American Chopper....Senior Vs. Junior

[Through_The_T]

I guess it's all in taste. I don't get into Choppers but PJD's bike was the best. The gas tank sucked though. Too big and bulky for that bike.

Jesse came off as a douche through the whole thing. He's probably the most skilled of the 3, he just lacks imagination.

This. I've always been a fan of Jesse's work, going back to the West Coast Chopper days, but his bike for this competition was just a weak effort (except for it being stainless steel, I'm by no means a metals expert, but it's notorious for being hard to work with and shape). He is however, the true "bike builder" of the three and I do admire that he builds all of the frames and does all of the metal work himself.

That being said, Junior's bike killed the others as far as design and creativity. It only holding one gallon of gas is pretty lame IMO, but I don't guess these things had to be road-worthy to qualify because OCC's machine would get you flattened...

OCC simply continues to prove that Junior was the reason that the company elevated to such heights. They lack creativity and the quality of their work on this "snowmobile" is crap and the quality of their bikes is crap.

 

[got orange]

This. I've always been a fan of Jesse's work, going back to the West Coast Chopper days, but his bike for this competition was just a weak effort (except for it being stainless steel, I'm by no means a metals expert, but it's notorious for being hard to work with and shape). He is however, the true "bike builder" of the three and I do admire that he builds all of the frames and does all of the metal work himself.

How so? Because he spends 75% of his time melting steel and banging it on a curved cast for the frame? There's nothing James can do that Junior couldn't. Other than leaving his family for 2 years to "apprentice" blacksmithing. Please.

Only thing Jesse built on this Wal-mart brand bike was the frame. I've seen Juniour build numerous frames. Not by blacksmithing methods but by machinary. James couldn't even live up to his smack talk and do this himself. Had to call in the local help.

Jesse throws together the "same'o, same'o" bikes that anyone on this forum could go to Byington Solway and learn to throw together.

Takes creativity.

Let them have a build off for endurance / racing standards and I would still put my money on Junior.

/endrant

 

[Through_The_T]

How so? Because he spends 75% of his time melting steel and banging it on a curved cast for the frame? There's nothing James can do that Junior couldn't. Other than leaving his family for 2 years to "apprentice" blacksmithing. Please.

Only thing Jesse built on this Wal-mart brand bike was the frame. I've seen Juniour build numerous frames. Not by blacksmithing methods but by machinary. James couldn't even live up to his smack talk and do this himself. Had to call in the local help.

Jesse throws together the "same'o, same'o" bikes that anyone on this forum could go to Byington Solway and learn to throw together.

Takes creativity.

Let them have a build off for endurance / racing standards and I would still put my money on Junior.

/endrant

Seeing as on a majority of the builds, Junior gets fabrication help from Brandon and orders most of his frames from a frame company...

Jesse James is a great motorcycle builder and is a much better metal worker than Junior or anyone in OCC (save maybe Brandon and Rick), as he proved with his work with stainless steel in building his bike and in his past bikes. Like I said though, his latest bikes are lacking the creativity and the appeal that they had in the West Coast Chopper days and Junior definitely has design talents that are far superior to Jesse or anyone in OCC.

Oh and this isn't a "WalMart" bike...

And the bolded kind of proves my point, doesn't it?

 

[got orange]

Oh and this isn't a "WalMart" bike...

And the bolded kind of proves my point, doesn't it?

I was specifically talking about the "build off" bike was Wal-mart. The bike you posted is alright. Seriously just shrugged my shoulders and said meh....

I could sit here all night and post Jr's bikes, if you'd like...

The only point your "bolded" proved was that James melts metal and beats it on pre-made cast for the exact curves. Wow. Much more mind blowing then figuring out the math to bending it on a roller machine.

But, whatever...

Like it was said before, all in taste.

 

[got orange]

Seeing as on a majority of the builds, Junior gets fabrication help from Brandon and orders most of his frames from a frame company...

How does it make any "business sense" to waste the time to bend and weld a frame together when it can be ordered quicker and at a cheaper price?

Just because he orders them, doesn't mean he can't make them....

 

[got orange]

Jesse James is a great motorcycle builder and is a much better metal worker than Junior or anyone in OCC (save maybe Brandon and Rick)

This is proving my point even more....

"save maybe Brandon and Rick"

So, since Brandon or Rick are "much better" metal workers... I have to assume they are truer "bike builders" over Jesse and/or Junior?

There's more aspects to bike building than melting, bending and banging metal...

I think there is only one guy who gets them all from last night's show.

 

[Through_The_T]

I was specifically talking about the "build off" bike was Wal-mart. The bike you posted is alright. Seriously just shrugged my shoulders and said meh....

I could sit here all night and post Jr's bikes, if you'd like...

The only point your "bolded" proved was that James melts metal and beats it on pre-made cast for the exact curves. Wow. Much more mind blowing then figuring out the math to bending it on a roller machine.

