Zach Arnett Out

#51
#51
spyfish007 said:
I bet Butch Jones is available! Nevermind, I would not wish that on anyone, well Alabama yes.
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Jones season has improved. Don’t know if he will get the axe or not. He’s got them around .500 and they have a few winnable games left.
 
#52
#52
05_never_again said:
How many coaches have had second stints at places? The two that come to mind offhand (Bill Snyder and our own General Neyland) worked out OK.
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Johnny Majors at Pittsburgh. Bobby Petrino at Louisville. Brady Hoke at San Diego State

Mac Brown has been better at NC, as has the Fresno State coach (forgot his name)
 
#53
#53
docholiday said:
Time to use the back channels and set it up...........
Elite DC Arnett is available now..........Would be a massive upgrade.
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So we have Arnett AND Derick Mason out there and available. I say grab the one that recruits the best. I still don’t think Heupel is inclined to make any changes, though.
 
#55
#55
05_never_again said:
Arkansas, IMO, is a really tough job. Tough combo of 1) not a particularly easy place to win and 2) fairly high expectations. Generally speaking at places that have high expectations it is easier to win, or places where it is difficult to win have modest/low expectations. It seems like the moment you stop winning 8-9 games a year at Arky, they start thinking about firing you.

I get that this season has been disappointing, but the impression I got is that Pittman's seat starting getting warm last year even though he went 6-6 with a bowl win for 7 and had a nice 9-win season the season before.
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IMO it's the losses to teams like Liberty, BYU, Mississippi State, etc. - teams Arkansas historically is or should be better than - that have done Pittman in. I mean that MSU team is just horrible. If he could just win the games he's supposed to win he'd probably be fine. The PC answers like "I just didn't know what to do" don't help either.

I will say there is sort of an expectation that Arkansas should always be better than Missouri, Ole Miss and even Texas A&M based on history or record in the series, but what happened 20+ years ago means very little now. Arkansas used to dominate the series against A&M by 20+ games and now it's within 10. Older fans can't reconcile that.

But you also look across college football at Oregon State, Kansas State, Kansas, and other programs with fewer resources winning and it gives you some FOMO.
 
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#57
#57
gohogs14 said:
IMO it's the losses to teams like Liberty, BYU, Mississippi State, etc. - teams Arkansas historically is or should be better than - that have done Pittman in. I mean that MSU team is just horrible. If he could just win the games he's supposed to win he'd probably be fine. The PC answers like "I just didn't know what to do" don't help either.

I will say there is sort of an expectation that Arkansas should always be better than Missouri, Ole Miss and even Texas A&M based on history or record in the series, but what happened 20+ years ago means very little now. Arkansas used to dominate the series against A&M by 20+ games and now it's within 10. Older fans can't reconcile that.

But you also look across college football at Oregon State, Kansas State, Kansas, and other programs with fewer resources winning and it gives you some FOMO.
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Really? That is surprising. I know it is probably hard not to, but none of those other schools you mentioned are in the SEC. Tough to compare yourself to them.

I know divisions are going away, but if you look at the pecking order in the SEC West, Arkansas is probably the 5th best team in terms of resources, finances, recruiting ability, etc. If you're 5th out of 7 teams in your own division, it is tough to reasonably expect 8-9 wins per year. That definitely can happen occasionally, but a more typical result is going to be 6 or 7 wins. You definitely should not be OK with Chad Morris-type results or consistently missing bowl games, and I know Arky is going to miss a bowl this year, but the leash seems awfully short. Most, not all, of the games Pittman is losing are to teams he is clearly worse than.
 
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#58
#58
Whoops. If you look on the actual tweet, it appears Chadwell left his location services on and sent it from Starkville.
 
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#59
#59
DarkVolder said:
Poor guy was way in over his head he had to know he was just the placeholder because of Leach passing away. I’m still surprised as bad as State has been this season they didn’t give him one more year. They should try and get Dan Mullen back.
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I’m honestly kind of surprised they didn’t just name him as an interim coach given the whole situation.
 
