2024 Presidential Race

#53,851
#53,851
utvolpj said:
So you agree the rhetoric from the left helped drive the attempts on Trump's life?

Is the dramatic increase in such rhetoric from the left a good idea wrt violence?
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It's hard to say. Every situation is different. Every nut is different. The first guy is dead and the 2nd guy hasn't revealed what his motivation was. It's possible that the political climate played a role. It's also possible that the 2 loons would have done it anyway. It's not always easy to account for irrational behavior. People have been trying to assassinate presidential candidates forever. Sirhan Sirhan's logic for killing RFK has never made any sense. Nixon supported Israel too. So what was killing RFK going to accomplish?
 
#53,852
#53,852
utvolpj said:
So you agree the rhetoric from the left helped drive the attempts on Trump's life?

Is the dramatic increase in such rhetoric from the left a good idea wrt violence?
Click to expand...
Answer to 1st question:
About 1/8 as much as trump's rhetoric contributed to the Jan. 6 madness. (so yes, somewhat)
Answer to question 2:
It's not a good idea wrt violence but it's a good idea wrt to an accurate portrayal of the dangers of trumpism.
It's an unfortunate tradeoff necessitated by the complete and inexplicable lunacy of a 3rd election with trump as a candidate.
 
#53,853
#53,853
utvolpj said:
I'd agree with you but not for the same reasons I'm sure. One would have absolutely sent this country into a dark place and the other resulted in an upper decker in Pelosi's office. One was infinitely closer to reality than the other ( and had more guns involved)
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We’re talking about different things. I was saying the rhetoric is not on par, wasn’t discussing the “results.”
 
#53,854
#53,854
luthervol said:
Answer to 1st question:
About 1/8 as much as trump's rhetoric contributed to the Jan. 6 madness. (so yes, somewhat)
Answer to question 2:
It's not a good idea wrt violence but it's a good idea wrt to an accurate portrayal of the dangers of trumpism.
It's an unfortunate tradeoff necessitated by the complete and inexplicable lunacy of a 3rd election with trump as a candidate.
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Accurate in what reality? Comparing the current republican party to the Nazis of the 1930s is completely idiotic. That's especially true given the assault on rights by the left more closely resembles the movement. You spit on the deaths of millions with your ignorant take

It's a call to violence against Americans that you support. It won't turn out like you think
 
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#53,855
#53,855
luthervol said:
Answer to 1st question:
About 1/8 as much as trump's rhetoric contributed to the Jan. 6 madness. (so yes, somewhat)
Answer to question 2:
It's not a good idea wrt violence but it's a good idea wrt to an accurate portrayal of the dangers of trumpism.
It's an unfortunate tradeoff necessitated by the complete and inexplicable lunacy of a 3rd election with trump as a candidate.
Click to expand...

classic Luther - first we have delusional assessment ("accurate portrayal"), followed by the ends justify the means rationale for really bad behavior
 
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#53,856
#53,856
volinbham said:
pin worthy

"Here is a prediction," said pro-Harris political commentator Matthew Dowd, speaking on the X social media site. "Watch every one of poll aggregators/election predictors shift their models this week to favor Harris ... They have been wrong for a month."

Perhaps Dowd is correct - but I'm guessing he's wrong at least on the the models shifting.
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Dowd is supporting Harris, but he was also the chief strategist for the George W. Bush campaign in 2004. He has biases but they aren't strictly down party lines, and his election analysis has been good in the past.

Having said that .... Polls have underestimated Trump's chances in the past. It's not easy to feel confident in Harris right now.
 
#53,859
#53,859
BowlBrother85 said:
It's hard to say. Every situation is different. Every nut is different. The first guy is dead and the 2nd guy hasn't revealed what his motivation was. It's possible that the political climate played a role. It's also possible that the 2 loons would have done it anyway. It's not always easy to account for irrational behavior. People have been trying to assassinate presidential candidates forever. Sirhan Sirhan's logic for killing RFK has never made any sense. Nixon supported Israel too. So what was killing RFK going to accomplish?
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Happening forever? I'm almost 50 and have never experienced a candidate for potus get shot and have a second attempt thwarted.

In the kill baby Hitler thought experiment there are always those who will choose to murder a baby. We should probably not have our party leaders encourage them to do so. Anyone who does should be disqualified
 
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#53,860
#53,860
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#53,861
#53,861
BowlBrother85 said:
I don't either .. but he is right about Trafalgar Group. That is a Republican push poll. I'm surprised that Real Clear Polling still uses it.
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TG results in battlegrounds are either at or less supportive of Trump than other polling groups. Michigan was the only one I saw where they were more Trump than other polls and that was only by 1 point. So while they may skew right in general their impact on the polling averages is negligible
 
#53,862
#53,862
utvolpj said:
Happening forever? I'm almost 50 and have never experienced a candidate for potus get shot and have a second attempt thwarted.

