2010-11 Landscape Now Taking Shape

#1
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Wise-Vol

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#1
Looks like the SEC East will once again dominate the West. Noteable occurrences:

1. Ole Miss loses Holloway and Terrico White.

2. MSU loses Dee Bost on top of Varnardo -- their big-time recruit looked like a beached whale on the bench this year.

3. Alabama loses Torrance, Jemison, and Brock.

4. Arkansas loses Washington & Welsh. Still can't find confirmation on whether Fortson stayed in the draft.

The significance of the above is that none of those teams were particularly outstanding this past year and none of them had the type of recruiting class that can turn you from a mid to bottom level SEC team to an NCAA team based on what they lost. Bama did sign Releford and has a commitment from Jason Carter. Arkansas got Ricky Scott -- but they are going backyards. One wonders how long Pelphrey an last. Ole Miss got a couple of 4 star guys who would have made them much better if they hadn't lost Holloway and White. MSU's recruiting class looks pretty bad and they will have a real hard time replacing Vanardo and Stewart. Losing Bost to the NBA was an added blow.

UT, FL, KY, and Vandy should once again be the teams with the legitimate shot to get in the NCAA. UGA and USC may be worse this year than last.

5. I look for the Vols and Gators to have the upperhand in battling for the SEC because of the experience level. One wonders if Billy Donovan just had a run of luck with the right guys in those two years when he won it all because his teams have underperformed every year since. I don't look for this year to be any different. FL will likely be the pick to win the SEC, but I doubt it happens.

6. KY will fall back. Replacing Cousins with Kanter, Patterson with Dodson, Bledsoe with Liggins, and Wall with Knight will result in a big drop-off for them. And the bench will be much thinner than last season.

7. If I had to pick it, I'd say UT, Vandy and FL are the top 3 and KY 4, but Vandy will be a different team without Ogilvey and Beal, but Jenkins and Taylor are both studs and Tinsley and Ezeli are quality contributors. They add at least one impact freshman in Odom.

8. The reason I like the Vols is because of the experience of Hopson, Williams, Goins, and Tatum in addition to the vast improvement I expect from Hall, Williams, and Goins. Add a legitimate franchise player in Tobias Harris and quality fresh depth from Maymon, McCrae and Golden, and I think the Vols have the right mixture of experience, leadership, and talent to win the SEC. Plus, I think that Pearl may be the best coach in the SEC right now, next to Stallings. I just don't think Donovan is getting the most out of his players, even though Florida will be loaded with experience and depth.

9. I think the Vols have an excellent shot to make some noise this season if we can keep guys like Tatum and Harris healthy. A matured Kenny Hall could be a load inside. Hopson needs to work on his dribble, FT shooting, and mental part of the game. Williams needs to continue where he finished off this past season. We have some decent non-conference, winnable games with Memphis and USC at home and UConn on the road. Winning the preseason NIT may be difficult depending on whether that field includes UNC or Villanova and the Vols may be playing at Pitt this season.

10. When it comes down to it, here is what I think the SEC will look like:

UT
FL
KY
Vandy
Alabama
Ole Miss
MSU
UGA
Arkansas
Auburn
USC
LSU
 
#2
#2
Nick Williams and Dundrecus Nelson will more than make up for the loss of Terrico White. Jeremiah Massey and Demarcus Cox will more than make up for the loss of Holloway.
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#3
#3
I agree on the Kentucky stuff. Also Cal is not a good bench coach. Pearl is one of the best coaches going today. Cal recruits the best but coaching i say no. He had a ton of talent at Memphis. His last three guards are Derrick Rose, Tyrek Evans, Jon Wall. And still no NCAA championship. Tennessee should be around number 1 in the SEC next year. Williams keeps improving like he did. All good. Pat Summitt has all the Lady Vols comming back also. So should be a great year for Vols Basketball.
 
#4
#4
I don't see UGA getting worse, they should be quite a bit better than last year. Kentucky will fall off but I really don't think it will be as bad as some expect...they have a very talented class coming in.
 
