2025 Recruiting

[Majors]

I'm trying to follow along here bc you're really threading a needle. Is your stance that recruits are visiting, liking, considering LVs a finalists, but then somewhere in the period btw selecting as a finalist and committing learning something about KJH that they didn't know before and therefore saying no? Everything on track until the last second when there's a sudden KJH reveal and their fleeing?

You are certainly entitled to that opinion, but that's pretzel logic on an anti-KJH agenda to me. Esp when there's a more logical explanation at that point in the process, that it's the money. And esp when multiple people I know to be "insiders" have told us its the money. Maybe you're just more clever than all of us, or maybe you're being too clever by half.

Either way, we're on a downward spiral with hs recruiting and it's painful. Can't gloss over that we're falling further and further behind. I just want us to correct the right problem.

We discussed the All Tennessee brand a few days ago. You can pull my history on Kellie closing this isn’t a new thing.

 

[glv98]

We discussed the All Tennessee brand a few days ago. You can pull my history on Kellie closing this isn’t a new thing.

OK, drilling down. So the brand and Sam are getting them on the finals list, then the Kellie reveal is losing them. But this is what I don't understand. KJH is a totally known quantity at this point from the get go. I just can't imagine a recruit pushing past all the negitivity toward her and then finding out something new at the last minute that turns them away. The lack of NIL explanation just makes a ton more sense to me. But it's all opinion as to why it's happening, you have yours, I have mine, the result is equally dismal.

 

[Majors]

Most will admit the HS recruiting has been poor. My question is whether her ability to make up for it in the portal is sustainable. I think we'll be able to answer that with what she does this Spring with portal recruiting. If she lands a Jackson level scoring threat, a Key level post player, and 1 or 2 decent supporting cast type players, then recruiting is fine. I guess we'll see, a lot could change.

That’s fair and probably the stance by most. Accept she’s not connecting with HS players (Tier 1/2) and putting hope in “could change” and fall in the lap.

Portal recruiting isn’t free, so how do we pull a Top 5 portal class last year, #1 portal player the year before but somehow have issues with Top Tier HS kids?

 

[Volfan2012]

OK, drilling down. So the brand and Sam are getting them on the finals list, then the Kellie reveal is losing them. But this is what I don't understand. KJH is a totally known quantity at this point from the get go. I just can't imagine a recruit pushing past all the negitivity toward her and then finding out something new at the last minute that turns them away. The lack of NIL explanation just makes a ton more sense to me. But it's all opinion as to why it's happening, you have yours, I have mine, the result is equally dismal.

I could see it changing to some extent as we've been using whatever NIL money we have for portal players and we've had good success with the portal. It was ok to offer portal players NIL deals cause they were already in college. Now with the new law you can offer NIL to high school so priorities could change some and we may offer the NIL money we have to high school players and less to portal players. You only need enough to grab four elite players per year. We haven't been able to do that but we've at least got a couple.

 

[Majors]

OK, drilling down. So the brand and Sam are getting them on the finals list, then the Kellie reveal is losing them. But this is what I don't understand. KJH is a totally known quantity at this point from the get go. I just can't imagine a recruit pushing past all the negitivity toward her and then finding out something new at the last minute that turns them away. The lack of NIL explanation just makes a ton more sense to me. But it's all opinion as to why it's happening, you have yours, I have mine, the result is equally dismal.

How can we land portal with NIL and celebrate the talent and not connect with HS and default to NIL? I go back to her recruiting pre-NIL…she wasn’t landing kids then either.

 

[FormerLadyVolFan]

...and since it doesn't fit your agenda, you ignore the recruiting restrictions during the pandemic.

How can we land portal with NIL and celebrate the talent and not connect with HS and default to NIL? I go back to her recruiting pre-NIL…she wasn’t landing kids then either.

 

[Majors]

...and since it doesn't fit your agenda, you ignore the recruiting restrictions during the pandemic.

She got Pissott? Or no. 2023- 0

She wasn’t under a different set of rules than the other schools in the NCAA. So please say my agenda…the term isn’t taking off no matter how much you use it. I’ll give you credit, you never miss a chance to make an excuse or spin what people are seeing.

 

[glv98]

Portal recruiting isn’t free, so how do we pull a Top 5 portal class last year, #1 portal player the year before but somehow have issues with Top Tier HS kids?

How can we land portal with NIL and celebrate the talent and not connect with HS and default to NIL? I go back to her recruiting pre-NIL…she wasn’t landing kids then either.

