Using loopholes

#52
#52
allvol123 said:
He wants them released to help his hero. He is ok with such nonsense. If we actually know how much money Romney has earned we can assign some degree of evilness to him. More importantly hundreds of thousands of people can piss and moan about him paying less percentage points than did they. Even though that would still mean he probably paid hundreds of thousands more than 99% of them.
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You can be sarcastic all you want. The reality is that it is killing him politically.
 
#54
#54
Vol4LifeLCA said:
So Basically Romney is in a lose - lose situation. He either took advantage of all possible deductions to lower his tax obligation thus making him an evil out of touch 1 percenter or he didn't take advantage of all the different deductions available thus making him look incompetent since no smart business person voluntary gives the government more of their money to waste. Hmmm, I wonder why he hasn't released more tax returns?
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Your right. Its a lose-lose situation but not in the way you desire.

If he continues to refuse to release them, he looks shady and the Democrats can basically proxy whatever they want onto his hidden tax returns.

If he releases them, the Democrats are going to have access to whatever he obviously wants to hide from the general public.
 
#56
#56
LG please walk me through what you think would happen if Capital Gains were treated liked regualr income.

Please do a step by step walk through starting the second after the change was made.
 
#57
#57
NEOCON said:
LG please walk me through what you think would happen if Capital Gains were treated liked regualr income.

Please do a step by step walk through starting the second after the change was made.
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Neo you do realize that the capital gains was set at the same rate as the top income tax rate during the Reagan Administration, 28%.


edit: To add to this the top marginal income was lowered from 70% to 50% to 28% during his 2 terms.
The capital gains was lowered to 20% then raised back to 28%.
The debt went from 700 billion to 3 trillion also
 
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#58
#58
Gramps said:
Neo you do realize that the capital gains was set at the same rate as the top income tax rate during the Reagan Administration, 28%.
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It went from twenty to twenty and the top rate as u stated was much lower than today. It was also due to inflation not and out of control national debt. The middle class was also much larger then and the tax burden was not as lopsided. The structure of the economy was also very different then.

Also the stock market did nit play such a huge role in supp income back then.
 
#59
#59
NEOCON said:
It went from twenty to twenty and the top rate as u stated was much lower than today. It was also due to inflation not and out of control national debt. The middle class was also much larger then and the tax burden was not as lopsided. The structure of the economy was also very different then.

Also the stock market did nit play such a huge role in supp income back then.
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the capital gains went from 28% to 20% to 28% during the Reagan years.
Carter lowered the capital gains to 28%.
 
#60
#60
NEOCON said:
It went from twenty to twenty and the top rate as u stated was much lower than today. It was also due to inflation not and out of control national debt. The middle class was also much larger then and the tax burden was not as lopsided. The structure of the economy was also very different then.

Also the stock market did nit play such a huge role in supp income back then.
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The top marginal are was 70% . In 1981 it was lowered to 50%, then in 1986 it was lowered to 28%.

6 1/2 years of the Reagan Administration the top marginal rates were much higher than they are now.
 
#61
#61
Gramps said:
The top marginal are was 70% . In 1981 it was lowered to 50%, then in 1986 it was lowered to 28%.

6 1/2 years of the Reagan Administration the top marginal rates were much higher than they are now.
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I dont need a history lesson and u need to.pick when we are discussing. I stated it went from twenty to twenty eight. Didnt realize i had to mention carter too. But now answr my question i posed to lg since u stepped in.
 
#62
#62
Gramps am i suppose to care about tax rates during reagan? I asked a current question and we are talkink thirty years ago now. You cannot compre the two time periods.alot had changed.
 
#63
#63
By the way gramps gdp growth went from 3.9 to 3.1 when reagan raised it since were doing a history lesson. The decreasr would even be worse today.
 
#64
#64
NEOCON said:
Gramps am i suppose to care about tax rates during reagan? I asked a current question and we are talkink thirty years ago now. You cannot compre the two time periods.alot had changed.
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You were asking what would happen if capital gains and income at same rate.

They were at that time and we had growth
 
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#65
#65
NEOCON said:
I dont need a history lesson and u need to.pick when we are discussing. I stated it went from twenty to twenty eight.
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Below is a copy of your post....


* "Originally Posted by*NEOCON:
It went from twenty to twenty and the top rate as u stated was much lower than today. It was also due to inflation not and out of control national debt. The middle class was also much larger then and the tax burden was not as lopsided. The structure of the economy was also very different then.
""""'
 
#66
#66
On my phone a moron would realize i meant twenty to twenty eight. I figured u would too. From now on ill make sure to be more clear with u. My bad.
 
#69
#69
NEOCON said:
Easy to create a false arguement. Gee gramps. This is why i hate this place. so since wre talking answr thr question i posed. Pretty please.
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If the capital gains and income rates were all counted as ordinary income. Life would go on. People will still invest. History shows investors will invest. The problem now is the uncertainty.

it is very uncertain what the income rates or capital gains rates will be in 2013.

If capital gains was treated as ordinary income they would be eligible for the same tax deductions/loopholes as income tax.

Investors need to know what rules they are working under. That is the big issue. It isn't specific tax rate that is holding money on the sidelines.
 
#70
#70
wherever there is a chance of return there will be investors. Otherwise vegas would be out of business
 
#71
#71
I think one question you must ask yourself is what is the maximum percentage of someones income would you consider fair for the government to take. 10%?, 20%?, 30%? When the government taxes dividends and capital gain on the sale of stock the government is double taxing it. First, it is taxed at the corporate level and then again at the shareholder level. As a result, I would never support raising increasing the rate at which capital gains is taxed and have a hard time understanding anyones argument to the contrary.
 
#72
#72
Vol4LifeLCA said:
I think one question you must ask yourself is what is the maximum percentage of someones income would you consider fair for the government to take. 10%?, 20%?, 30%? When the government taxes dividends and capital gain on the sale of stock the government is double taxing it. First, it is taxed at the corporate level and then again at the shareholder level. As a result, I would never support raising increasing the rate at which capital gains is taxed and have a hard time understanding anyones argument to the contrary.
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I have stated my position on VN before.

I believe the corporate tax needs to be elimated. All deductions/loopholes elimated
with a flat tax on all income over the poverty level. I am not sure exactly where the rate needs to be, i have posted before at 20%. I also think the estate tax should be elimated. Our tax system could bring in the necessary monies needed without being so complicated.
No meaningful tax reform will be done.
Some members in congress talk a good game but they will support whatever the lobbiest with the deepest pockets wants them to.
 
#73
#73
Vol4LifeLCA said:
I think one question you must ask yourself is what is the maximum percentage of someones income would you consider fair for the government to take. 10%?, 20%?, 30%? When the government taxes dividends and capital gain on the sale of stock the government is double taxing it. First, it is taxed at the corporate level and then again at the shareholder level. As a result, I would never support raising increasing the rate at which capital gains is taxed and have a hard time understanding anyones argument to the contrary.
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It depends on what I am getting in return.
 
#74
#74
Gramps said:
I have stated my position on VN before.

I believe the corporate tax needs to be elimated. All deductions/loopholes elimated
with a flat tax on all income over the poverty level. I am not sure exactly where the rate needs to be, i have posted before at 20%. I also think the estate tax should be elimated. Our tax system could bring in the necessary monies needed without being so complicated.
No meaningful tax reform will be done.


Some members in congress talk a good game but they will support whatever the lobbiest with the deepest pockets wants

them to.
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I dont do my own taxes but i believe i actually paid out twenty eight percent. I would be cool with twenty flat since i livr in tn. i believr an increase in cap gain would do what it always did and slow gdp growth.
 
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