2020 Presidential Race

#96,576
#96,576
Orangeburst said:
Thousands of affidavits, counting in middle of the night after a supposed pipe burst and evacuation, boxes pulled from under a drapped table...If in our shoes, what would you think?
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If I was a Trump supporter, I would want to know why members of the 2020 Trump Campaign's legal representation (including Rudy Giuliani, Jenna Ellis, Lin Wood and Sidney Powell), don't make the same claims of voter fraud and "cheating" in their court filings, and while appearing before a federal judge (even one who was appointed by Donald Trump himself, such as Judge Stephanos Bibas), as they make when they are giving interviews on one of the cable news networks. Judge Bibas's opinion is very clear. Massive voter fraud is not even being alleged. The only time that Trump's attorneys allege fraud, is when they are grandstanding on a Fox News show hosted by someone like Sean Hannity or Jeanine Pirro, who they know won't challenge them on their presentation of the established facts.
 
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#96,577
#96,577
BowlBrother85 said:
If I were a Trump supporter, I would want to know why members of the 2020 Trump Campaign's legal representation (including Rudy Giuliani, Jenna Ellis, Lin Wood and Sidney Powell), don't make the same claims of voter fraud and "cheating" in their court filings, and while appearing before a federal judge (even one who was appointed by Donald Trump himself, such as Judge Stephanos Bibas), as they make when they are giving interviews on one of the cable news networks. Judge Bibas's opinion is very clear. Massive voter fraud is not even being alleged. The only time that Trump's attorneys allege fraud, is when they are grandstanding on a Fox News show hosted by someone like Sean Hannity or Jeanine Pirro, who they know won't challenge them on their presentation of the established facts.
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Why the protest to an audit and put this to rest? 99% of America would say "Hey it is over. Gotta win the ballot box".
You guys spent 3 years trying to "get" Trump, but this is waaaay beyond Trump winning the election.
 
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#96,578
#96,578
AM64 said:
Don't you suppose that dem legislators who would in theory ask the most critical questions have been told to stay away from the hearings - that their presence would legitimize the proceedings. The entire response from start to finish has been to ignore, ignore, ignore. The courts use standing to ignore what they don't want to hear.
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The last line of your statement, which I placed in bold, is not true in every case. As I have posted many times to this thread before, Judge Stephanos Bibas of the Third Circuit Court of Appeals (and an appointee of President Donald Trump's), was willing to allow new witnesses to be called, and he was also willing to allow Trump's legal representation to present any evidence in support of voter fraud that they wished to make. However, as Judge Bibas specifically stated in his opinion, the Trump legal team chose not to call any witnesses, or present any evidence before him. In fact, they didn't even allege systemic voter fraud in their filings at all. Judge Bibas dismissed their case while describing it as having failed on its merits... not on standing, or any such technicality as you and others like you, have repeatedly (and falsely) claimed in this thread.

There doesn't seem much else to say, except that you are very stubborn, and you refuse to acknowledge the opinion of Judge Stephanos Bibas - who is a Trump appointed judge.
 
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#96,579
#96,579
The center and left have been bigger than the right for a while.

The problem with the left is that they try to hide and subdue their fringe, which disenfranchises them and leaves them at home during elections.

The center is tired of being told to pick a side when they believe in pieces and parts of what each side brings to the table.

The right actively uses its crazies to its advantage, riling up their base in an eternal pep rally while successfully shoving the Overton Window further to the right.

Before long, being a centrist will be considered radical and being a classical conservative will be considered RINO.
 
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#96,581
#96,581
AshG said:
The center and left have been bigger than the right for a while.

The problem with the left is that they try to hide and subdue their fringe, which disenfranchises them and leaves them at home during elections.

The center is tired of being told to pick a side when they believe in pieces and parts of what each side brings to the table.

The right actively uses its crazies to its advantage, riling up their base in an eternal pep rally while successfully shoving the Overton Window further to the right.

Before long, being a centrist will be considered radical and being a classical conservative will be considered RINO.
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Before long, being a "RINO" is simply going to refer to any Republican who disavows the unprofessional conduct of Donald Trump. That is why they are becoming the party of crackpots.
 
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#96,583
#96,583
lawgator1 said:
The phone call by Trump released today, where he just cites hearsay and refuses to admit reality, then threatens people, is very disturbing. It suggests he actually does intend to go down in flames on this and to take everyone else with him. He is unbalanced. They need to invoke the 25th and get the man some help.
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Just listened to the entire hour and I gotta say your presumption was..well..incorrect. I am sure you listened to it before comment though.
 
#96,584
#96,584
lawgator1 said:
The phone call by Trump released today, where he just cites hearsay and refuses to admit reality, then threatens people, is very disturbing. It suggests he actually does intend to go down in flames on this and to take everyone else with him. He is unbalanced. They need to invoke the 25th and get the man some help.
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I am concerned more with the illegal release of this convo than I am any improprieties,,lulz.
 
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#96,585
#96,585
BowlBrother85 said:
The last line of your statement, which I placed in bold, is not true in every case. As I have posted many times to this thread before, Judge Stephanos Bibas of the Third Circuit Court of Appeals (and an appointee of President Donald Trump's), was willing to allow new witnesses to be called, and he was also willing to allow Trump's legal representation to present any evidence in support of voter fraud that they wished to make. However, as Judge Bibas specifically stated in his opinion, the Trump legal team chose not to call any witnesses, or present any evidence before him. In fact, they didn't even allege systemic voter fraud in their filings at all. Judge Bibas dismissed their case while describing it as having failed on its merits... not on standing, or any such technicality as you and others like you, have repeatedly (and falsely) claimed in this thread.

