19 students, 3 adults dead in Texas elementary shooting.

#2,476
#2,476
lawgator1 said:
Incidentally, re the debate over the former assault weapons ban, even if those of you decrying it were correct, all it means is that the version we need to adopt now needs to be much stricter than the old one.
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55yiac.jpg
 
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#2,477
#2,477
hog88 said:
Please tell me what about this legislation affected the functionality.

Federal Assault Weapons Ban - Wikipedia
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Manufacture, transfer, and transfer is the key...... meaning they were harder to come by. You're hung up on functionality not me. As such the correlation between the rise in mass shootings with ARs becoming more easily accessible seems to logically suggest causation.

And it refutes your assertion that it only dealt with foreign imports and cosmetics. That's just flat wrong.
 
#2,481
#2,481
Ashevolle said:
Manufacture, transfer, and transfer is the key...... meaning they were harder to come by. You're hung up on functionality not me. As such the correlation between the rise in mass shootings with ARs becoming more easily accessible seems to logically suggest causation.
Click to expand...

Very doubtful you want to get into the "causation" debate with me.
 
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#2,482
#2,482
hog88 said:
No they weren't. The manufactures still made the rifles they just didn't include some of the cosmetics.
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That's willfully ignorant of the fact that it made it harder to obtain and turn them into mass killing weapons. The law achieved its aim despite your suggesting it wasn't foolproof.
 
#2,486
#2,486
Ashevolle said:
That's willfully ignorant of the fact that it made it harder to obtain and turn them into mass killing weapons. The law achieved its aim despite your suggesting it wasn't foolproof.
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As a matter of equity, the law exempted
“grandfathered” guns and magazines
manufactured before the ban took effect.
While it also banned “exact” or duplicate
copies of the prohibited makes and mod-
els, the emphasis was on “exact.” Short-
ening a gun’s barrel by a few millimeters
or “sporterizing” a rifle by removing
its pistol grip and replacing it with a
thumbhole in the stock, for example,
was sufficient to transform a banned
weapon into a legal substitute.
Click to expand...

So we're still waiting on how the AWB made it harder to obtain or turn them into mass killing weapons (whatever that means)?

https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/173405.pdf
 
#2,487
#2,487
Ashevolle said:
That's willfully ignorant of the fact that it made it harder to obtain and turn them into mass killing weapons. The law achieved its aim despite your suggesting it wasn't foolproof.
Click to expand...
You could still buy 30 round mags from the store while the ban was in effect. Nothing was hard about obtaining them.

You could still buy an AR-15. You could buy an AR-15 with a flash suppressor. Or a collapsible stock. Or a pistol grip. You juts couldn't buy an AR-15 with all 3 of those mods.
 
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#2,490
#2,490
How dumb can you be and still be a TX cop, a spokesman at that?

But Blitzer pressed Olivarez on the long-standing guidance surrounding law enforcement’s response to active-shooter situations.

“Don’t current best practices, don’t they call for officers to disable a shooter as quickly as possible, regardless of how many officers are actually on-site?” Blitzer asked.

Olivarez said that was “correct,” explaining some of the uncertainty faced by law enforcement in Uvalde.

“The active-shooter situation, you want to stop the killing, you want to preserve life, but also one thing that — of course, the American people need to understand — that officers are making entry into this building. They do not know where the gunman is,” Olivarez said. “They are hearing gunshots. They are receiving gunshots.”

That’s when Olivarez told Blitzer that officers were slow to engage because “they could’ve been shot, they could’ve been killed.”

“They were able to contain that gunman inside that classroom so that he was not able to go to any other portions of the school to commit any other killings,” he said.
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Police slow to engage with gunman because ‘they could’ve been shot,’ official says
 
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#2,492
#2,492
BowlBrother85 said:
I don't think there is one root cause. This problem resulted from a perfect storm of causes which have created a "gun culture." Ease of access is only one small part of it. I will post links to sources which describe this "American gun culture" in more detail.
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"American gun culture" has its roots in the founding of the country and particularly in Manifest Destiny, a concept which is almost 200 years old. Trying to effect or change the gun culture would be harder than convincing southerners they should stop watching college football.

Guns have been everywhere in the United States, and relatively easy to get, for a very long time. Certainly longer than regular school shootings have taken place. I am not sure ease of access has much to do at all with the regularity of these shootings, because that variable existed when these things did not occur regularly, so I'm not sure that making them more difficult to legally obtain would prevent or reduce them.
 
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#2,494
#2,494
School Shooting Press Conference: 11:31 patrol car drives by funeral home. 11:33 suspect enters school and begins shooting 100 rounds into room 111 and 112. 11:35 - 3 police officers enter school followed by 3 more and a sheriff (7 officers). Went to door and received wounds from suspect. 11:37 more gunfire; 11:51 - US Border Patrol agents arrive; 12:03 officers continue to arrive in hallway (19 offices in hallway; 12:15 BORTAC officers arrive with shields / 12:21 - suspect fired again from door; 12:21 law enforcement moved down hallway; 12:50 - law enforcement used keys from janitor and killed suspect.
 
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#2,496
#2,496
hog88 said:
Liberal - Only the police should have guns, they will protect us.
Police - Umm we might get shot so you're going to have to wait.
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It's really even more convoluted than that. There is a subset of the left that believes guns are terrible and should be banned, the police are terrible and should be defunded or perhaps even disbanded, but only the police should be allowed to have guns.
 
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#2,497
#2,497
BINGO on my theory that for it to even possibly be an alphabet agency op, he had to have a record they could have identified him as "troubled"

BREAKING: Texas Rep claims Uvalde shooter was arrested at 14 for threatening to shoot up school

Texas Republican Congressman Tony Gonzales says on Fox
"This wasn't hearsay. I got this late last night: 'The shooter was arrested years ago, four years ago, for having this plan for basically saying, for saying, you know, when I’m a senior in 2022, I am going to shoot up a school.'

"Something fell between the cracks between then and now to allow this to happen. We need to shake out all the facts," he said.

"We need to figure out what happened. Where the holes and we need to make sure it doesn’t happen again," Gonzalez went on.

"But if law enforcement, you know, identified him four years ago as a threat, we need to figure out why he wasn’t – you know, how he got removed from that," he said.

"I'm under the impression that him and another person were having a conversation, plotting things out.

"The police looked into it and arrested him. He went to juvenile, from what I can gather, he went to a correctional facility," he said, according to Daily Mail.

After this reporting, Fox News Bill Melugin said that the report from Gonzalez was incorrect, per information from DPS and Texas Rangers.

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That last part of being incorrect tho is likely because his juvie records are sealed. Someone is leaking them tho to the GOP Rep, I suspect.
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From the Daily Mail tho:
DailyMail.com can confirm that an incident in Uvalde where two 'Columbine-infatuated' teenage boys were arrested for threatening to shoot up a school but because they were juveniles, their identities were not confirmed at the time and they remain secret.

Shortly after Gonzales's appearance, FOX reporter Bill Melugin tweeted that Uvalde police denied Ramos was one of the kids involved.

And in a tweet soon after, Gonzales admitted: 'It is now unclear if the shooter was one of the two kids detained.'
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So for now, its unclear - but I suspect this will firm up one way or another soon.
 
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#2,500
#2,500
GOP: lone wolf shoots up school and kill 20 people it's a question ofnindividual responsibility by the shooter.

Also GOP: black gang member shoots rival gange member, this is systemic and has to do with absentee fathers and judges not being hard enough on criminals.
 
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