In the kill baby Hitler thought experiment there are always those who will choose to murder a baby. We should probably not have our party leaders encourage them to do so. Anyone who does should be disqualified
Click to expand...
Gerald Ford technically had two assassination attempts. Sarah Moore took a shot at him. Squeaky approached him with a gun, but it wasn't loaded. She was was as dumb as you would expect Charles Manson's girlfriend to be.
 
#53,863
#53,863
volinbham said:
TG results in battlegrounds are either at or less supportive of Trump than other polling groups. Michigan was the only one I saw where they were more Trump than other polls and that was only by 1 point.
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That's fine .... but their 2022 mid-term polling was infamously bad. In every case where they were wrong, it was always in favor of the Republican. It is a Republican-affiliated poll.
 
#53,864
#53,864
vol94 said:
You may not believe it but more power to you. He isn’t a racist. A person isn’t racist for wanting border control.

The left is so quick to label a person.
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I'm saying the part about him always being respectful. He's a totally bully and a dickhead.
 
#53,865
#53,865
BowlBrother85 said:
That's fine .... but their 2022 mid-term polling was infamously bad. In every case where they were wrong, it was always in favor of the Republican. It is a Republican-affiliated poll.
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and Ipsos, Morning Consult, and others have a blue bias. what really matters is whether or not they are significantly different in results than other polls. if the lean blue and lead red polls come to the same conclusion it's hard to say it's just the red one that's off (or just the blue one)
 
#53,867
#53,867
utvolpj said:
Happening forever? I'm almost 50 and have never experienced a candidate for potus get shot and have a second attempt thwarted.

In the kill baby Hitler thought experiment there are always those who will choose to murder a baby. We should probably not have our party leaders encourage them to do so. Anyone who does should be disqualified
Click to expand...
Our party leaders shouldn't be leading chants of "lock her up" about their opponent.

Easy to see where and when we went completely off the rails.
 
#53,870
#53,870
luthervol said:
Our party leaders shouldn't be leading chants of "lock her up" about their opponent.

Easy to see where and when we went completely off the rails.
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Your party leaders are actually saying that and using the govt to do it! You're pay spent 2 years trying to oust the opposing party potus based on a hoax. How do you not understand these basic things? Those are off the rail moments
 
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#53,871
#53,871
volinbham said:
and Ipsos, Morning Consult, and others have a blue bias. what really matters is whether or not they are significantly different in results than other polls. if the lean blue and lead red polls come to the same conclusion it's hard to say it's just the red one that's off (or just the blue one)
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nymag.com

The Pollster Who Predicted a Red Wave Explains Himself

Trafalgar Group’s Robert Cahaly says he underestimated how bad Republicans were at getting out the vote.
nymag.com nymag.com

Nobody was worse than Trafalgar Group in 2022.

They had :

Tudor Dixon over Gretchen Whitmer in Michigan. Whitmer won by 12 points.
Tiffany Smiley over Patty Murray in Washington. Murray won by 15 points.
 
#53,872
#53,872
BowlBrother85 said:
Gerald Ford technically had two assassination attempts. Sarah Moore took a shot at him. Squeaky approached him with a gun, but it wasn't loaded. She was was as dumb as you would expect Charles Manson's girlfriend to be.
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None within my lifetime as I said. That's half a century of something that's been happening forever not actually happening. There's a reason people are currently trying to kill Hitler and fight the nazi party before it takes power
 
#53,873
#53,873
utvolpj said:
None within my lifetime as I said. That's half a century of something that's been happening forever not actually happening. There's a reason people are currently trying to kill Hitler and fight the nazi party before it takes power
Click to expand...
You weren't around for the Reagan assassination attempt?
 
#53,874
#53,874
utvolpj said:
None within my lifetime as I said. That's half a century of something that's been happening forever not actually happening. There's a reason people are currently trying to kill Hitler and fight the nazi party before it takes power
Click to expand...
It's gotta be close .... LOL. You said almost 50. Both of Ford's attempts occurred in 1975.
 
#53,875
#53,875
utvolpj said:
You're party leaders are actually saying that and using the govt to do it! You're pay spent 2 years trying to oust the opposing party potus based on a hoax. How do you not understand these basic things? Those are off the rail moments
Click to expand...
All of that is AFTER we went off the rails (2016)......they were/are attempts to get us back on the tracks.
We've now been off the rails for 8 years and are looking at 4 more.

How do you not understand that? Those outcomes were obvious in 2016 when trump first slimed his way down his golden escalator.
 
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