There doesn't seem much else to say, except that you are very stubborn, and you refuse to acknowledge the opinion of Judge Stephanos Bibas - who is a Trump appointed judge.
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I feel certain there's a half truth in there somewhere.
 
#96,587
#96,587
AM64 said:
I feel certain there's a half truth in there somewhere.
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BB is spot on regarding that specific case. Furthermore what the hell stopped the Trump team from going to where they did have standing after being they told they did not in federal court? It's clear Trumps legal team knew they had squat. Hell even Lindsey Graham, who has been one of the top Trump water carriers, said today he will listen but hasn't seen shat. Also said this was all political theatre.
 
#96,588
#96,588
AM64 said:
I feel certain there's a half truth in there somewhere.
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There are, in fact, two full truths:

(1) Judge Stephanos Bibas was appointed to the Third Circuit Court of Appeals by President Donald Trump.

AND ....

(2) Judge Stephanos Bibas did not dismiss the case brought before him by the 2020 Trump Campaign's legal representation because of "a lack of standing", or because of any other such technicality. He dismissed the case after specifically saying that it had failed on its merits.
 
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#96,589
#96,589
lawgator1 said:
The phone call by Trump released today, where he just cites hearsay and refuses to admit reality, then threatens people, is very disturbing. It suggests he actually does intend to go down in flames on this and to take everyone else with him. He is unbalanced. They need to invoke the 25th and get the man some help.
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Please. Before he inevitably self-pardons.
 
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#96,590
#96,590
BowlBrother85 said:
There are, in fact, two full truths:

(1) Judge Stephanos Bibas was appointed to the Third Circuit Court of Appeals by President Donald Trump.

AND ....

(2) Judge Stephanos Bibas did not dismiss the case brought before him by the 2020 Trump Campaign's legal representation because of "a lack of standing", or because of any other such technicality. He dismissed the case after specifically saying that it had failed on its merits.
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I see where Bilbas said “Voters, not lawyers, choose the President. Ballots, not briefs, decide elections”. I didn't see where he invited evidence. The challenges have been haphazard and generally seem ill prepared - to be honest what has been presented in several cases is something like never having gone to class, cracked a book, or made a real attempt to understand the course material, but fully expecting to ace the final. I also saw that Bilbas noted that what was presented didn't appear to harm one side more than another; which would be true, if you neglect the reason for mail in voting in the first place - not someplace he or any other jurist wants to go. The real basic issue is why would a federal appeals court even agree to accept a case that didn't get there through a lower court; doing so and rejecting it looks a lot like grandstanding.
 
#96,592
#96,592
There is no illegal release of the phone call. GA is a one party consent on recordings. The call was glorious. Worthwhile to listen to the whole thing. Especially those with TDS, just to make your blood boil. The most damning thing coming from the call was how the SOS is obstructing investigation under the guise of violating state law. Even after Trump lawyers offered a compromise. The most entertaining thing was Trump went full on Trump on those guys. Enjoy it Trump haters.
 
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#96,594
#96,594
I love all you legal experts and your opinions as to the law and the holdings of the court. I wonder how many people on here who declare things to be illegal or unconstitutional are actually attorneys.
 
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#96,595
#96,595
Must suck to ne on the receiving end of this smackdown.

SUCK IT DONNIE

"All 10 living former US Defense secretaries declared that the US presidential election is over in a forceful public letter published in The Washington Post on Sunday as President Donald Trump continues to deny his election loss to Joe Biden.

The letter -- signed by Dick Cheney, James Mattis, Mark Esper, Leon Panetta, Donald Rumsfeld, William Cohen, Chuck Hagel, Robert Gates, William Perry and Ashton Carter -- amounts to a remarkable show of force against Trump's subversion efforts just days before Congress is set to count Electoral College votes."
 
#96,596
#96,596
WBO said:
I love all you legal experts and your opinions as to the law and the holdings of the court. I wonder how many people on here who declare things to be illegal or unconstitutional are actually attorneys.
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None. Even those that lawyer in their name.
 
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#96,597
#96,597
MontyPython said:
Must suck to ne on the receiving end of this smackdown.

SUCK IT DONNIE

"All 10 living former US Defense secretaries declared that the US presidential election is over in a forceful public letter published in The Washington Post on Sunday as President Donald Trump continues to deny his election loss to Joe Biden.

The letter -- signed by Dick Cheney, James Mattis, Mark Esper, Leon Panetta, Donald Rumsfeld, William Cohen, Chuck Hagel, Robert Gates, William Perry and Ashton Carter -- amounts to a remarkable show of force against Trump's subversion efforts just days before Congress is set to count Electoral College votes."
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Meaningless.
 
#96,598
#96,598
BowlBrother85 said:
Before long, being a "RINO" is simply going to refer to any Republican who disavows the unprofessional conduct of Donald Trump. That is why they are becoming the party of crackpots.
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We’re basically already at the point where active Trump supporters are considered RINO’s for not actively trying to help Trump steal the election.
 
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