'17 NC OL TJ Moore (former USCe commit)

#435
#435
Do highly ranked players win championships or do championship teams attract highly ranked players? Oklahoma competed. Oregon a couple of year ago. Baylor. LSU ten years ago? Did they have huge numbers office stars before they started winning? I don't remember it being a huge number of top players until AFTER they started winning big. Jimmies and Joe's are imoortant but I think their skills as a college junior are way more important than their skills as a high school sophomore.
 
#438
#438
BigOrangeD said:
Yep, I agree. He was just saying when you look at the teams that Win Championships, you always see the big 5* playmakers on them.
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The top recruiting teams do usually end up winning the championship, not many outliers there.
I'm definitely in the camp of believing if we win, recruits will come. I'm not sure how much this class will change but I believe we'll get back in the top for 2018.
With the last 3 classes, this class (even if it ended as it is today), would not be the downfall of the program. We have too much talent stocked already.
It would be a hiccup, not a downfall as people are making it out to be.
 
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#439
#439
BondJamesBond said:
Do highly ranked players win championships or do championship teams attract highly ranked players? Oklahoma competed. Oregon a couple of year ago. Baylor. LSU ten years ago? Did they have huge numbers office stars before they started winning? I don't remember it being a huge number of top players until AFTER they started winning big. Jimmies and Joe's are imoortant but I think their skills as a college junior are way more important than their skills as a high school sophomore.
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They all had a fair share of top talent but did not win a Natty. No, you have to have the talent and depth to go all the way. Does not mean a few 2 and 3*s will not be studs though. Ask Vegas who they bet on?
 
#440
#440
chargervol said:
The top recruiting teams do usually end up winning the championship, not many outliers there.
I'm definitely in the camp of believing if we win, recruits will come. I'm not sure how much this class will change but I believe we'll get back in the top for 2018.
With the last 3 classes, this class (even if it ended as it is today), would not be the downfall of the program. We have too much talent stocked already.
It would be a hiccup, not a downfall as people are making it out to be.
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I agree.
 
#442
#442
GLDunlap said:
Did we really need another average OG in this class? Chill out it's obvious we gave Moore the cold shoulder this past weekend. He is not so good that he came to town to say no thanks. VQ was punked on this one not Butch.
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then why did we offer him a scholarship in the first place? Just so we could turn him down when he wanted to commit? I agree there is plenty of time till NSD, and I agree that Butch and staff have done a great job evaluating talent thus far, but the only way we will rebound in this class is to FLIP kids who are already committed elsewhere (other than the kids like Akers and Gibbs who may wait till the end)... So, for all the folks on here who constantly complain about kids flipping from us and not staying true to a commitment and bashing other schools integrity who do it, you can't have it both ways and don't want to see any complaining then.... If we win the east and put up a fight after that, that will hopefully be enough to get kids like Smith, Akers, and Gibbs-- and maybe a few others, but if don't win the east, this class will absolutely blow and 2018 we will be taking a step back in talent.
 
#443
#443
volnpowell said:
I agree with you on most things, but I think you missed the point as to why some are upset with this one. Imo, it is because Butch had him visit the day before he announces and apparently lets the recruiting services know he is choosing Tn, only to be made to look bad...again.
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I think you are totally missing this. Moore had the visit to Tennessee for this past weekend planned for a long time. The only thing interesting about it was that he scheduled his announcement last week for after he came back from the visit. That is what got some of the "experts".

I will also say this, if you think that Butch leaks information to the recruiting services, you need to rethink things. I doubt that Butch cares what the recruiting services predict or say. He probably never looks at them.

Finally, many on this board have little or no respect for the Tennessee Scout site. But those of us, myself included, who are premium members over there, knew hours before the announcement that this was not a slam dunk for Tennessee. We knew of the teammate of Moore's that was already committed to USCe. The decision was not a surprise to us.
 
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#444
#444
Im guessing any visit that occurs on the eve of training camp is not that important to the staff, they may be a bit preoccupied.
 
#445
#445
Maybe you flip some players and maybe some of your commitments explode in their senior season. Rating systems right now rely heavily on sophomore and junior level performances plus camp results (if attended). Keep in mind that we are talking about kids who grow, develop, figure things out, become committed... I think the biggest failing in the "star" ratings is that it is evaluating 15-18 year olds and projecting how they will perform as 19-22 year olds. The NFL can't even manage to make those projections as reliably as they would like with far more data and weeks of evaluation. An excellent class isn't determined by the stars coming in, but by the results before they leave. I'm not going to panic over every rating... It just isn't that precise or accurate.
 
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#446
#446
Eastsidevol said:
You come up with the same drivel every time you disagree with a post I make...lol.
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I don't think he's disagreeing with you as much as he is pointing out that you revealed yourself to be a troll in another thread. That means no one should really care about what you post.
 
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#448
#448
BondJamesBond said:
Maybe you flip some players and maybe some of your commitments explode in their senior season. Rating systems right now rely heavily on sophomore and junior level performances plus camp results (if attended). Keep in mind that we are talking about kids who grow, develop, figure things out, become committed... I think the biggest failing in the "star" ratings is that it is evaluating 15-18 year olds and projecting how they will perform as 19-22 year olds. The NFL can't even manage to make those projections as reliably as they would like with far more data and weeks of evaluation. An excellent class isn't determined by the stars coming in, but by the results before they leave. I'm not going to panic over every rating... It just isn't that precise or accurate.
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You just destroyed all the nega vols. Too bad they will reshape like terminator 2.
 
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#449
#449
BigOrangeD said:
They all had a fair share of top talent but did not win a Natty. No, you have to have the talent and depth to go all the way. Does not mean a few 2 and 3*s will not be studs though. Ask Vegas who they bet on?
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You missed my point, or maybe I just wasn't clear. Some teams win big prior to the huge recruiting hauls. All that means is that correlating wins with recruiting stars may be fine, but you can't necessarily assign causality, certainly not to the degree that some on here want to argue.
 
#450
#450
In 2014 & 2015 our class ranking mattered as it was higher. When it's in that 14-25 range, class ranking doesn't matter.

Lets go with that. Sure.
 
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