considering many of those players were lesbians themselves.

I was always of the notion that Geno purchased Maya. It seems people here think otherwise and are instead adding fire to a what I see is a ridiculous rumor.

This outlines the entire problem with this. Because the two staffs are in a "DC style coverrup" concerning the facts, the rumors abound. All they have to do is lay out exactly WHY and the crazy theories / rumors end.

Immediately.

Here you are expressing a notion that I doubt you have one shred of facts to back up. Yet, in the same paragraph slamming people for expressing unverifiable notions that differ from your own.
I'm not trashing, but pointing out the fact that its these two staffs that should be held accountable for creating this vacuum.

 

[Amb3096]

Ripping on people for "baseless rumors" and then constantly calling someone a lesbian as a matter of fact, who to my knowledge hasn't admitted it, takes dumbassery to a level I thought not possible.

As does spreading rumors and then challenging people to prove it's not true. The key difference is you add massively high levels of hypocrisy to go along with dumbassery.

 

[livefaith]

Warlick is not very astute. Should we start playing connecticut again at some point? Yes. Should we start playing them now? No! We've fallen to a second tier program; why would we want to confirm that fact for the world by getting our butt kicked by geno? I want to say that Warlick should focus on putting a better basketball team on the court, but I'm not optimistic that she can.

I tend to agree with your coaching premise. But instead of running away from the series, we should go about fixing our problems that have caused us to slip to tier #2, ASAP. Don't run from the fight, otherwise the sport loses appeal.

 

[Amb3096]

This outlines the entire problem with this. Because the two staffs are in a "DC style coverrup" concerning the facts, the rumors abound. All they have to do is lay out exactly WHY and the crazy theories / rumors end.

Immediately.

Here you are expressing a notion that I doubt you have one shred of facts to back up. Yet, in the same paragraph slamming people for expressing unverifiable notions that differ from your own.
I'm not trashing, but pointing out the fact that its these two staffs that should be held accountable for creating this vacuum.

I will fully admit that I'm speculating. I'm not trashing Geno, nor claiming that what I have to say is gospel. As an observer, I'll comment that it looks like UConn (not necessarily Geno) hooked up Maya's mom, but I won't go so far as to say that I know that for a fact.

My reaction to the comments about the lesbian factory is the way they are positioning it as the god forsaken truth. That's no different than UConn fans saying that Pat runs a lesbian factory and that's a FACT.

But yes, I agree that as a fanbase, we'd be better off dropping the whole "Geno is a cheater" thing altogether in the absence of facts.

 

[Rudy123]

I tend to agree with your coaching premise. But instead of running away from the series, we should go about fixing our problems that have caused us to slip to tier #2, ASAP. Don't run from the fight, otherwise the sport loses appeal.

Turn overs are killing us. Have to limit them in order to get back to the higher level of competition.


Also, I am sure that we are getting the players that UConn is not very interested in or the one's that UConn is half heartedly recruiting.

Can't remember when we won a recruiting battle with UConn in the recent past.....

 

[Rudy123]

Not sure who the Mr. Hamilton you are referring to is, and admittedly I made my comment tongue in cheek...but at this point Holly nor Tennessee has anything to gain.

Once Holly puts together a solid team that isn't losing to practically every top 10 team they play, THEN she can consider putting UConn on the schedule if she has a chance to knock them down a peg.

For all the talk about Geno's shady recruiting tactics, if I were him and was looking for ways to diminish Tennessee during recruiting, all I'd have to say is, "Look at my OOC schedule. I'm not afraid to play the best. In fact, Tennessee cancelled our series because they were afraid of us." THAT would be more effective recruiting then saying that UT is a lesbian factory when probably half of his team are dykes to begin with :banghead2:

Okay, lets say that we put them on the schedule again.
Then we lose to them 7 out of 10 games. Geno can't say that we are afraid to play them but he can say, "We own them"

 

[Rudy123]

If it revolved around a house in Connecticut and a store for her on UConn's website then why in the world do we continue to perpetuate this "we aren't talking about it" line. Just say it and all the speculation, all the back and forth between the programs goes away. UConn will disagree with those reasons but at least it provides some support and sufficient justification to what Pat has been saying all of these years.

Could it have been we didn't have the hard evidence to support this? Possibly, in which case I think we would have been better advised to just be quiet.

Its the lack of justification for the cheating line that perpetuates the rumors and theories. Typically if you throw a charge out like that you bring the ammo to back it up.

"Bring the ammo to back it up" Well, that is probably why Pat never said anything pubicly about it.

It was probably an embarrassing thing that happened and she knew that it happened but couldn't prove it when it came under scrutiny.

"Geno bought Maya's committment" or " Geno negative recruited by saying U.T.'s coaching staff are all lesbians, except for Dean"

Mentioning either of those situations without verifiable proof would not be good.

OR

Mentioning the lesbian rumor would cause the media to start snooping around into her coaching staffs personal life to prove or dis prove it. What assistant coach wants to have the media snooping around your friends, family, neighbors, church members, etc. etc.????

 

[Amb3096]

Turn overs are killing us. Have to limit them in order to get back to the higher level of competition.


Also, I am sure that we are getting the players that UConn is not very interested in or the one's that UConn is half heartedly recruiting.

Can't remember when we won a recruiting battle with UConn in the recent past.....

These are the players that Tennessee got that UConn was also recruiting (fairly heavily IIRC)

Ariel Massengale
Taber Spani
Alicia Manning
Angie Bjorklund

Of course, UConn got Elena Della Donne and Maya Moore...

If Tennessee gets A'ja Wilson, that will be the first significant recruiting battle that Tennessee has won. Having said that and seeing her in the McD game, she doesn't look like a game changer along the lines of Parker, Moore, EDD, Griner or Stewart. Those are the kinds of battles I'd like to see Tennessee win.