A Reluctant Criticism of Barnes

#226
#226
bleedingTNorange said:
right? Makes you wonder why every coach don’t just make a F4 lol...no, it goes to show how dumb your post was...a fluke run doesn’t mean you’re a great coach, or even good coach, you’ve claimed that enough about Martin. So which is it? Win 4 in a row and you’re set for life or make it consistently over and over with occasional runs?
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Exactly. The problem is you just completely ignore his entire postseason history. He’s lost 10 times to a lower seed and beaten a higher seed once in the NCAAT. Is that good? He’s won one conference tourney title in 30+ Years. Is that good?
 
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#227
#227
bleedingTNorange said:
So hire Frank Martin?
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Ok Frank Martin has been to as many final fours and one less elite eight than Barnes in less than half as many years coaching.

I think I’ve figured it out- you have Rick Barnes confused with Coach K. No wonder you defend Barnes so fiercely. It all makes sense now. Frank Martin is nowhere near as good a coach as Coach K. He’s a better coach than Rick Barnes.
 
#228
#228
I’m also not going to critic Barnes a whole lot for underperforming this year of all years. We were a young team outside of pons and fulky. It’s not like we’re the only young and talented team that underperformed this year.

Duke, Kentucky, UNC were all ranked ahead of us preseason and had worse seasons. Same for Michigan state who was 1 spot behind us. Those coaches are arguably the best of the best, yet they weren’t good.

I don’t think it’s a surprise that a lot of the better teams this year are older and more experienced. Gonzaga, Michigan, Alabama, etc.
 
#230
#230
VolArmy74 said:
The revisionist history about what Pearl inherited here is hilarious. He vastly improved everyone and everything on that team. It's the best coaching job in UT basketball history. Everyone on the roster except CJ and Lofton was considered a bust at that point. Especially Bradshaw and Wingate. That team went 6-12 in the SEC and lost its leading scorer and leading post/rebounder in McFagdon and Crump. We had Dane Bradshaw making the shift from incompetent back up PG to 6'3 power forward and it worked. JuJuan Smith was a freshman walk-on who averaged 1.9 ppg coming into Pearl's 1st season. Pearl developed players very few major programs wanted. He didn't luck into a gold mine. Good grief.
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Again, you have to take into account that Buzz Peterson was terrible. There no way in hell he should have gone 14-17 with that roster. None. Calling what he inherited a dumpster fire isn't honest either. You can't just wave away Watson and Lofton.
 
#232
#232
zjcvols said:
Maybe. He still didn’t win the SEC that year as the favorite. He got blown out by Auburn in the SECT. He still should have beat Purdue.

What if Iowa gotten a call or two and beat us the previous game when we blew a 20 point lead and they forced OT, would your opinion change?
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Not really...but I’m also not the one make arbitrary goals to hit that mean something significant...I don’t think an idiot for a HC can consistently make the NCAAT but never win 2-3 games while a genius HC can make the NCAAT 33% of the time but makes a run 1/3 times he does make the dance.
 
#233
#233
zjcvols said:
Exactly. The problem is you just completely ignore his entire postseason history. He’s lost 10 times to a lower seed and beaten a higher seed once in the NCAAT. Is that good? He’s won one conference tourney title in 30+ Years. Is that good?
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Which is the better coach?

Coach A-NCAAT 5 straight years: R1 loss 2x, R2 loss 2x, S16 loss 1x....record being 4-5.

Coach B-NCAAT 2/5 years, R2 loss 1x, E8 loss 1x...record being 4-2?
 
#234
#234
bleedingTNorange said:
Not really...but I’m also not the one make arbitrary goals to hit that mean something significant...I don’t think an idiot for a HC can consistently make the NCAAT but never win 2-3 games while a genius HC can make the NCAAT 33% of the time but makes a run 1/3 times he does make the dance.
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At least I’m making goals you don’t have any for Rick. You just blindly follow him even he has underachieved for three straight years.

I never said he was an idiot. I said he’s a bad postseason coach. Which he is. You just don’t want to admit it.
 
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#235
#235
bleedingTNorange said:
Which is the better coach?

Coach A-NCAAT 5 straight years: R1 loss 2x, R2 loss 2x, S16 loss 1x....record being 4-5.

Coach B-NCAAT 2/5 years, R2 loss 1x, E8 loss 1x...record being 4-2?
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Is winning 1 conference title in 30+ years good? Is underperforming your seed 10 times and over performing your seed 1 time good?
 