If we accept the NIL narrative, which I understand you don't, the few donors we can scrape up are ammenable to gambling on a portal player (like duh, a Ricka Jackson) much more than an unproven hs recruit. And that does make sense inside the NIL narrative. We know that's what happened last spring w RIckea, they scrambled and found the Furrows willing to make the pretty no brainer investment in her.
Interested parties are much more sold on Jewel Spear than Janiah Williams as worth their money.

 

[FormerLadyVolFan]

The coaches don't discuss with the players what is going on with recruiting. They ask them to support it and help out during official visits, but aren't privy to who's currently holding commitable offers.

Wow, breaking news! You changed sides! You now agree the recruiting problem is not the staff, otherwise we wouldn't make the finals list so often. Welcome!

But within a couple of days? BC TK and RJ (who got criticized here just the other day for not helping w recruiting) tweeted Williams urging her to come here just a couple of days ago after her "finalist" list came out.

Maybe the LVs bailed quickly when they realized it wasn't going to be them? If so it totally didn't work, since all social media sees is yet another KJH recruiting fail.

 

[Majors]

If we accept the NIL narrative, which I understand you don't, the few donors we can scrape up are ammenable to gambling on a portal player (like duh, a Ricka Jackson) much more than an unproven hs recruit. And that does make sense inside the NIL narrative. We know that's what happened last spring w RIckea, they scrambled and found the Furrows willing to make the pretty no brainer investment in her.
Interested parties are much more sold on Jewel Spear than Janiah Williams as worth their money.

If you’re Powell/Spear/Key are you looking to next year saying we want a set of keys with a loaded package? Is it time to maybe advise older players to seek elsewhere to free up opportunity?

 

[glv98]

Portal recruiting isn’t free, so how do we pull a Top 5 portal class last year, #1 portal player the year before but somehow have issues with Top Tier HS kids?

Because:

we've been using whatever NIL money we have for portal players and we've had good success with the portal. It was ok to offer portal players NIL deals cause they were already in college.

 

[Volfan2012]

Another reason we were seeing more portal recruiting is because those players were the safer players to sign at least until this year. They had one transfer and when they used it they were here to stay or sit out a season. High school players were free to leave the day after they signed. Now with the new transfer rules neither is a safe deal for continuing in you program. You need to hope the NIL deals they are getting are enough to keep them here. So you decide which way you want to go with the most NIL money.

Plus high school recruiting could definitely be affected by NIL money if your not offering any cause it is illegal to do so and other schools are offering regardless of rules. So I am interested to see where it goes now. Will boosters that can make the difference change their attitude. If so we should see some high school players as commits in 2025 real soon. If not expect more of the same cause high school kids are really into NIL deals first thing they want to know when you are recruiting them.

 

[glv98]

If you’re Powell/Spear/Key are you looking to next year saying we want a set of keys with a loaded package? Is it time to maybe advise older players to seek elsewhere to free up opportunity?

Yes. That's part of the new landscape and what football just did. Decide who to pay to stay as well as who to pay to play. I think it will take a bit for the level of the free agency $ to get to big levels for WBB, esp for the players you mentioned who all have limited eligibility left. But a tippy top level like JuJu will make bank this spring. And every coach is looking at eternal, nonstop recruiting, both of your current players and new ones.

BTW not Powell, she's gone. Maybe meant Wells? Going nowhere due to the injury. IMO neither Jewel nor TK would look to transfer either. Jewel's stated goal is to get to the W and she's at program with 4 straight first rounders.

 

[Majors]

Because:

ROI is projecting a 4th place finish and anywhere between no tournament, bubble-7th seed. Not my definition of good success. I will say, the silver lining is RJ helping prolong the inevitable.

 

[Majors]

Yes. That's part of the new landscape and what football just did. Decide who to pay to stay as well as who to pay to play. I think it will take a bit for the level of the free agency $ to get to big levels for WBB, esp for the players you mentioned who all have limited eligibility left. But a tippy top level like JuJu will make bank this spring. And every coach is looking at eternal, nonstop recruiting, both of your current players and new ones.

BTW not Powell, she's gone. Maybe meant Wells? Going nowhere due to the injury.

Not Wells, I retract Powell

Are fans going to be ok saying bye to Key? It’s just business.

 

[glv98]

Will boosters that can make the difference change their attitude.

If someone is already suspicous of NIL, what's about to happen is not likely to make that better. I think best case it will take some time and some damn PROFESSIONAL fund development to establish a new donor base for whom NIL is inevitable therefore acceptable. Sadly, we ain't got time.

