Why did we move away from our offensive identity throughout the year?

#29
#29
Obviously Gaston Moore is not the answer but when he came in the offense opened up, I saw plays we had not been running before.It was a faster pace and we used the slant more.
Yep he's the type that will throw two picks ( Brett Farve type) but it was a faster pace.
 
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#30
#30
Zues1 said:
Obviously Gaston Moore is not the answer but when he came in the offense opened up, I saw plays we had been running before.It was a faster pace and we used the slant more.
Yep he's the type that will throw two picks ( Brett Farve type) but it was a faster pace.
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Without saying it, you've exposed part of the problem. We can't protect and we can't get separation at WR, but I think the main reason we aren't going fast is that Nico can't process fast enough to run it. Plus, I'm not so sure Heupel's offense has an answer for what the defenses are doing. This reportedly goes back to Tulsa being his kryptonite when he was at UCF. They were the originators of how to defend Heupel's gimmick offense according to some. Having said that, I think that's only a part of the problem. I don't think we have a good enough coaching staff when it comes to player evaluation and development. To be honest, I think we're lacking in pure coaching ability at several positions to be quite honest.
 
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#31
#31
vik said:
What happened was that Hendon Hooker graduated.

It's becoming apparent that he was one of a kind. We need a dude that makes quick decisions and then commits to that decision. This is not a knock on Joe Milton, nor Nico, but with Hendon, you could tell he would do one read on his primary, another read on his secondary, and if either of those were open (or nearly open), he'd let it rip. If he felt any pressure, he would take off running. If there was no pressure and he had time to go back to read #1 he would, but if that was not there, he would tuck and run.

If it wasn't there, then it wasn't there -- and HH would move on immediately to the next progression. In my opinion, Milton and Iamaleava both seem to linger a little bit longer on a read and maybe hope it comes open. HH, on the other hand, was already to the 2nd read and/or tucking and running.

We get positive yards or a 1st down, then we can go fast. JMHO.
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He could analyze a defense on the fly and he just had great timing and feel for what the defense play call was. The only game that he struggled was Georgia. Psycho Kirby smart disguised everything against us that day.
 
#33
#33
stolitonic said:
While I realize you are only talking about QBs Heupel possessed as a HC-

Drew Locke was very successful for the most part at Mizzu with Heupel as OC

Then you have the plethora of Oklahoma QBs. The only real dud of that group was Trevor Knight. The rest seemed to do ok with it.

I have no clue who Heupels QB was the one year he was at Utah State so cannot really comment on that.

Point being-I am struggling to recall a team with Heupel even as OC struggling like we have for 2 seasons to really put much on the board.
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The point isn't that Heupel can't coach QBs because as you show, he can.

The point is the QBs Heupel picks have trouble running his offense even though he is an excellent QB coach.

Mac Milton and Hooker ran it well and one might argue Gaston Moore ran it well and lacked enough talent to execute it.

It's not the coach. It's the offense. I'm not good enough to diagnose exactly WHAT is not workable, but Heupel is a good coach and Nico is a good QB but they don't seem to work well together. I'd argue Dillion Gabriel is a good QB and Heupel is a good coach, but they didn't run the offense that efficiently either.

Something seems amiss with the system, not the coaches or QBs.
 
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#35
#35
This is a good high-level take:

Tennessee Football Must Fix Its Passing Game To Take Next Step | Rocky Top Insider

"Not even Heupel himself has all the answers but there is one notable change over the last two years that is worth exploring. Tennessee doesn’t play with tempo anymore, and the Vols don’t have a complicated route tree. Heupel’s offense is built on wide splits that create one-on-ones and a tempo that puts opponents on their heels."
 
