Butch Jones: ‘We’re on the verge of assembling a top-notch recruiting class’

[majic73]

what world is Butch living in saying we are assembling a top notch class
of what 3 stars offered by cusa and AAC teams....

good grief

the used car salesman pitch is soooooooooo over

we have 15 3***'s committed . Out of the 15 , 3 of them do not have offers from MAJOR universities. 1 of the 3 is a kicker. The other 12 have offers from major SEC schools ( Bama , LSU , UF , Auburn , UGA ) sometimes more than one. These 12 also feature offers from schools like Michigan , USC , FSU , Clemson ect .

You can star gaze if you like , but the offers tell a much more complete picture than the 'stars'. As the 4's and possibly 5's come in ( I am expecting at least two flips ..maybe 3 ) , the weaker ones or the grade issue ones will be recruited over.

This scorched earth recruiting practice is the same practice that Saban started with except we don't have the benefit of Alabama in state recruiting . I dont have a problem with this style of recruiting as long as the coaches are being straight forward with their commitments that are being recruited over and making some calls for them to help them find a roster .

Please look into the whole story before you start spouting nonsense . By the star gazers logic we should just add up all the stars before a game and declare a winner ...like Pokemon or something .

 

[KBVol]

And I'll reissue...Tee Higgins hurt. The rest, we have better players committed.

Wouldn't dispute that. Just answering the guy's question.

 

[HuntlandVolinColo]

We only need 7 more 5* recruits and those Gaddy Bros back.
...a dozen DT recruits in all to get over the injury hump next year.

 

[orangemadam]

Now no. 6 on rivals. Shows Trey at 4 *. We have 0 5*'s to Bama's 5 5*. We are still 4th in SEC according to rivals. Will anyone ever match Bama's recruiting?

 

[Lainon]

Now no. 6 on rivals. Shows Trey at 4 *. We have 0 5*'s to Bama's 5 5*. We are still 4th in SEC according to rivals. Will anyone ever match Bama's recruiting?

Ohio State. That's about it as long as Saban is there.

 

[majic73]

Now no. 6 on rivals. Shows Trey at 4 *. We have 0 5*'s to Bama's 5 5*. We are still 4th in SEC according to rivals. Will anyone ever match Bama's recruiting?

No , the state of Alabama is loaded . In the last two years St Nick has pulled 11 4 and 5 stars from the state of Alabama alone...not to mention the border state of MS and LA.

The good news is that it 10 years of #1 recruiting , Nick is only working on his second undefeated season . So schools of thought have him under achieving despite his success

The moral of the story is that if you can get close , you can beat them .

 

[BruisedOrange]

Now no. 6 on rivals. Shows Trey at 4 *. We have 0 5*'s to Bama's 5 5*. We are still 4th in SEC according to rivals. Will anyone ever match Bama's recruiting?

My first thought was, not until we beat them. But then I remembered: Ole Miss beat 'em twice, and yet...

I guess the best we can do is work like heck and pray that Saban gets bored soon... or that God calls him to be a missionary overseas.

LOL--in that capacity, as a "recruiter for the Lord" Saban would make 17th century Jesuits look shy and reticent!

 

[tvolsfan]

No , the state of Alabama is loaded . In the last two years St Nick has pulled 11 4 and 5 stars from the state of Alabama alone...not to mention the border state of MS and LA.

The good news is that it 10 years of #1 recruiting , Nick is only working on his second undefeated season . So schools of thought have him under achieving despite his success

The moral of the story is that if you can get close , you can beat them .

Hopefully our next coach will be able to do it. Also, it's embarrassing to see you're still sticking to the same argument about Saban's success being due to in state talent, and even more absurd to say he's underachieving.

 

[butchna]

Wouldn't dispute that. Just answering the guy's question.

Wasn't challenging you KB...just keep hearing that refrain on this board. They took us to the woodshed with Higgins. Richardson and Rodgers are non-factors...we have better prospects. Having Hunter Johnson committed was cool but his departure saves us from a few years of "doesn't fit our system" threads...I assume a favorite of yours as well. Need a few more pieces in this class but the recruiting doomsayers are having to lower the volume a tad. Now we can concentrate in improving the coaching and fundamentals.

 

[butchna]

Now no. 6 on rivals. Shows Trey at 4 *. We have 0 5*'s to Bama's 5 5*. We are still 4th in SEC according to rivals. Will anyone ever match Bama's recruiting?