 

[glv98]

Are fans going to be ok saying bye to Key? It’s just business.

Not going to happen. I remember when you and Darth were convinced she was going to transfer to NC to be w Teoni. Now I wonder if Teoni might come here to play w her, given her still extremely limited role at NC.

With only one yr of elig left, and with her remaining limitations, IMO TK's transfer options would be very limited. Plus she's a very, very loyal KJHer. If TK goes anywhere, I'd bet it would be to Seattle to start her post college life.

 

[Majors]

Not going to happen. I remember when you and Darth were convinced she was going to transfer to NC to be w Teoni. Now I wonder if Teoni might come here to play w her, given her still extremely limited role at NC.

With only one yr of elig left, and with her remaining limitations, IMO TK's transfer options would be very limited. Plus she's a very, very loyal KJHer. If TK goes anywhere, I'd bet it would be to Seattle to start her post college life.

I feel pretty confident in saying that wasn’t me saying she was going anywhere.

 

[Volfan2012]

If someone is already suspicous of NIL, what's about to happen is not likely to make that better. I think best case it will take some time and some damn PROFESSIONAL fund development to establish a new donor base for whom NIL is inevitable therefore acceptable. Sadly, we ain't got time.

Well we got some money evidently Spear and Jackson were not free. I suspect probably Jill wasn't either.
Coach Kellie needs to get a lot better at building a roster if the portal is the way were going to be doing most of our recruiting. Jackson and Spear were severely limited by the inability to get an elite post player. Maybe they assumed that would be Key or that Jill could do that job. Both were huge assumptions. As I remember there were three or four really excellent post players in the portal and two or three just a step below them. Any of them on this team would've made a huge difference. I would say at least three to four wins maybe more. A healthy Key would've been huge for the early season battles and the injury to the best player you got for eight games really set that NCAA bid back a few games as well.

 

[glv98]

Are we officially on unlimited transfers? Wasn't there an injunction against transfer limitations and a ruling that players could go ahead immediately and not be punished retroactively is that ruling doesn't stand?

Even if there is still a one-transfer-without-sitting-out rule, it's only a court ruling away from being killed. Not being able to transfer at will definitely impedes earning capability in the current environment.

Some are saying even 4 yr eligibility would be the next domino to fall. Why limit my opportunities to a time frame?

 

[DarkPhoenix]

Not Wells, I retract Powell

Are fans going to be ok saying bye to Key? It’s just business.

I wouldn’t mind Key leaving, but I’ll wish her the best in her future endeavors.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

If someone is already suspicous of NIL, what's about to happen is not likely to make that better. I think best case it will take some time and some damn PROFESSIONAL fund development to establish a new donor base for whom NIL is inevitable therefore acceptable. Sadly, we ain't got time.

I don’t really know how this all works, so I have a question. Juju Watkins Nil deals include Wells Fargo, Mercedes, Taco Bell and Celsius, so if she came here instead, she would get any of those deals because Tn doesn’t have the money?

 

[Majors]

I wouldn’t mind Key leaving, but I’ll wish her the best in her future endeavors.

It’s an uncomfortable situation to think. Most should wish her well. I personally don’t think it’ll come to that but can’t rule it out if funds need to be allocated to win.

 

[Volfan2012]

Are we officially on unlimited transfers? Wasn't there an injunction against transfer limitations and a ruling that players could go ahead immediately and not be punished retroactively is that ruling doesn't stand?

Even if there is still a one-transfer-without-sitting-out rule, it's only a court ruling away from being killed. Not being able to transfer at will definitely impedes earning capability in the current environment.

Some are saying even 4 yr eligibility would be the next domino to fall. Why limit my opportunities to a time frame?

Thought they changed it to two free transfers really can't keep up with the changes. Could be as many as you want to transfer. Regardless the safety you had with portal players is no longer a safety when it comes to transferring.

 

[Majors]

Are we officially on unlimited transfers? Wasn't there an injunction against transfer limitations and a ruling that players could go ahead immediately and not be punished retroactively is that ruling doesn't stand?

Even if there is still a one-transfer-without-sitting-out rule, it's only a court ruling away from being killed. Not being able to transfer at will definitely impedes earning capability in the current environment.

Some are saying even 4 yr eligibility would be the next domino to fall. Why limit my opportunities to a time frame?

Crazy times, believe the last ruling was unlimited