UNC-Wake Game

#57
#57
BigPapaVol said:
last year when thy murdered Louisville and then made a furious comeback against KU. This season, they haven't.
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I wouldn't say they murdered Louisville. They won by 10 but it was a tie-game until the last few minutes when Hansbrough went off and Lawson hit a three off a set inbounds play. As far as the KU game, furious comeback or not, that game was over in the first half when KU took a 40-12 lead. Sure, UNC was able to cut it to 5 or whatever in the 2nd half, but they were never going to win that game -- not after getting behind by 28. Not against a team like Kansas.

Two things that those KU and WF teams have in common. Both teams were longer and more athletic than UNC. No amount of defensive intensity was going to make Wayne Ellington be able to increase his lateral quickness or Tyler Hansbrough increase his reach. Under Roy Williams' system, UNC's only chance in both those games was to out-offense those teams. Works 80% of the time, but not those nights.
 
#58
#58
notverycrucial said:
I wouldn't say they murdered Louisville. They won by 10 but it was a tie-game until the last few minutes when Hansbrough went off and Lawson hit a three off a set inbounds play. As far as the KU game, furious comeback or not, that game was over in the first half when KU took a 40-12 lead. Sure, UNC was able to cut it to 5 or whatever in the 2nd half, but they were never going to win that game -- not after getting behind by 28. Not against a team like Kansas.

Two things that those KU and WF teams have in common. Both teams were longer and more athletic than UNC. No amount of defensive intensity was going to make Wayne Ellington be able to increase his lateral quickness or Tyler Hansbrough increase his reach. Under Roy Williams' system, UNC's only chance in both those games was to out-offense those teams. Works 80% of the time, but not those nights.
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good attempt at an analysis, but it comes down to effort and focus and consequences. it's pretty simple.
 
#61
#61
notverycrucial said:
I doubt that. btw, when was the last time they played a team ranked as highly as Wake Forest?
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Maybe not as high as #4...but they have murdered 2 top 10 teams this year...on the road

I don't know what has gotten into UNC...on the surface it would appear that they have become complacent after blowing out the first 13 teams they faced(including...like I said....2 top 10 teams)...but that excuse only works for young teams IMO...

This is one of if not the most experienced team in the country...it's hard for me to believe that complacency is their problem....

I agree with BPV...when they play hard they are the best team in the country...but if this recent rut they have hit has shown anything it is that they have a tendency to not match the other teams intensity...which is beyond me considering their collective level of experience...

Another thing I have noticed in this recent slide is how bad their defense has been....early in the season it looked as if this UNC team would actually play some good, hard defense...but against BC they were challenged and they didn't step up their defensive intensity...it was like they degressed back to their old form...

Then you think that game might be a wakeup call...but lo and behold the same thing happens at Wake

I still think UNC is the team to beat...but unlike before I think there are a handful of teams that have a serious shot at knocking them off in the tournament...I'm not even sure I would call it an upset if it happened after the Sweet 16
 
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#62
#62
blamie said:
Maybe not as high as #4...but they have murdered 2 top 10 teams this year...on the road

I don't know what has gotten into UNC...on the surface it would appear that they have become complacent after blowing out the first 13 teams they faced(including...like I said....2 top 10 teams)...but that excuse only works for young teams IMO...

This is one of if not the most experienced team in the country...it's hard for me to believe that complacency is their problem....

I agree with BPV...when they play hard they are the best team in the country...but if this recent rut they have hit has shown anything it is that they have a tendency to not match the other teams intensity...which is beyond me considering their collective level of experience...

Another thing I have noticed in this recent slide is how bad their defense has been....early in the season it looked as if this UNC team would actually play some good, hard defense...but against BC they were challenged and they didn't step up their defensive intensity...it was like they degressed back to their old form...

Then you think that game might be a wakeup call...but lo and behold the same thing happens at Wake

I still think UNC is the team to beat...but unlike before I think there are a handful of teams that have a serious shot at knocking them off in the tournament...I'm not even sure I would call it an upset if it happened after the Sweet 16
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UNC's defense did not suddenly disappear against Wake Forest (or even BC) as some on here seem to imply. It was the offense that disappeared. Yes, they still managed to score 89 points against Wake, but PPP were way down compared to earlier games. UNC does not match up well against athletic penetrating guards. IMO, it's not an 'effort' or an 'intensity' thing, it's a personnel thing. As I said earlier, Wayne Ellington can try all he wants but he is not going to sprout wings.

Teams like Wake and BC are always going to give UNC trouble. Last year, Tyrese Rice torched them for 46 points leading BC to an 18-point second half lead. This year, he practically did the same thing. And Jeff Teague was unstoppable without defensive stopper Marcus Ginyard on the floor. Even then, UNC could've won both of those games if they're able to hit a few more shots down the stretch. Can't shoot 35% against ACC caliber teams and expect to win.

FWIW, I'm not discounting UNC's earlier "road" wins (they were technically neutral sites) against two Top 10 teams. However, it should be noted that neither Notre Dame or MSU was at full strength for those games (Harongody had pneumonia and MSU did not have senior center Goran Suton).

UNC is still my favorite to win it all, but they no longer have the inside track for #1 seed in the East. (they've never won without it) Right now, it looks like they'll need to beat Duke twice in order to get it back. It's possible, but not a position I envy.
 
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#63
#63
notverycrucial said:
UNC's defense did not suddenly disappear against Wake Forest (or even BC) as some on here seem to imply. It was the offense that disappeared. Yes, they still managed to score 89 points against Wake, but PPP were way down compared to earlier games. UNC does not match up well against athletic penetrating guards. IMO, it's not an 'effort' or an 'intensity' thing, it's a personnel thing. As I said earlier, Wayne Ellington can try all he wants but he is not going to sprout wings.

Teams like Wake and BC are always going to give UNC trouble. Last year, Tyrese Rice torched them for 46 points leading BC to an 18-point second half lead. This year, he practically did the same thing. And Jeff Teague was unstoppable without defensive stopper Marcus Ginyard on the floor. Even then, UNC could've won both of those games if they're able to hit a few more shots down the stretch. Can't shoot 35% against ACC caliber teams and expect to win.

FWIW, I'm not discounting UNC's earlier "road" wins (they were technically neutral sites) against two Top 10 teams. However, it should be noted that neither Notre Dame or MSU was at full strength for those games (Harongody had pneumonia and MSU did not have senior center Goran Suton).

UNC is still my favorite to win it all, but they no longer have the inside track for #1 seed in the East. (they've never won without it) Right now, it looks like they'll need to beat Duke twice in order to get it back. It's possible, but not a position I envy.
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The luster of "best team ever" or "possibly going undefeated" has defintely disappeared hasn't it...

It's kind of amazing...1 and 1/2 weeks ago they looked unstoppable....now nobody is sure if they're the #1, 2, 3, or even 4th best team....in their conference!!
 
#64
#64
blamie said:
The luster of "best team ever" or "possibly going undefeated" has defintely disappeared hasn't it...

It's kind of amazing...1 and 1/2 weeks ago they looked unstoppable....now nobody is sure if they're the #1, 2, 3, or even 4th best team....in their conference!!
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I never believed for a second they were the best team ever or had more than the slightest chance of going undefeated. Still, the landscape in college basketball is much different this year than last. Because of that, they have a better chance than most recent UNC national champions -- even though they're not as talented as those teams.
 
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