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#236
#236
WiscVols said:
This team had no inside game whatsoever, needed a true point guard and we could not knock down 3 pointers consistently to save our lives. Once Florida exposed UT and how to defend us in the first meeting every team we played used a similar approach. Also we did not have a true leader like Grant or Admiral to lead this team and I think the true freshman are good , but showed their youth and inexperience at critical times. Barnes needs to get aggressive in the transfer portal and fill some glaring weaknesses in the roster
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Actually someone with a smart post . PG is the most vital position in game then you have no post scoring. Playing with wing inexperienced players. You get what we got. In CHRIST Alone
 
#237
#237
zjcvols said:
At least I’m making goals you don’t have any for Rick. You just blindly follow him even he has underachieved for three straight years.

I never said he was an idiot. I said he’s a bad postseason coach. Which he is. You just don’t want to admit it.
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I’ve stated numerous times I expect we make the dance every year, iirc that’s actually loftier than your own...I think you said 4/5 iirc.
 
#240
#240
If English takes the George Mason job, that will give Barnes a chance to hire an offensive specialist who can inject some new ideas into the system.

I think Schwartz is the defensive specialist along with Barnes.
 
#241
#241
bleedingTNorange said:
I’ve stated numerous times I expect we make the dance every year, iirc that’s actually loftier than your own...I think you said 4/5 iirc.
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No I said that’s my minimum expectations but that was before we started paying big time money for a basketball coach. Plus he’s underachieved in the regular season the last two years.
 
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#242
#242
bleedingTNorange said:
Which is the better coach?

Coach A-NCAAT 5 straight years: R1 loss 2x, R2 loss 2x, S16 loss 1x....record being 4-5.

Coach B-NCAAT 2/5 years, R2 loss 1x, E8 loss 1x...record being 4-2?
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Those are both pretty good coaches- I wish the Vols could hire someone like either. To think we had a coach even better than coach A and we ran him off because he didn’t have enough bible verses memorized or something.
 
#243
#243
bleedingTNorange said:
Bump for @zjcvols
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What are the schools? How much is their salary? What is their basketball history? What are their fanbase’s expectations? What are the previous five years? Has Coach A suffered injuries in the tournament? Did Coach B have a star one and done that led them to a tourney one year and they barely got in? How bad were the rosters when they took over? Did they overachieve in the regular season? How’d they do in the conference tourneys?
 
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#244
#244
zjcvols said:
No I said that’s my minimum expectations but that was before we started paying big time money for a basketball coach. Plus he’s underachieved in the regular season the last two years.
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He didn't overachieve in 2019-2020 when Tennessee lost Grant Williams,Admiral Schofield and Jordan Bone and were rebuilding.
 
#245
#245
Border Vol said:
He didn't overachieve in 2019-2020 when Tennessee lost Grant Williams,Admiral Schofield and Jordan Bone and were rebuilding.
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Top 10 preseason team

No regular season SEC title
No postseason SEC title
Lost to a lower seed

To me that’s underachieving.
 
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#246
#246
bleedingTNorange said:
Not even close to the same...

Your buddy buys a new truck for $50k, months later you want one but supply is low and demand is high, you pay $65k for the same truck.,.you expecting more from your truck than his?
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Sorry, not stupid enough to pay 30% more for the same truck.

Let me do you a favor and tell you how next year ends, same way it always ends for a Barnes team.
 
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#247
#247
bleedingTNorange said:
17/40 years, 14/30 years, 10/20 years...Barnes is 3/5 on NCAAT appearances and I damn sure expect an appearance next year too.

As I’ve said previously, if this is a “down” year then I’m good with that.
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Or, 22/45, depending how you want to look at it. Hell, take out the really bad coaches in Houston and Peterson, and it's even better. Barnes is 3 out of 6, he wasn't making it last year.

Last year was a down year. This was a disappointing year.
 
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#248
#248
Making the tournament is a crap goal.

The goal should be to reach potential every year. If the potential is making the tournament, then fine. If the team is a potential Final Four team and it craps the bed in the tournament, then it is a disappointing season.

These arbitrary goals are stupid. The program six years ago is different than the one today. It should reflect this. Saying "Well, historically, we have been such and such" is a foolish guideline. I'm not going to base success today on a failure of a program decades ago. That sort of mentality simply doesn't register for me.
 
#249
#249
therealitytheory said:
Whoa. Nationally men's baseball #10, tennis is #3, track finished indoor season in top ten. Women's softball, roundball, soccer ranked.

I'll give you the football disaster, but otherwise our all-sports prospects are better than they've been in a while.
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That’s why I never respond to those ridiculous comments. They are blatantly false!
 
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