#5
#5
Yankee_Vol said:
I don't see UGA getting worse, they should be quite a bit better than last year. Kentucky will fall off but I really don't think it will be as bad as some expect...they have a very talented class coming in.
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They lose 2 of their top 6 players, including their best outside shooter (McPhee), who was pretty solid from three point range at 38% (hitting 40% of all three pointers UGA's team made last season), and Albert Jackson, who was a 6'11 265 pounder off the bench.

The way you get worse is to replace McPhee with an unrated Juco whose other offers were Central Michigan and Creighton and Albert Jackson with a couple of 215 pound 6'8 freshmen who chose UGA over the likes of Central Florida and Tennessee Tech.

Yes, they'll have four solid players in Thompkins, Leslie, Ware, and Price; in fact, Leslie and Thompkins can be spectacular, but they didn't upgrade with the replacements for McPhee and Jackson (and, frankly, it shouldn't have been hard to upgrade from those two).
 
#8
#8
hatvol96 said:
Thank you. They could have signed Phillip Jurick and upgraded.
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They could of signed me and I would have been an upgrade. I can stand at the top of the key and catch passes and look confused too.

Also, I have more than one post move and an actual shot outside of three feet.
 
#9
#9
King Webbsticles said:
Anyone is an upgrade over Albert Jackson.
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When that 6'8 200 pound freshman walks out on the court to give Price a breather, we'll see. :birgits_giggle:

What is more likely, is that UGA will go with a three man rotation in the low post instead of a 4 man rotation, reasoning that Price, Thompkins, and Barnes will be better against guys like Williams, Hall, Harris, and Maymon but that has its own costs. One might say that would, by definition, be worse; at least that is what their coach thinks or Jackson wouldn't have played at all this past season.

Now, I could have just posted something cute like "Anyone is an upgrade" or "If you think _____, then", but that would have meant that both sides of this discussion had offered nothing to the analysis.

Who knows, perhaps someone else out there can jump in and give us a decent counter-argument with meat on the bones.
 
#10
#10
Wise-Vol said:
When that 6'8 200 pound freshman walks out on the court to give Price a breather, we'll see. :birgits_giggle:

What is more likely, is that UGA will go with a three man rotation in the low post instead of a 4 man rotation, reasoning that Price, Thompkins, and Barnes will be better against guys like Williams, Hall, Harris, and Maymon but that has its own costs. One might say that would, by definition, be worse; at least that is what their coach thinks or Jackson wouldn't have played at all this past season.

Now, I could have just posted something cute like "Anyone is an upgrade" or "If you think _____, then", but that would have meant that both sides of this discussion had offered nothing to the analysis.

Who knows, perhaps someone else out there can jump in and give us a decent counter-argument with meat on the bones.
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Your going a little to MHF style on this post for my liking. Trying to analyze to many variables by using your opinion only for prediction. What you have to rely on are the facts. Facts that are observed from last season. First, that Mark Fox is a great game plan coach who will try to crush a teams weakness and is also great at compensating for his teams own weakness. He did it with UK and several others.

Second is the fact that while Fox was working with a HORRIBLE roster, he was able to defeat and take other SEC powers to the brink last season. Regardless of what sentimental feelings someone may have about Jackson, the only substantial player they are losing is Mcphee. Who was a great shooter, but not much else. With Fox bringing a power forward and a center both graded out at a 90 in this class, I'm sure they won't miss Jackson at all.

This team will improve defensively, and will be even tougher under Fox during his second year. Count on it.
 
#11
#11
Not sure how much sec west bball you watched last year. Lsu had 4 players basically and looked pretty good for a half over and over before wearing down like they were a sun belt team depth wise. They have a top 25 class.

So does d horn. Horn also has two of his best players who missed most of the year from injury back. I want all those like hat who say south carolina will suck without downey to define suck, say less than 15 wins so I can laugh at them later.

