A list of all recruits the Vols lead for (for the Dooley haters)

#51
#51
Or better yet... turn the negatives into a positive (i.e. we have no depth so you will see plenty of playing time).

I'd say the biggest hurdles (negatives) for UT to sell through right now are convincing kids to leave their home states and the unknowns with the staff especially Dooley.

The best positives are PT, facilities, then success of the asst. coaches.

Chuck Smith who tutored All Pro type players should be a great selling point. Hiestand should be a great selling point for his work in both college and pros.
 
#52
#52
Disagree. UT won a NC, CPF didn't "sell" it, led a decade of decline, and was let go.

It creates buzz of course... but you can sell against it. If a team has the depth to win an NC... then they are too deep for early PT. If they win it with relatively young players as Bama did then they're even more vulnerable in that regard.

Success is a pretty good thing to be selling... but you still have to convince a kid that they'll be a participant in the success and not just an observer.

I would say the buzz created by winning a NC heavily out weights the concern of depth (as evident by the past national champions).
And UT had great classes after the NC, they just didn't produce.
 
#53
#53
Who hates Dooley? That would definitely be a bit premature & he doesn't seem like a very hatable guy anyway.
 
#54
#54
Who hates Dooley? That would definitely be a bit premature & he doesn't seem like a very hatable guy anyway.

You obviously haven't been around in awhile. I have quite a list of dooley haters. Number one being hatvol. Just look around and you will see a bunch of negativity toward Coach Dooley and our program.
 
#55
#55
You obviously haven't been around in awhile. I have quite a list of dooley haters. Number one being hatvol. Just look around and you will see a bunch of negativity toward Coach Dooley and our program.

Nope, I guess I've been out of the loop for a bit. But that is ridiculous.
 
#56
#56
I would say the buzz created by winning a NC heavily out weights the concern of depth (as evident by the past national champions).
I don't think so. Bama was #1 in 2008 after going 7-6 and losing to ULM. They were also #1 in 2009 after going 12-2 and being embarrassed by Utah in a BCS game. They "dropped" to #5 this year after winning the NC.

UF's last NC was followed by a #11 class... the worst of UM's tenure at UF.

Kid's want to win and they want to play. Some will be sold one way, others will be sold another. Saban won early battles by promising PT. He has now shifted to selling success.

A good salesman can sell his product or yours with near equal effectiveness. You just have to convince the buyer that they want what you have.
And UT had great classes after the NC, they just didn't produce.

You might want to look that up. UT had "good" classes and avg'd around #10 in the early '00's. That isn't really building on the success. Moreover, those classes didn't perform largely because of character issues. IOW's, they were getting talented players that in state schools didn't want.

Before Fulmer got outcoached, he got outsold.
 
#57
#57
I don't think so. Bama was #1 in 2008 after going 7-6 and losing to ULM. They were also #1 in 2009 after going 12-2 and being embarrassed by Utah in a BCS game. They "dropped" to #5 this year after winning the NC.

UF's last NC was followed by a #11 class... the worst of UM's tenure at UF.

Kid's want to win and they want to play. Some will be sold one way, others will be sold another. Saban won early battles by promising PT. He has now shifted to selling success.

A good salesman can sell his product or yours with near equal effectiveness. You just have to convince the buyer that they want what you have.

If you looked at my evidence (and plus this is the general belief) you would see that i was saying that a NC affects your recruiting the following year. So Bamas NC will take effect on 2011 players. This isnt something i just made up. Plus your example is an exception. Of course recruiting doesn't follow this outline perfectly (things rarely do in any situation).

You might want to look that up. UT had "good" classes and avg'd around #10 in the early '00's. That isn't really building on the success. Moreover, those classes didn't perform largely because of character issues. IOW's, they were getting talented players that in state schools didn't want.

Before Fulmer got outcoached, he got outsold.

2000= #2 class
2001= #3 class
2002= #2 class

Yeah those classes suck a$$.
 
#58
#58
Guy... stop arguing with that wall.

I never said that winning a NC wasn't a recruiting advantage. I said only that a) you still have to sell it effectively and b) it isn't the only thing you can sell. If those two things weren't true then the same team would get all the best talent and win the NC every year.

And you didn't post any "evidence". You posted an opinion. One of us knows the difference.

This whole string of comments was started by this:
Winning a NC generates buzz without the coach having to lift a finger. Can you really say it doesn't? And if you say it then isn't that a separate factor then the coach or someone selling the program.

That statement is simply false. It is true it creates buzz. It is NOT true that a coach need not sell it.
 
#60
#60
Guy... stop arguing with that wall.

I never said that winning a NC wasn't a recruiting advantage. I said only that a) you still have to sell it effectively and b) it isn't the only thing you can sell.If those two things weren't true then the same team would get all the best talent and win the NC every year.

