We are most penalized SEC football team

#26
#26
LegionnaireOfTheMiserable said:
Is your argument that more penalties makes you a better football team?
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My argument is that aggressive play benefits you. Hands on DB play, LBs rerouting WRs, OL grabbing cloth, getting after the other teams QB, pushing off on routes, etc.

How many defensive pass interference calls has Georgia had when we play them? Very few. They could play less aggressive with their DBs, not reroute WRs, and likely have 0 interference calls. Would that benefit them?

It’s not as simple as “commit penalties or don’t”. If it were “don’t commit penalties” would obviously be better.

It’s “play aggressive or don’t”.
 
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#28
#28
Vol8188 said:
My argument is that aggressive play benefits you. Hands on DB play, LBs rerouting WRs, OL grabbing cloth, getting after the other teams QB, pushing off on routes, etc.

How many defensive pass interference calls has Georgia had when we play them? Very few. They could play less aggressive with their DBs, not reroute WRs, and likely have 0 interference calls. Would that benefit them?

It’s not as simple as “commit penalties or don’t”. If it were “don’t commit penalties” would obviously be better.

It’s “play aggressive or don’t”.
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I agree with this however the "non conspiracy" danger is that you create officiating bias because they expect you to commit more penalties. The "conspiracy theorist" in me says that UGA, Bama, and others get away with more because the SEC has a stake in seeing them successful above other SEC teams.

Just having watched the recent UGA game, there is absolutely no way they should be penalized so little.
 
#29
#29
This can be fixed. It's simple if you jump off sides you don't play for a quarter. do it again and set out a half. Geez turn your head and look down the line when the ball moves you move. If they really respect Heup as they say they do this is disrespectful to him. Where's out Off and Def player that the other players look up to. who's our Al Wilson. Have a prayer meeting.
 
#30
#30
sjt18 said:
I agree with this however the "non conspiracy" danger is that you create officiating bias because they expect you to commit more penalties. The "conspiracy theorist" in me says that UGA, Bama, and others get away with more because the SEC has a stake in seeing them successful above other SEC teams.

Just having watched the recent UGA game, there is absolutely no way they should be penalized so little.
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Pretty sure Bama is a highly penalized team. Not certain of UGA
 
#33
#33
Volanta said:
CJH teams have always had a reputation with heavy penalties but this year more then ever I anticipate a flag everytime we make a big gain and it’s a drive killer.

Was coach Golesh the “bad cop,” that kept everyone in line? How can we get more disciplined?

We gotta clean up the penalties bc we are a great team that doesn’t need to injure ourselves with stupid penalties. Look how well we have done despite being undisciplined. Sky is the limit!

GBO!
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Great teams dont commit the amount of penalties Vols do by way of being undisciplined. They definitely need to clean that up if they are going to make a run. CJH I'm sure stresses this but the players have to execute and have better situational awareness.
 
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#34
#34
LWSVOL said:
Heupel has always had highly penalized teams. Not sure its that big a deal to him if he is getting the offensive / defensive efficiency he desires. He has sure not done anything to improve it.
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If I’m not mistaken, CJH teams at UCF were also heavily penalized. It’s certainly a concern.
 
#35
#35
I've always been a huge fan of well-disciplined teams. Always.

But I'm beginning to see the other perspective.

I don't mean the other extreme, the criminal mindset of 2000s Miami or the 1990s Oakland Raiders. But kind of a middle ground coaching philosophy, where you value initiative, and energy, and explosiveness in your players, even if it comes at a cost of occasional offside or false start penalties. The former could, indeed, more than pay off the cost of the latter.

*shrug* At the end of the day, Coach Heupel gonna do it the way he do it, and our best approach is to judge him on his Win-Loss column rather than how he gets there.

Go Vols!


p.s. His win rate at Tennessee sits at .720 or so currently, which has him among the Top 5 or 6 Vols head coaches all time, above Johnny Majors. And it's just gonna get better as his 10+ win seasons continue to dilute that first 7-6 year. In fact, if you left his Year 1 out as "growing pains," his win rate is .784, which is better than all but two former Vols coaches: General Neyland (.829), and his WW II stand-in, John Barnhill (an astounding .857). Better than national title and multiple conference championship-winning Phil Fulmer (.745).