Go ahead and stick to Rivals...rest of us judge on 247 composite.

 

[majic73]

Hopefully our next coach will be able to do it. Also, it's embarrassing to see you're still sticking to the same argument about Saban's success being due to in state talent, and even more absurd to say he's underachieving.

11 4 and 5 stars in the last two seasons shouldn't embarrass anyone ...it is fact . I would implore you to not let facts get in the way of your special brand of logic. Has the State of TN produced that many in that span ? Is Alabama one of the top prospect producing states ? 11 players is one side of the ball , recruits that are begging you to take them . That's alot to me. They don't recruit as much regionally as in the first half of his rein but they don't have to now. For the first 3 years his classes were ready made .

Saban has achieved ...but 10 years of #1 recruiting and only 2 undefeated seasons ( maybe ) . Thats 20%. I think there are a number of coaches that if given that same situation would more than double that output. Stick with you argument , but I think all of the posters on here would put forth an opinion on that and probably drop a name or two for ya.

 

[Behr]

I work all day with nothing but women... finally get home and sit down to spend some man-time with vol nation and recruiting, only to read 14 pages of ... THIS? :whatever::bash::nono::finger3::rtfm:

Geez. If I'm gonna yield my screen to a bunch of catty (not gonna use the B-word) old women, I might as well turn on Hallmark Channel and see if there's a Christmas movie!

Never mind.

There is, but the movie's called "Five Stars on a Tree" (and it's rated 3-stars). I've had enough of that. :mf_surrender:

Haha, "and sit down to spend man time on VN"...and beech about beeching.

 

[tvolsfan]

11 4 and 5 stars in the last two seasons shouldn't embarrass anyone ...it is fact . I would implore you to not let facts get in the way of your special brand of logic. Has the State of TN produced that many in that span ? Is Alabama one of the top prospect producing states ? 11 players is one side of the ball , recruits that are begging you to take them . That's alot to me. They don't recruit as much regionally as in the first half of his rein but they don't have to now. For the first 3 years his classes were ready made .

Saban has achieved ...but 10 years of #1 recruiting and only 2 undefeated seasons ( maybe ) . Thats 20%. I think there are a number of coaches that if given that same situation would more than double that output. Stick with you argument , but I think all of the posters on here would put forth an opinion on that and probably drop a name or two for ya.

Okay. Name the coaches that would have at least 5, maybe soon to be 6, national titles in his position.

 

[Behr]

Okay. Name the coaches that would have at least 5, maybe soon to be 6, national titles in his position.

What if he named 10 and you agreed? What would it matter? You gonna change your mind? Butch gonna get your support?

 

[tvolsfan]

What if he named 10 and you agreed? What would it matter? You gonna change your mind? Butch gonna get your support?

Not at all. In fact, if he could name that many, I would hope we would all demand Tennessee go get one of them.

 

[Behr]

Not at all. In fact, if he could name that many, I would hope we would all demand Tennessee go get one of them.

Haha. Well, I hope Butch gets'er did and we don't have to go get one. But, when the time comes, I hope one is available, wants to come here and we are willing to do whatever it takes to get him. Unlike we've done in the past.

 

[KBVol]

11 4 and 5 stars in the last two seasons shouldn't embarrass anyone ...it is fact . I would implore you to not let facts get in the way of your special brand of logic. Has the State of TN produced that many in that span ? Is Alabama one of the top prospect producing states ? 11 players is one side of the ball , recruits that are begging you to take them . That's alot to me. They don't recruit as much regionally as in the first half of his rein but they don't have to now. For the first 3 years his classes were ready made .

Saban has achieved ...but 10 years of #1 recruiting and only 2 undefeated seasons ( maybe ) . Thats 20%. I think there are a number of coaches that if given that same situation would more than double that output. Stick with you argument , but I think all of the posters on here would put forth an opinion on that and probably drop a name or two for ya.

Is this a serious post, especially the second paragraph about Saban "only having 2 undefeated seasons"?? You're surely not serious here.

Btw, the man is 118-18 at Bama in 10 years....and fully 1/3 of those losses came in his first year when he took over a broken program about to get hit with NCAA sanctions. His last 9 seasons he's 111-12.

My guess is he's about to be 121-18 overall at Bama with 5 national titles in 8 years. How in GOD's name can you possibly criticize what he's done there with any legitimacy?

 

[majic73]

Okay. Name the coaches that would have at least 5, maybe soon to be 6, national titles in his position.

