Union-Busting Turns WI Schoo Right Side Up

[n_huffhines]

lmao

The Kaukauna School District, in the Fox River Valley of Wisconsin near Appleton, has about 4,200 students and about 400 employees. It has struggled in recent times and this year faced a deficit of $400,000. But after the law went into effect, at 12:01 a.m. Wednesday, school officials put in place new policies they estimate will turn that $400,000 deficit into a $1.5 million surplus. And it's all because of the very provisions that union leaders predicted would be disastrous.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/07/union-busting-is-godsend-elimination-of.html

 

[n_huffhines]

Damn it, I messed up the word "school" in a thread title about education....

 

[milohimself]

Nah, it's coo.

 

[JTrainDavis]

Good read, not surprising at all.

Teachers' unions did not want this of course. Why? Because they are blatant liars that's why. There is not a damn thing unions do for kids. Every action by public unions is for public unions and no one else.

Sums things up well.

 

[BigPapaVol]

I agree with many of the points, but I don't buy all the numbers. I think the numbers will dramatically improve, but these seem to be CBO type WAGs.

 

[Vol Mania 21]

It's on the interwebs, its 100% fact
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[n_huffhines]

I agree with many of the points, but I don't buy all the numbers. I think the numbers will dramatically improve, but these seem to be CBO type WAGs.

The savings on health insurance alone should be phenomenal.

 

[n_huffhines]

It's information, it's 100% fact
Posted via VolNation Mobile

FYP. To me it makes no difference if it's in the paper, a book, or on the web. I take everything with a grain of salt.

 

[BigPapaVol]

The savings on health insurance alone should be phenomenal.

at those incremental percentages with only 400 employees? The employees are only paying an incremental 2.9%. The pension money is probably the bigger help.

 

[Vol Mania 21]

FYP. To me i t makes no difference if it's in the paper, a book, or on the web. I take everything with a grain of salt.

Ur sarcasm meter must be broke
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[n_huffhines]

Ur sarcasm meter must be broke
Posted via VolNation Mobile

How do you figure? You were saying (sarcastically) that information on the web can be inaccurate. I responded by saying no matter the medium, information isn't necessarily reliable. For instance, wikipedia and Encyclopedia Britannica are very close in terms of accuracy.

 

[n_huffhines]

What's funny is the unions always have said the way to improve the schools is get smaller classrooms.

Then there are work rules. "In the collective bargaining agreement, high school teachers only had to teach five periods a day, out of seven," says Arnoldussen. "Now, they're going to teach six." In addition, the collective bargaining agreement specified that teachers had to be in the school 37 1/2 hours a week. Now, it will be 40 hours.

The changes mean Kaukauna can reduce the size of its classes -- from 31 students to 26 students in high school and from 26 students to 23 students in elementary school.

 

[KiffinKiller]

How do you figure? You were saying (sarcastically) that information on the web can be inaccurate. I responded by saying no matter the medium, information isn't necessarily reliable. For instance, wikipedia and Encyclopedia Britannica are very close in terms of accuracy.

Except when wiki is edited by zealots with a cause.

 

[n_huffhines]

Except when wiki is edited by zealots with a cause.

Wiki polices itself, though. For instance if it's an item that might be found in Encyclopedia Britannica (like a George Washington page), it will be pretty dang accurate. If it's a wiki page about something you wouldn't find in Britanica (like maybe an Aaron Douglas page) the information tends to be less reliable.

 

[TruthIsOutThere]

I'm cool with some union busting - but I'd like to see some good old fashioned trust busting too! First up, Banks!
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[tvolsfan]

I was glad to see a similar law past in Ohio, but I have a bad feeling it's going to get killed by the voters.

 

[OrangeYankee]

at those incremental percentages with only 400 employees? The employees are only paying an incremental 2.9%. The pension money is probably the bigger help.

I agree, however the other factor is the fact that they could shop Health Insurance providers too and were able to bring down the prices on that as well. So not only are they paying a slightly less percentage of the overall bill, the overall bill could be much smaller too.

I'm curious to see how this bill in Tennessee goes... I work in public education, but not as a teacher. And the teachers are put on pedestals while the rest of us are rows that are just there to baby and serve them.

 

[MG1968]

What's funny is the unions always have said the way to improve the schools is get smaller classrooms.

is there any evidence that smaller class sizes result in better education?

 

[BeecherVol]

is there any evidence that smaller class sizes result in better education?

Not sure, but I would have to imagine the teacher has an agenda here to have less in their classes to deal with as much as anything.

 

[IPorange]

There's quite a bit of evidence to the opposite effect (larger class room sizes decrease education quality). Obviously there must be thresholds,though. I have taught classes ranging from 15 to 30. 15 is a bit small and not necessary, 30 can get crazy.

 

[MG1968]

then how do colleges and universities do it?

 

[volinbham]

then how do colleges and universities do it?

depends on the course. most of mine are in the 30-40 range. for the big ones (over 100) there are generally some TAs that help with the grading.

for other classes with a lot of individual attention we cap them under 30.

 

[MG1968]

depends on the course. most of mine are in the 30-40 range. for the big ones (over 100) there are generally some TAs that help with the grading.

for other classes with a lot of individual attention we cap them under 30.

that's what I mean, public school advocates scream about smaller class size being the way to salvation, but I think what it's really about is smaller class sizes mean more classes, hence more teachers, and more union dues paying members of the NEA or AFT

 

[milohimself]

that's what I mean, public school advocates scream about smaller class size being the way to salvation, but I think what it's really about is smaller class sizes mean more classes, hence more teachers, and more union dues paying members of the NEA or AFT

That's true, but there is also truth to the fact that classes with 15-20 are better for everyone involved (except I guess the taxpayer). In college, big early courses (your 101's, 201's etc) do have an advantage with 100-200 people in a lecture hall in that most of the face to face stuff is done with TA's outside the class, and underclassmen at least get to know who some of the senior faculty is. That 40:1 student:teacher ratio that HS's are heading for (at least here) is kind of a no man's land.

 

[sjt18]

then how do colleges and universities do it?

You are dealing with adults responsible for their own education. I am not proposing a set age but sometime between 15 and 18 most college bound kids learn to be responsible for more of their own learning. Less mature kids need more outside motivation.