I also think that pelphrey did not adequately explain the rapist suspensions that lead to the terrible start. If pelphrey had his full roster all season they win 5 more games and avoid their worst losses and his seat is not too warm at this point.

I agree with those who said fox is a good coach and uga will have a decent team next year.

Last year uga early, arkansas early and auburn and to a greater extent lsu just sucked all year. Alabamas coach seems to be one of the worst talent squanderers.

I think the sec will be drastically improved at the bottom and at the top although uk will not have as much talent, vanderbilt and tennessee and florida will all be hanging with them in the top 25 and the sec with the huge influx of new talent will look strong.
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#12
#12
Hardwood_fanatic said:
Your going a little to MHF style on this post for my liking. Trying to analyze to many variables by using your opinion only for prediction. What you have to rely on are the facts. Facts that are observed from last season. First, that Mark Fox is a great game plan coach who will try to crush a teams weakness and is also great at compensating for his teams own weakness. He did it with UK and several others.

Second is the fact that while Fox was working with a HORRIBLE roster, he was able to defeat and take other SEC powers to the brink last season. Regardless of what sentimental feelings someone may have about Jackson, the only substantial player they are losing is Mcphee. Who was a great shooter, but not much else. With Fox bringing a power forward and a center both graded out at a 90 in this class, I'm sure they won't miss Jackson at all.

This team will improve defensively, and will be even tougher under Fox during his second year. Count on it.
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Fact -- the two freshmen post players coming in are rated the same as Jackson was rated 4 years ago as an incoming freshman. The differences are (1) Jackson was a Senior last year who had played SEC BB for three years; and (2) he was physically ready the day he stepped on campus, whereas the two freshmen they are bringing in have JP Prince's size without the strength JP surely has from spending time in a college weight program.

My guess is that Fox (who is the same coach as they had last year when they sucked) would rather have a 6'11 265 pound Senior off the bench than a 6'9 200 pound freshman or a 6'8 215 pound freshman. But, you certainly are entitled to disagree. I wonder who Brian Williams will be happier to see guarding him.
 
#14
#14
Wise-Vol said:
Fact -- the two freshmen post players coming in are rated the same as Jackson was rated 4 years ago as an incoming freshman. The differences are (1) Jackson was a Senior last year who had played SEC BB for three years; and (2) he was physically ready the day he stepped on campus, whereas the two freshmen they are bringing in have JP Prince's size without the strength JP surely has from spending time in a college weight program.

My guess is that Fox (who is the same coach as they had last year when they sucked) would rather have a 6'11 265 pound Senior off the bench than a 6'9 200 pound freshman or a 6'8 215 pound freshman. But, you certainly are entitled to disagree. I wonder who Brian Williams will be happier to see guarding him.
Click to expand...


The discussion at hand is whether or not Georgia will be improved next season, not who Fox would rather have coming off the bench. You seem to think that by pointing out that Georgia "sucked" last season under the first year of a new coach with a depleted, mediocre roster somehow validates your point that losing Jackson will make them worse.


If you watched any SEC basketball last season, maybe you noticed that the team you say sucked last season beat the 3 of the top 4 teams in the SEC last season. They drummed the hell out of UT, and beat Vandy AND Florida, while taking UK down to the wire at Rupp. No, last seasons record doesn't indicate a great team by the numbers. But if you watched their games last year and have the slightest inclination of basketball IQ, you can see that they are a team that is very close to being decent.

Jackson didn't score, or do much of note other than provide a decent low post presence on defense and some rebounding. Losing Jackson and gaining two bodies with better talent (they both step out and shoot the mid-range jumper well) is not any sort of reason to assume they are taking a step back. Guarding Brian Williams will be the least of their worries.

Georgia will be a better team than last year.
 
#16
#16
MikeHamiltonFan said:
Not sure how much sec west bball you watched last year. Lsu had 4 players basically and looked pretty good for a half over and over before wearing down like they were a sun belt team depth wise. They have a top 25 class.