But, whatever...

Like it was said before, all in taste.

I've seen Junior's bikes so it would be a waste of your time. My point is that Jesse has a history of building really nice motorcycles and yes it is more impressive in the bike world to hand-shape and build a bike like Jesse did rather than using a roller machine, water jet or tube bender. Give me a break...

How does it make any "business sense" to waste the time to bend and weld a frame together when it can be ordered quicker and at a cheaper price?

Just because he orders them, doesn't mean he can't make them....

I didn't say Jesse's methods to build this bike made business sense, but it wasn't a build for business so that's irrelevant and if you think Junior could do any of the metalworking that Jesse can do, then you're just plain wrong. I'm not taking anything away from him, but it takes a lot of skill, patience and hard work to master welding and blacksmithing like Jesse has...

This is proving my point even more....

"save maybe Brandon and Rick"

So, since Brandon or Rick are "much better" metal workers... I have to assume they are truer "bike builders" over Jesse and/or Junior?

There's more aspects to bike building than melting, bending and banging metal...

I think there is only one guy who gets them all from last night's show.

I don't even understand your assertion here. I didn't say they were much better metal workers, just that they were the ones even close to James's talents at it and I agree with you that there's more to bike building than melting, bending and banging metal but it is extremely hard to do and I don't think anyone in OCC or PJD could build a bike from the ground up with the machinery James has and it look any good at all...

 

[got orange]

I don't even understand your assertion here. I didn't say they were much better metal workers, just that they were the ones even close to James's talents at it and I agree with you that there's more to bike building than melting, bending and banging metal but it is extremely hard to do and I don't think anyone in OCC or PJD could build a bike from the ground up with the machinery James has and it look any good at all...

You just proved, I am talking to a doofus with this statement.


Bye.

 

[Through_The_T]

You just proved, I am talking to a doofus with this statement.


Bye.

So because I disagree with your points, you resort to name-calling. Interesting...

Oh and you should probably get a clue about any type of metal work or fabrication before you make yourself look foolish in claiming what Jesse James does isn't that impressive and Jr. could do it too...

But I'm done with this conversation as well. I guess it's too hard to reason with those of "superior" intellect...

 

[trevols81]

This bike would have won the competition. JJ is a true "bike builder" but like you stated he lately has lacked the creativity to put him above Jr. Junior's bikes as pure art are great but for practicality not so much.

 

[Thrasher865]

So because I disagree with your points, you resort to name-calling. Interesting...

Oh and you should probably get a clue about any type of metal work or fabrication before you make yourself look foolish in claiming what Jesse James does isn't that impressive and Jr. could do it too...

But I'm done with this conversation as well. I guess it's too hard to reason with those of "superior" intellect...

Somebody's got a hard on for Jesse. You must be one of those "traditionalists" that is afraid to embrace any sort of forward thinking or technology. Jesse's bike was boring.

I'm pretty sure that the Teutels (sp?) were building bikes with **** technology for years. Just because they sold out and went to corporate show bikes doesn't negate the fact that their bikes are ridiculously good looking in most cases. There are thousands of bike builders across the nation that build bikes just like Jesse's that don't get famous.

 

[got orange]

So because I disagree with your points, you resort to name-calling. Interesting...

Oh and you should probably get a clue about any type of metal work or fabrication before you make yourself look foolish in claiming what Jesse James does isn't that impressive and Jr. could do it too...

But I'm done with this conversation as well. I guess it's too hard to reason with those of "superior" intellect...

Never said what James' does isn't impressive, but to call him a "better builder" over Jr. because he melts and bangs metal is "foolish"...

I called you a doofus because every response you had 30 minutes ago to my statements only proved what I was saying is true and adjusting you're previous statements....

 

[Through_The_T]

Somebody's got a hard on for Jesse. You must be one of those "traditionalists" that is afraid to embrace any sort of forward thinking or technology. Jesse's bike was boring.

I'm pretty sure that the Teutels (sp?) were building bikes with **** technology for years. Just because they sold out and went to corporate show bikes doesn't negate the fact that their bikes are ridiculously good looking in most cases. There are thousands of bike builders across the nation that build bikes just like Jesse's that don't get famous.

I don't have a hard on for Jesse, I actually think he's an arrogant punk and I've said numerous times in the thread that PJD's bike was better and Jr. is a better visionary. However, mouthbreathers that claim that Jr. can work metal like he can are absolutely wrong and it's foolish to say so. Also, I didn't know there were thousands of bike builders across the country that could blacksmith and shape their own frames. Interesting numbers there...

 

[got orange]

I don't have a hard on for Jesse, I actually think he's an arrogant punk and I've said numerous times in the thread that PJD's bike was better and Jr. is a better visionary. However, mouthbreathers that claim that Jr. can work metal like he can are absolutely wrong and it's foolish to say so. Also, I didn't know there were thousands of bike builders across the country that could blacksmith and shape their own frames. Interesting numbers there...