And you didn't post any "evidence". You posted an opinion. One of us knows the difference.
I never said the coach doesn't have to sell it. I simply said that it does a lot by itself that the coach doesn't have to do. Why is that so hard to believe.

Of course there are other things to sell beside a NC. But if you look at recruits early in the cycle, (even before they hear from anyone) they all want to hear from the champ. Getting these recruits attention before contacting them would classify as non finger lifting.

And you didn't post any "evidence". You posted an opinion. One of us knows the difference.

Yeah ok, because USC FLA and LSU winning the recruiting title the year after there ship is clearly an opinion.
 
#61
#61
Thanks Vader for the recruiting update. Great job. For those of us out-of-towners (Washington, DC), getting these updates is our connection to the program and the news.

It's really sad to see so much negativity on this site. I wish the non-Vol fans would find some other site to express their stupidity. As my Dad would say, "If you don't have something good to say, just keep your mouth shut." All of the insulting crap said about Bryce Brown and Aaron Douglas is really sick and disgusting. Their just kids. They have to find their own way and being a Vol may not be the right thing. I want them to be Vols, but it is just not meant to be.

Sorry. This is my day to strike back.:clapping::rock:
 
#62
#62
This is just terrible. Dooley is pathetic... he isn't even a real coach. Just another famous coaches son.

The sky is falling.
 
#63
#63
Here's some info on Crowder. His mom said she wants him to go here. He's the last kid at home and she wants to keep him close to home. UT is the best fit for him. Not only that, I understand they have a lot of Orange clothes at home. Let's get 'er done! He is a "true" center and a smart one, that's what we need.
 
#64
#64
I never said the coach doesn't have to sell it. I simply said that it does a lot by itself that the coach doesn't have to do. Why is that so hard to believe.
It isn't. Why do you keep arguing with me when I agree with you?

Of course there are other things to sell beside a NC. But if you look at recruits early in the cycle, (even before they hear from anyone) they all want to hear from the champ. Getting these recruits attention before contacting them would classify as non finger lifting.
True. All these kids aren't motivated by the same things though. Other kids will look for great programs that offer early PT.



Yeah ok, because USC FLA and LSU winning the recruiting title the year after there ship is clearly an opinion.

No. You didn't state your proof. You simply stated your opinion as a matter of fact. I didn't say you couldn't prove it... only that you didn't.
 
#66
#66
Here's some info on Crowder. His mom said she wants him to go here. He's the last kid at home and she wants to keep him close to home. UT is the best fit for him. Not only that, I understand they have a lot of Orange clothes at home. Let's get 'er done! He is a "true" center and a smart one, that's what we need.

The mother doesn't run that household, Papa Mike definitely does. While she may say that, the sentiments are not echoed by either father or son.
 
#67
#67
It isn't. Why do you keep arguing with me when I agree with you?

True. All these kids aren't motivated by the same things though. Other kids will look for great programs that offer early PT.

No. You didn't state your proof. You simply stated your opinion as a matter of fact. I didn't say you couldn't prove it... only that you didn't.

Well it appears we pretty much agree with each other so yeah.
 
#69
#69
I would think Mack would be more interested when he gets an official offer. Which he could earn at camps this summer.
 
#70
#70
Look at their offers. That's a great way to judge if a recruit is big time or not. We are going after the same recruits as Maryland and Duke for the most part. Tennessee is not an ACC school. We can't compete in the SEC with ACC level recruits.

There's a good reason for some of these players having Duke, Maryland, ("ACC") etc. on their lists. Those schools make a lot of offers to better-rated players early because they don't expect to get them but may end up with one or two unsigned and use "we wanted you early" as leverage against the top teams jumping on them late. Because UT, Ga, bama, etc. will make offers and then rescind offers when they get full. Lower and medium tier (for football) schools hope to get one or two ****'s that way every year...and they usually do.
 
#75
#75
For those of you who simply have to debate Kiffin vs. Dooley, I suggest this: 7-6 is a terrible season no matter how you slice it. We had a team that should have won more than 7 games last year and this year was/is going to be even more of a challenge regardless who the coaching staff is. I stand firm stating that I am happy with the direction for the football team. I liked Coach Dooley from the time he stepped in front of the mic on his intro press conference. I honestly think we will be pleasantly surprised when we are 5-2 going into the final games of the season.
If not, I still know we will win. We will win in UT fashion.
I hope you're right about 5-2. If we're 5-2 after seven games, Dooley will have done a great job to that point.

I do think he's going to be successful at UT, but it might take some time. If we were to go 7-6 again this season, I would hardly regard it as a terrible season. A terrible season would be one where we had the talent to contend for the SEC title and finished 7-6.
 

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