So let his guys go offsides from time to time, if that's the result. Heh.
 
#36
#36
Volnanza said:
I don't understand why our defense lines up off sides on almost every single play. Moving back an extra foot when lining up would probably save us at least 2 penalties a game.
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It could definitely be more then have been called. I see at least 2-3 times a game that we don’t get called for it.
 
#37
#37
Vol8188 said:
My argument is that aggressive play benefits you. Hands on DB play, LBs rerouting WRs, OL grabbing cloth, getting after the other teams QB, pushing off on routes, etc.

How many defensive pass interference calls has Georgia had when we play them? Very few. They could play less aggressive with their DBs, not reroute WRs, and likely have 0 interference calls. Would that benefit them?

It’s not as simple as “commit penalties or don’t”. If it were “don’t commit penalties” would obviously be better.

It’s “play aggressive or don’t”.
Click to expand...
Ohio State is a fairly decent team that doesn’t commit many penalties. It’s not a matter of “well it’s unavoidable if you’re good and aggressive.” Heupel teams have always been among the worst in the nation with penalties.
 
#38
#38
LegionnaireOfTheMiserable said:
Ohio State is a fairly decent team that doesn’t commit many penalties. It’s not a matter of “well it’s unavoidable if you’re good and aggressive.” Heupel teams have always been among the worst in the nation with penalties.
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So in the top 20 (right at 20) you have Ohio St and Oh State only as a team you can point to that is successful.

In the bottom 20 of that same category is Tx A&M, TN, Alabama, and Miami.

Aggressive play matters. Penalties don’t really matter. If you’re going to hyper focus on any one stat, find one that matters
 
#39
#39
LWSVOL said:
Heupel has always had highly penalized teams. Not sure its that big a deal to him if he is getting the offensive / defensive efficiency he desires. He has sure not done anything to improve it.
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You may be right, which truly scares me.
 
#40
#40
Vol8188 said:
So in the top 20 (right at 20) you have Ohio St and Oh State only as a team you can point to that is successful.

In the bottom 20 of that same category is Tx A&M, TN, Alabama, and Miami.

Aggressive play matters. Penalties don’t really matter. If you’re going to hyper focus on any one stat, find one that matters
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Okay, don’t ever complain about refs then since penalties don’t matter.
 
#41
#41
LegionnaireOfTheMiserable said:
Okay, don’t ever complain about refs then since penalties don’t matter.
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One playoff caliber team in the least 20 penalized teams. Four in the bottom 20.

Doesn’t mean individual calls don’t matter. That’s a different argument.

It’s like arguing about the importance of RG. Does RG matter? Sure. Is it going to be as highly correlated to overall team success as QB play? No. Can your RG play matter to a high degree on any single play? Absolutely.

So how penalized your team is, is not very well correlated with your overall team success the way other stats are. Doesnt mean a big call in a critical moment doesn’t matter. And 100% officiating needs to be fixed.

But that’s a separate issue.
 
#43
#43
I hate that its the same 2 guys every week. I have seen no improvement. Heard 1 to 2 holding calls and Dane holding and jumping the snap, suddenly the tight ends want to get theirs as well. Penalize their NIL money for a penalty! Joking.
 
#44
#44
Being highly penalized is a main culprit of losing games you shouldn’t (Arkansas). If Vols lose to Vandy, I’d be certain penalties are to blame.
 
#45
#45
I’ll say this: not all penalties are created equal or have the same consequences. A 15 yard facemask is more detrimental than a 5 yard illegal contact.

Vols need to clean up the pre-snap penalties for sure. Illegal shifts, offsides, false starts. We play fast & physical on defense and when you do that, some penalties will occur.

I remember when the Seahawks won in 2013 they were the most penalized team. But their margin of error was greater because of their personnel.

I’m a Bengals fan..one of the least penalized NFL teams yet our defense is bad, offensive line soft and we don’t win in the trenches.

Penalties are never good but they’re not always inherently detrimental (depending on the type). Last thing you want is players playing afraid of making mistakes. It’s a fine balance and that’s where coaching comes into play from a technique/assignment/alignment standpoint
 
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