Here we go again....

You just said earlier, you agree'd with me, that it takes more than bending and banging metal but your hard-on for Jesse prevents you to lay down...

 

[got orange]

Rick and Brandon can bang metal...

 

[Through_The_T]

Here we go again....

You just said earlier you agree'd with me that it takes more than bending and banging metal, but your hard-on for Jesse prevents you to lay down...

Haha, you saying I have a hard-on for one of the biggest douches in the public eye is hilarious. I know I agreed with you and I already acknowledged that Jr. built the better bike and that James has lost his design touch, but in the "bike-building" sense, meaning fabrication, metal work and welding, James is better. I haven't contradicted myself at all...

 

[got orange]

Haha, you saying I have a hard-on for one of the biggest douches in the public eye is hilarious. I know I agreed with you and I already acknowledged that Jr. built the better bike and that James has lost his design touch, but in the "bike-building" sense, meaning fabrication, metal work and welding, James is better. I haven't contradicted myself at all...

Yes, you have.

Show me your best sweet Mr. James' bike and I'll kill it with Jr's worst bike.

 

[Through_The_T]

Yes, you have.

Show me your best sweet Mr. James' bike and I'll kill it with Jr's worst bike.

No I haven't. Trevols understood what I'm saying, yet you aren't. Maybe that speaks to your own aptitude...

And to your second point, you are really dense, because I've said over and over and over that Jr's bikes are better than James's bikes and have been for years. I've liked just about everything PJD has put out there....

 

[got orange]

Peace.

I just want to ride any of the bikes that those 2 make.

 

[DrunkJohnny]

And to your second point, you are really dense, because I've said over and over and over that Jr's bikes are better than James's bikes and have been for years. I've liked just about everything PJD has put out there....

So what you meant to say is Jesse James is a better blacksmith, not a better bike-builder?

In regards to the show, it was pretty lame. I think it was just the host that killed it. Anyways, glad Junior won, even though everyone already knew he would. Jesse came off as the giant douchebag that he is. It's funny that he is constantly talking **** about the Teutels(sp?) but doesn't mind using them to get his washed-up ass back on tv. lol

Also, his bike would suck to ride for more than 20 minutes. You can't see over the handle bars. :blink:

 

[got orange]

So what you meant to say is Jesse James is a better blacksmith, not a better bike-builder?

In regards to the show, it was pretty lame. I think it was just the host that killed it. Anyways, glad Junior won, even though everyone already knew he would. Jesse came off as the giant douchebag that he is. It's funny that he is constantly talking **** about the Teutels(sp?) but doesn't mind using them to get his washed-up ass back on tv. lol

Also, his bike would suck to ride for more than 20 minutes. You can't see over the handle bars. :blink:

Like Vinnie said, "Could see those bikes at Bike-Week".

 

[Through_The_T]

So what you meant to say is Jesse James is a better blacksmith, not a better bike-builder?

In regards to the show, it was pretty lame. I think it was just the host that killed it. Anyways, glad Junior won, even though everyone already knew he would. Jesse came off as the giant douchebag that he is. It's funny that he is constantly talking **** about the Teutels(sp?) but doesn't mind using them to get his washed-up ass back on tv. lol

Also, his bike would suck to ride for more than 20 minutes. You can't see over the handle bars. :blink:

No, I mean that Jesse James is a better ground-up bike builder than Jr. or OCC (which includes welding and blacksmithing, Jr. has edged him in fabrication) but that he lacks the creative touch and vision to compete with Jr., or OCC in some circumstances, in design challenges...

 

[Through_The_T]

Like Vinnie said, "Could see those bikes at Bike-Week".

Especially the one he built for the show. I don't understand why he did something like that, he knew he'd have to bring his A game to even compete with Jr. and the bike he presented was pretty weak...

 

[DrunkJohnny]

No, I mean that Jesse James is a better ground-up bike builder than Jr. or OCC (which includes welding and blacksmithing, Jr. has edged him in fabrication) but that he lacks the creative touch and vision to compete with Jr., or OCC in some circumstances, in design challenges...

So Juniors bikes are better but Jesse James is a better bike builder? Seems like you're just arguing semantics for the sake of arguing.

Is Jesse James the best bike builder in the history of the planet, because he knows how to blacksmith?

 

[Through_The_T]

So Juniors bikes are better but Jesse James is a better bike builder? Seems like you're just arguing semantics for the sake of arguing.

Is Jesse James the best bike builder in the history of the planet, because he knows how to blacksmith?

I'm not the one who even began an argument. I stated that I believed that James is the better builder in the traditional sense of the word but that Junior is a superior designer and builder in the sense of his bikes' creativity and design and that's what wins build-offs...