US has more people in prison then China and Russia....combined

[joevol320]

The problem is those people who think there is a war on drugs. There isn't. Can't be. Drugs are an inanimate object. Our government has declared war on its own citizens: the people who want to peacefully put in their own bodies what they choose of their own free will, and the people who want to enter into freely chosen commerce and provide those substances.

Jack Daniels doesn't knock off Jim Beam distributors. Bud doesn't burn down stores that sell Corona. Things like that did happen during prohibition, just like with drug prohibition.


I wonder how much of the other crimes listed in that chart are a result of drugs being illegal? I have read studies that show that a large portion of violent crimes are not what we call drug-related, but are still a result of drugs. For example, muggings are often the result of some idiot who can't, or thinks he can't, legally make enough money to buy his drugs, so he resorts to robbery. If drugs were legal, they would cost a lot less, and that would lower crimes like this as well.

i completely see your point, that person who's legally taking meth or angel dust, while driving a semi has very good odds that he'll not kill a bunch of people.

 

[KiffinKiller]

i completely see your point, that person who's legally taking meth or angel dust, while driving a semi has very good odds that he'll not kill a bunch of people.

agree. The business I'm in monitors our drivers regularly. They take coke so they can stay awake longer (thus drive longer before requiring rest).

 

[WA_Vol]

The problem is those people who think there is a war on drugs. There isn't. Can't be. Drugs are an inanimate object. Our government has declared war on its own citizens: the people who want to peacefully put in their own bodies what they choose of their own free will, and the people who want to enter into freely chosen commerce and provide those substances.

Jack Daniels doesn't knock off Jim Beam distributors. Bud doesn't burn down stores that sell Corona. Things like that did happen during prohibition, just like with drug prohibition.


I wonder how much of the other crimes listed in that chart are a result of drugs being illegal? I have read studies that show that a large portion of violent crimes are not what we call drug-related, but are still a result of drugs. For example, muggings are often the result of some idiot who can't, or thinks he can't, legally make enough money to buy his drugs, so he resorts to robbery. If drugs were legal, they would cost a lot less, and that would lower crimes like this as well.

Great post.
Now can someone convince our politicians.

 

[MystifyingVol]

Legalize it all, every last bit of it. Marijuana, Cocaine, Meth, Heroin, everything. Spend the money used to incarceration on rehabilitation, it's more humane. People are using these drugs NOW despite the fact that they are illegal. All that does is increase the power of the drug cartels and increase crime (see Prohibition). Bring the black market above ground and tax the proceeds.

What someone does to their own body shouldn't be a crime, it should only become a crime when you infringe on someone elses rights. Now, if you commit a crime while under the influence, then the applicable crime should be prosecuted under the appropriate laws (e.g. drunk driving and killing someone).

The National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine conducted a study in 1999 where they determined that "In sum, there is little evidence that decriminalization of marijuana use necessarily leads to a substantial increase in marijuana use." Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base. National Academy Press: Washington, D.C., 102.

The statistics from a country where they did do partial legalization follows:

In 2004, 54.1% of the Federal prison population was drug related. I couldn't find state information, I'm sure the percentages are similar. Since 80's, when the War on Drugs went into effect, the percentage has increased drastically year over year:

In 2001 dollars, that 54.1% (on the Federal level only) cost us $1,762,285,944 to house. This doesn't included enforcement or judicial costs. I guarantee that legalization would raise more than that in taxes.

 

[RespectTradition]

i completely see your point, that person who's legally taking meth or angel dust, while driving a semi has very good odds that he'll not kill a bunch of people.

probably about the same odds as those taking them illegally now.

Is it possible to make a substance legal but still regulate it's use, a la alcohol?

 

[RespectTradition]

America does not provide liberty. Liberty is an unalienable right; the best America could argue for is that it protects the expression of liberty. Unfortunately, while it might secure this right more than some other countries cannot exactly stand on principle since it does plenty to infringe upon this right, while somehow declaring itself to be some "Beacon on a hill" or "Bastion of liberty".

It is impossible for a govt to give liberty. All it can do is take it away. The best we can hope for is that our govt takes as little as possible.

 

[WA_Vol]

It is impossible for a govt to give liberty. All it can do is take it away. The best we can hope for is that our govt takes as little as possible.

The govt does too much.
It's not the govt responsibility to find people jobs, food, clothing. That's an individual's responsibility.

 

[RespectTradition]

The govt does too much.
It's not the govt responsibility to find people jobs, food, clothing. That's an individual's responsibility.

:clapping: :hi:

 

[WA_Vol]

Legalize it all, every last bit of it. Marijuana, Cocaine, Meth, Heroin, everything. Spend the money used to incarceration on rehabilitation, it's more humane. People are using these drugs NOW despite the fact that they are illegal. All that does is increase the power of the drug cartels and increase crime (see Prohibition). Bring the black market above ground and tax the proceeds.

What someone does to their own body shouldn't be a crime, it should only become a crime when you infringe on someone elses rights. Now, if you commit a crime while under the influence, then the applicable crime should be prosecuted under the appropriate laws (e.g. drunk driving and killing someone).

The National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine conducted a study in 1999 where they determined that "In sum, there is little evidence that decriminalization of marijuana use necessarily leads to a substantial increase in marijuana use." Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base. National Academy Press: Washington, D.C., 102.

The statistics from a country where they did do partial legalization follows:

In 2004, 54.1% of the Federal prison population was drug related. I couldn't find state information, I'm sure the percentages are similar. Since 80's, when the War on Drugs went into effect, the percentage has increased drastically year over year:

In 2001 dollars, that 54.1% (on the Federal level only) cost us $1,762,285,944 to house. This doesn't included enforcement or judicial costs. I guarantee that legalization would raise more than that in taxes.

Pretty interesting graph

 

[milohimself]

Great post there. Rehab the users, incarcerate the distributors.

 

[gsvol]

US has more people in prison then China and Russia....combined

I don't see why some of you people constantly want to dwell on stupid socialist talking points.

:loco:

What your links fail to mention are the 50 to 100
million people those two countries put to death.

I doubt either of your sources knows squat about
Russia's secret prisons or the inhuman treatment of
prisoners in China, some of whom have their organs
harvested for transplant after being put to death
over trivual matters.

If China had our laws there would be many who would
be put in prison for violation of child labor laws and
many of the adults work in what we would consider
inhuman conditions.

In a sense their whole country is a prison for much
of their population.