So does d horn. Horn also has two of his best players who missed most of the year from injury back. I want all those like hat who say south carolina will suck without downey to define suck, say less than 15 wins so I can laugh at them later.

I also think that pelphrey did not adequately explain the rapist suspensions that lead to the terrible start. If pelphrey had his full roster all season they win 5 more games and avoid their worst losses and his seat is not too warm at this point.

I agree with those who said fox is a good coach and uga will have a decent team next year.

Last year uga early, arkansas early and auburn and to a greater extent lsu just sucked all year. Alabamas coach seems to be one of the worst talent squanderers.

I think the sec will be drastically improved at the bottom and at the top although uk will not have as much talent, vanderbilt and tennessee and florida will all be hanging with them in the top 25 and the sec with the huge influx of new talent will look strong.
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Click to expand...

Did you read the original post? With the loss of the players indicated, there is no way the SEC will be better next year. KY will not be as good, TN will not be as good, at least early in the season, FLA has the most experience, but has under-achieved. The West is still the West with no real quality teams. SC will not be better when they lost their only scorer. I agree that GA will be better and has an excellent coach. Overall, no way the SEC will be better or one of the top conferences. You continue to tout the SEC as one of the top conferences with no real basis for doing so.
 
#17
#17
Where did Fox for Georgia come from? I don't remember hearing much about him til he got to UGA
 
#21
#21
BasketvolsFan said:
Did you read the original post? With the loss of the players indicated, there is no way the SEC will be better next year. KY will not be as good, TN will not be as good, at least early in the season, FLA has the most experience, but has under-achieved. The West is still the West with no real quality teams. SC will not be better when they lost their only scorer. I agree that GA will be better and has an excellent coach. Overall, no way the SEC will be better or one of the top conferences. You continue to tout the SEC as one of the top conferences with no real basis for doing so.
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Yes and just like the original poster you do not understand south carolina.

Go ahead and tell me just how bad they will be.

Why don't you tell me how much worse the sec will be next year as well.

Less ooc wins? You want to make that prediction?
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#23
#23
MikeHamiltonFan said:
Yes and just like the original poster you do not understand south carolina.

Go ahead and tell me just how bad they will be.

Why don't you tell me how much worse the sec will be next year as well.

Less ooc wins? You want to make that prediction?
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Click to expand...

It's no worse than calling Charlotte and Mizzou "good wins" for any club. Everyone makes wrong predictions. You all just want to start pissing contests when the other happens to be wrong. And some are more wrong than others.
 
#24
#24
Wise-Vol said:
When that 6'8 200 pound freshman walks out on the court to give Price a breather, we'll see. :birgits_giggle:

What is more likely, is that UGA will go with a three man rotation in the low post instead of a 4 man rotation, reasoning that Price, Thompkins, and Barnes will be better against guys like Williams, Hall, Harris, and Maymon but that has its own costs. One might say that would, by definition, be worse; at least that is what their coach thinks or Jackson wouldn't have played at all this past season.

Now, I could have just posted something cute like "Anyone is an upgrade" or "If you think _____, then", but that would have meant that both sides of this discussion had offered nothing to the analysis.

Who knows, perhaps someone else out there can jump in and give us a decent counter-argument with meat on the bones.
Click to expand...

You call it being cute but I was being honest... ANYONE will be an upgrade over Albert Jackson. Forget rankings out of high school or playing as a senior, Albert Jackson is the worst player on Georgia's team, including their walk-ons from wherever. His only offense was clean-up dunks and his one turn around lefty hook, he had no shot, and couldn't dribble more than twice. He was truly the worst player on the court every night.
 
#25
#25
MikeHamiltonFan said:
Yes and just like the original poster you do not understand south carolina.

Go ahead and tell me just how bad they will be.

Why don't you tell me how much worse the sec will be next year as well.

Less ooc wins? You want to make that prediction?
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

You're right. South Carolina is set to win 25+ games this year. Look at all that scoring they bring back. Losing that Downey kid is going to help them in the long run. He only scored about 90% of the points.
 
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