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#60
#60
05_never_again said:
Really? That is surprising. I know it is probably hard not to, but none of those other schools you mentioned are in the SEC. Tough to compare yourself to them.

I know divisions are going away, but if you look at the pecking order in the SEC West, Arkansas is probably the 5th best team in terms of resources, finances, recruiting ability, etc. If you're 5th out of 7 teams in your own division, it is tough to reasonably expect 8-9 wins per year. That definitely can happen occasionally, but a more typical result is going to be 6 or 7 wins. You definitely should not be OK with Chad Morris-type results or consistently missing bowl games, and I know Arky is going to miss a bowl this year, but the leash seems awfully short. Most, not all, of the games Pittman is losing are to teams he is clearly worse than.
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I mostly agree but don’t think Arkansas is worse than Mississippi State and certainly not 48-10 worse than a mediocre Auburn this year. And should always beat BYU and Liberty at home. Lost to a Missouri team last year who had a losing record too.

It’s clear there is some talent on the team or Arkansas wouldn’t be playing Alabama or LSU to within 3 points but it’s coaching when you’re playing those games yet losing to worse teams in a blowout.
 
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#61
#61
gohogs14 said:
I mostly agree but don’t think Arkansas is worse than Mississippi State and certainly not 48-10 worse than a mediocre Auburn this year. And should always beat BYU and Liberty at home. Lost to a Missouri team last year who had a losing record too.

It’s clear there is some talent on the team or Arkansas wouldn’t be playing Alabama or LSU to within 3 points but it’s coaching when you’re playing those games yet losing to worse teams in a blowout.
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Yes this season is definitely disappointing, especially considering you had KJ Jefferson returning. I just figured he'd have some equity built up from 2021 and could survive it.
 
#62
#62
Boston Vol said:
Jeff Tedford
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He did a great job at Cal and made them very competitive. Never understood why his career trajectory took a nose dive. Mostly heart problems I guess. I always considered him a very capable HC. He kinda bounced around to CFL and back and had NFL stints amid health problems. Even took a two year break from Fresno and came back after healing.
 
#63
#63
05_never_again said:
Yes this season is definitely disappointing, especially considering you had KJ Jefferson returning. I just figured he'd have some equity built up from 2021 and could survive it.
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Arkansas had every bit the returning roster to be at worse the #3 team in the WEst this year.
 
#65
#65
SAT-type question here:
Kiffin is to UT as Mullen is to ____?
Answer here if you haven't been paying attention: MSU <---Highlight to see answer
 
#66
#66
Bearkat_Vol said:
SAT-type question here:
Kiffin is to UT as Mullen is to ____?
Answer here if you haven't been paying attention: MSU <---Highlight to see answer
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except that Mullen had what passes for success at MSU, while Kiffin didn't come close to being good here.

Mullen was there for 8 seasons and is there second winningest coach.
Kiffin was here for 1 season, and is most famous for 2 losses, and trying to steal our players.

not saying they take him back or he wants to go back, but really different situations.
 
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#68
#68
LouderVol said:
except that Mullen had what passes for success at MSU, while Kiffin didn't come close to being good here.

Mullen was there for 8 seasons and is there second winningest coach.
Kiffin was here for 1 season, and is most famous for 2 losses, and trying to steal our players.

not saying they take him back or he wants to go back, but really different situations.
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You missed my point, or I wasn't clear enough. Mullen left MSU and Kiffin left UT. I don't think it is feasible for either to return to the schools they left, especially in Kiffin's case.

To be clear- Mullen did a great job at MSU. Nothing I said should lead anyone to think that I believe the opposite.
 
#69
#69
Bearkat_Vol said:
You missed my point, or I wasn't clear enough. Mullen left MSU and Kiffin left UT. I don't think it is feasible for either to return to the schools they left, especially in Kiffin's case.

To be clear- Mullen did a great job at MSU. Nothing I said should lead anyone to think that I believe the opposite.
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The difference is the way Mullen left at MSST vs the way Kiff left here.

