Virginia Board is Set to Return Names of the Confederate Generals Stonewall Jackson, Turner Ashby and Robert E Lee to two Schools

[GroverCleveland]

Lincoln basically tore up the Constitution. I get his desire to preserve the Union, but he shat all over the very document that formed the Union to accomplish his goals.

I do not disagree with this, nor think I would go along with a modern-day version of his antics either. I also think my comments about him are accurate.

 

[BreatheUT]

Terrific. More "look at me being spiteful" politics.

It tells me it was more kneejerk, emotional stupidity to begin with.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Nathan Bedford Forrest is not the guy he is painted out to be by modern viewpoints conversely neither is John Brown. The Klan has nothing to do with American Exceptionalism. Being “exceptional” doesn’t mean there aren’t events in history that are negative, you have a very twisted view of American history and it has become quite evident in your views on the invasion of Ukraine.

Let's leave out the KKK for a moment. What happened at Fort Pillow?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Yep. Comparing both of those guys to the aforementioned doctrines is quite ignorant

So you can't answer the question.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Honoring Confederate heroism and bravery was an important part of healing the nation after the civil war. Shaming the south would have felt good for the victors but would have left festering wounds that wouldn’t have healed. Letting the South have a few things in which could take pride made them much better citizens in the newly reunited country

Now this is revisionist history right here...

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

*Clears throat*

Britain had outlawed slavery by this point in world history, but they were not above buying goods from countries where slavery was still in progress. Britain offered to buy cotton from southern states in large quantities and very inexpensively, which would prompt a significant increase in the need for slaves to work the fields as plantations expanded operations to meet demand.

So, yes; it ties back specifically to slavery.

Well, there is the other alternative narrative.

The Northern states were more industrialized than the South, so they managed to get tariffs placed on imported goods, which hurt the South. Britain and France offered products to mechanize farming (which would have reduced the need for more slaves), but the tariffs made the prices too prohibitive. The North essentially was forcing the South to buy their products.

Speaking of France and Britain, keep in mind that Britain had forces waiting in Canada and France was in Mexico. They were both planning on coming in at some point to carve up the Union. Luckily, Maximillian wasn't able to gain full control of Mexico. The Brits ended up buying their cotton from Egypt and India.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

America is exceptional. It is not perfect.

Both of your statements are correct. I would just add:
1. America being exceptional doesn't grant us special privilege to go around the globe inserting ourselves in all of these conflicts that have no significance or importance to the average citizen.
2. It is far from perfect (no country is perfect). There is room for improvement, however. But for me to say there is room for improvement, I can hear the calls of "If you don't like it, leave it".

And with the direction we are heading in right now, just how long will it be before we go from "exceptional" to no different than most of these Western European countries?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Exactly. Large scale agriculture requires lots of bodies or machinery. Machinery wasn't available at the time. Time changes what can be done, but it doesn't retroactively change what could be done, and that's how you have to look at past and present.

It was available, but the North had created a monopoly for themselves. Buy their expensive machinery and mechanize or buy the even more expensive imports (thanks to high tariffs) from Britain and France.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

In January 1848 Lincoln said: “Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better.” Apparently his position evolved when he was running the existing government.

Was Lincoln correct in that line of thinking?

 

[EasternVol]

Was Lincoln correct in that line of thinking?

In principle, yes.

 

[landscapingvol]

Let's leave out the KKK for a moment. What happened at Fort Pillow?

Fort Pillow is one of those events in history that are highly controversial as to whether it actually happened and what actually happened. The attack on Fort Pillow was very necessary but if his soldiers were following orders given by Forrest to kill surrendering troops then he absolutely deserves to be erased from history. I doubt 99% of the public has ever heard of Fort Pillow and his infamy stems from the Klan.

 

[Jxn Vol]

So you can't answer the question.

You actually want a numerical answer to an absolutely idiotic question? To humor you I will throw out the number 69. Enjoy.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

You actually want a numerical answer to an absolutely idiotic question? To humor you I will throw out the number 69. Enjoy.

69 is far closer to reality than that bogus 99.5 you threw out.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Fort Pillow is one of those events in history that are highly controversial as to whether it actually happened and what actually happened. The attack on Fort Pillow was very necessary but if his soldiers were following orders given by Forrest to kill surrendering troops then he absolutely deserves to be erased from history. I doubt 99% of the public has ever heard of Fort Pillow and his infamy stems from the Klan.

Interesting

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Fort Pillow is one of those events in history that are highly controversial as to whether it actually happened and what actually happened. The attack on Fort Pillow was very necessary but if his soldiers were following orders given by Forrest to kill surrendering troops then he absolutely deserves to be erased from history. I doubt 99% of the public has ever heard of Fort Pillow and his infamy stems from the Klan.

So?

 

[Jxn Vol]

69 is far closer to reality than that bogus 99.5 you threw out.

The entire comparison is bogus. To dislodge the stick take a deep breath and exhale slowly when you pull.

 

[Franklin Pierce]

Jacksonville, Florida, votes Against removing Confederate statues

One of the Confederate monuments stands in Jacksonville's Hemming Park.

A Florida city council voted against removing two Confederate statues — which would have cost taxpayers $500,000 — after a heated public hearing Tuesday night.

Jacksonville City Councilman Matt Carlucci proposed a bill that would have taken down two monuments — a Daughters of the Confederacy memorial and the remnants of another Confederate soldier monument — arguing that they are a civic blight rooted in racism.

But the board ultimately voted against the measure 13-6 following a passionate public debate.

Jacksonville, Florida votes against removing Confederate statues