I didn't say NT's ....I said losses / undefeated seasons with 10 years of #1 recruiting . There is no doubt his teams rebound from losses to get things accomplished .

You seem to be a very intelligent football guy and are very entitled to your opinion . Our differences are not vast here. My opinion is that Saban has recruited top notch in one of the best recruiting venues. He has made a killing with A & B gap power football . Nothing brilliant about it , the same stuff that has been run since the single wing. He has enough talent to overcome almost any mistake his teams make ( they make mistakes ! ) He gets out coached more often than you think , again ...talent overcomes mistakes . When there is parity ...MSU , NFL , first season at Bama ...he is just okay.

I think just about any competent coach in that recruiting venue does well with talent and with wins and losses. Again , not an argument my friend, just an opinion based on observation . I don't think he is splitting the atom down there ...he is a successful recruiter in a great venue

 

[white65]

A top 10 recruiting class would restore my faith in Jones. But he's gonna have to pull it out of his arse.

 

[majic73]

Is this a serious post, especially the second paragraph about Saban "only having 2 undefeated seasons"?? You're surely not serious here.

Btw, the man is 118-18 at Bama in 10 years....and fully 1/3 of those losses came in his first year when he took over a broken program about to get hit with NCAA sanctions. His last 9 seasons he's 111-12.

My guess is he's about to be 121-18 overall at Bama with 5 national titles in 8 years. How in GOD's name can you possibly criticize what he's done there with any legitimacy?

I haven't criticized what he has accomplished at all. I have stated that with 10 arguable #1 recruiting classes ...he has 1 undefeated season and probably another this year. Is he under performing given his recruiting success and the duration of the success ? It seems when there is parity between his teams and the competition that he is a decidedly average coach . I am not making his NFL and MSU records up ...they really happened.

Ill hang up and listen

 

[majic73]

a statistical comparison ...although not perfect is a prime example of what I am trying to illustrate :

from 2013 - 2016 CBJ average recruiting ranking is 11.5
In this same time frame he has lost 5.25 games per season

from 2007 - 2015 CNS average recruiting ranking is 2.78
In this same time frame he has lost 2.44 games per season

Based on a direct proportional relationship if CBJs recruited at the rank of 2.78 ...at his current rate he would lose 1.26 games per year .

There is a direct correlation between recruiting and winning. You can figure it up for any coach individually as I just did . If you made a graph you would see the clear and direct relationship between recruiting success and winning. There are anomalies, absolutely , in either direction.

So the real question is , can Jones recruit yearly in the top 5? If he can , unless something changes statistically he will be a very successful coach .

To answer the questions of adversaries on this topic , you can do what I just did with any coach in the land that you like and can compare them to Saban on an apples to apples basis in terms of recruiting and rate of loss. You can draw your own conclusion from the numbers. The numbers create predictable paths in which you can predict results and hypotheticals

 

[Behr]

Nevermind.

 

[Wylo]

Nevermind.

That's not like you.

 

[Behr]

That's not like you.

Ha. I misread the CBJ in those first set of numbers in his post, thought he was still talking about Nicholas. Told him to check his numbers. Haha, then noticed it was Butch's numbers. Derp.

If I hadn't caught it, that would have been a record 3 times in one day I apologized.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

11 4 and 5 stars in the last two seasons shouldn't embarrass anyone ...it is fact . I would implore you to not let facts get in the way of your special brand of logic. Has the State of TN produced that many in that span ? Is Alabama one of the top prospect producing states ? 11 players is one side of the ball , recruits that are begging you to take them . That's alot to me. They don't recruit as much regionally as in the first half of his rein but they don't have to now. For the first 3 years his classes were ready made .

Saban has achieved ...but 10 years of #1 recruiting and only 2 undefeated seasons ( maybe ) . Thats 20%. I think there are a number of coaches that if given that same situation would more than double that output. Stick with you argument , but I think all of the posters on here would put forth an opinion on that and probably drop a name or two for ya.

Saban plays in the SEC. Usually the toughest conference from top to bottom. You are making it sound like going undefeated, especially in this day and age where the game is tailored much more to offense, is something thats easy to do. Its not as easy as you think.

Bear Bryant coached 38 years, he had 4 undefeated seasons. Tom Osbourne coached 24 years and only had 3 undefeated seasons. Bobby Bowden coached for 44 years and only had 1 winning season. See the trend here? These guys are considered 3 of the greatest coaches of all time.