Mullen built the program. Took them to #1. Stayed almost a decade.

Kiff was barely HC of the Vols for one calendar year. Tried to steal recruits on the way out the door. Was generally a rather scummy human being during his sojourn in Knoxville.

The way you do things in life matters.
 
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#70
#70
stolitonic said:
The difference is the way Mullen left at MSST vs the way Kiff left here.

Mullen built the program. Took them to #1. Stayed almost a decade.

Kiff was barely HC of the Vols for one calendar year. Tried to steal recruits on the way out the door. Was generally a rather scummy human being during his sojourn in Knoxville.

The way you do things in life matters.
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Totally agree. I have nothing against Mullen. I have several friends who are MSU alum. They hate that Mullen left, of course, because they had so many good years with him.
What I find interesting is that Mullen was killing it a MSU for many years, but he fell flat at UF after just 4 years.
 
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#71
#71
Bearkat_Vol said:
Totally agree. I have nothing against Mullen. I have several friends who are MSU alum. They hate that Mullen left, of course, because they had so many good years with him.
What I find interesting is that Mullen was killing it a MSU for many years, but he fell flat at UF after just 4 years.
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Mullens problem at UF was that he was the same coach he was at MSST.

A consistent 8-4 at MSST gets you statues and a parade.

A consistent 8-4 gets you fired at UF
 
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#72
#72
stolitonic said:
Mullens problem at UF was that he was the same coach he was at MSST.

A consistent 8-4 at MSST gets you statues and a parade.

A consistent 8-4 gets you fired at UF
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And he may have been a lazy recruiter. I asked why Mullen at UF in another thread: see Lizards for more details.
 
#73
#73
stolitonic said:
Mullens problem at UF was that he was the same coach he was at MSST.

A consistent 8-4 at MSST gets you statues and a parade.

A consistent 8-4 gets you fired at UF
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Except he wasn’t consistently 8-4 at UF. He was 10-3, 11-2, 8-4 (Covid year) and 5-6, fired before FSU game, his last year. The 8-4 year included an SECCG appearance and 6 pt loss to a Bama team, that some say is the best CFB team of all time and a bowl loss to OU when a ton of guys opted out. I don’t know what happened in 2021 for the wheels to fall off and I don’t know their roster history/transfers well enough to know how or why the recruiting didn’t work out. Because on paper his full recruiting classes were ranked 8, 7 and 10 with his transition class in 2018 being ranked 17th.
 
#74
#74
AthensVol2007 said:
Except he wasn’t consistently 8-4 at UF. He was 10-3, 11-2, 8-4 (Covid year) and 5-6, fired before FSU game, his last year. The 8-4 year included an SECCG appearance and 6 pt loss to a Bama team, that some say is the best CFB team of all time and a bowl loss to OU when a ton of guys opted out. I don’t know what happened in 2021 for the wheels to fall off and I don’t know their roster history/transfers well enough to know how or why the recruiting didn’t work out. Because on paper his full recruiting classes were ranked 8, 7 and 10 with his transition class in 2018 being ranked 17th.
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Just to clarify why I said an 8-4 coach-

Add up those records you listed. 15 losses in one game short of 4 years basically. 3.75 losses year.
 
#75
#75
Bearkat_Vol said:
You missed my point, or I wasn't clear enough. Mullen left MSU and Kiffin left UT. I don't think it is feasible for either to return to the schools they left, especially in Kiffin's case.

To be clear- Mullen did a great job at MSU. Nothing I said should lead anyone to think that I believe the opposite.
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I agree with tonic. how it was done matters a whole lot more than what they actually did. it wasn't that Kiffin left, it was how he left that left a really bad taste in a lot of fans' mouths.

part of the reason that Kiffin hurt so much was because his contract with UT gave him a very solid out, pretty sure no buy out to go to USC. Mullen had to be bought out, went earlier in the year, actually took the time to talk to his players before he left, and didn't try to poach them to UF.
 
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