#36
#36
Clad in Big Orange said:
This is a good high-level take:

Tennessee Football Must Fix Its Passing Game To Take Next Step | Rocky Top Insider

"Not even Heupel himself has all the answers but there is one notable change over the last two years that is worth exploring. Tennessee doesn’t play with tempo anymore, and the Vols don’t have a complicated route tree. Heupel’s offense is built on wide splits that create one-on-ones and a tempo that puts opponents on their heels."
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The lack of tempo is a result of a lack of production on 1st and 2nd down. After two years and two QBs the passing game hasn't been there. Opponents have figured it out. It's not the exception, it's reality now. Our defense single handedly kept us in the top 20 this year. Unfortunately Heupel has shown he will not hold his staff accountable and make changes. This, and not recruiting at an elite level will mean his tenure will settle in at around 8.5 wins per year. At the end of the day we have a 'good' coach. But he's not championship level.
 
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#37
#37
The problem with going fast is the strain it puts on a defense. Huepel game planed around the defense being the strength of the team. In the end the defense is what lost us the game vs OSU.
 
#38
#38
Our oline has been between very average to downright awful for 2 years.

No Darnell Wright and not even close. Davis and Lane have their all . . . But those guys are not going block these monsters UGA / OSU / etc. roll out there.

We don’t know what we have in Nico because our oline is awful and our WRs are very average.
 
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#40
#40
Vols1891 said:
What happened to our fast paced, hurry-up offensive philosophy? We seemed to move away from it in the OU game and never went back to it.
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Don’t have the dawgs to do it. We are very deficient in talent up front and as well as other places.

Unless Tennessee starts putting as much money into NIL as Texas Oregon Ohio state and Georgia, we ain’t going to sniff a natty.
 
#41
#41
Other_Guy said:
Tackles couldn't block a wet paper bag
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He could also step up/aside while staring down a receiver.😯 I think Nico has the tools to be great, but there are some nagging issues he must improve upon. I'm excited about him because he is a tough dude. His running was about our only real option last week. He made some slick moves in the open field. He plowed when needed. If he shores up his passing skills and pocket presence, he could be one of our best ever
 
#42
#42
white65 said:
The problem with going fast is the strain it puts on a defense. Huepel game planed around the defense being the strength of the team. In the end the defense is what lost us the game vs OSU.
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Our defense AND our offense lost us the game. Our defense won us a hell of a lot more games than our offense this year.
 
#44
#44
imw8n4u said:
I've been wondering the same thing. My theory is it may be due to the in helmet communications where they can talk to Nico down to 15 seconds on the play clock. Normally we would have signaled in the play and snapped it long before that, but it seems they want to take as much advantage of that communication as possible.
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^
This
 
#46
#46
Vols1891 said:
What happened to our fast paced, hurry-up offensive philosophy? We seemed to move away from it in the OU game and never went back to it.
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What happened is two fold: CFP aspirations and the OU win.
This team was the first of Josh's HC career where there were real playoff expectations due to the expansion. Hendon learned fast thru trial and error, his mistakes were not magnified b/c the bar was low. Hendon and Vols played loose, the downside was minimal. It was let it rip, fast and loose, fearless and rapid.
Then OU happened and Josh realized Vols could make CFP if young Nico played clean. So far less gambling, don't make a mistake, rely on the D, play the clock. Which stunted Nico's growth, it went from let it rip to don't make a mistake. If the Vols were not in the hunt, I believe Nico would have played looser, made a bunch of mistakes from which he would learn and the up tempo would have been about the same as Hendon year one.
But with CFP on the line every week and a significantly better defense. the offensive philosophy evolved conservatively and understandably so not the time to be learning on the job. Nico.
For example, the Arkie game where Josh couldn't decide to go up tempo once Vols got the lead, or burn clock like OU. Prior years, no question Vols would continue up tempo, that being their identity.
Had a 9 win season and a good bowl been the goal, the offense would have progressed faster thru trial and error. OU game changed the strategic dynamic and it made sense but stunted Nico's development. And no up tempo made Vol offense simplistic and more "normal" to defend.
 
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