America's Future

doesnt mean we are down for the count.
No. It means we cannot afford Keynesian economic policies and Progressive socio-economic ideals. The free market has to be unfettered... which means the social engineering efforts of the left must be defeated and buried. Because rhetoric and demagogury concerning the "rich" is so effective with the public today... I am not all that optimistic.
We build things that the world needs.
We export few things that cannot be replaced rather easily.
People pay up for quality (to a point) and if we can keep costs down and the quaility up, then we can compete with Chinas low cost and low quailty goods. As China becomes more and more expensive then an equilibrium can be reached

Give an example... and I will give you one.

The Germans across industries make the best heavy equipment in the world. They are only rivaled in a serious way by the Japanese. If you read a book, it is all but a certainty that it was imaged, printed, and bound with German or Japanese equipment. In 2004, I visited the last German foundry that produced castings for print equipment... EVERY other German print equipment company had outsourced their castings to China.

In mature industries, it is going to be very difficult with our labor costs and gov't to compete with developing countries. It will take significant change for which there is no current political will to compete with the Chinese.

BTW, I milestone was passed within the last 3 years. It was announced that China had modernized its farming enough to feed its own people. From a strategic economic standpoint, that is not good for us.
 

Correct. There are little to no toilets outside of major urban centers in India. There are plenty within urban centers; they are usually in middle-income and higher residences and shopping malls.


Every major factory in India has water. India produces a huge amount of concrete, which requires large and consistent amounts of water.


In rural areas, there were power blackouts at least twice a day. Of course, many also have their own backup battery generators, so it is not even more than an inconvenience. In the large urban areas, there are occasional blackouts in residential areas; in the commercial and industrial sectors, these blackouts are extremely rare.

Heck, Iraqi residents only have about six hours of electricity per day; yet, much of the industry runs power for twenty-four hours.

India is currently working on building huge "on-demand" water systems, in which even the residents of most rural areas will have access to clean water from taps.
 

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Never underestimate the power of one billion people that have a universal green light on economic development.

In this case, therealUT isn't talking out of his ear. It is widely accepted that India then Africa will replace China as up and coming economies.

I see what you are saying, but the US isnt interested in manufacturing coat hangers and plastic toys

You cant build a major manufacturing plant when the water and electricity only works for a couple of hours a day. It will take them decades


Look at this mess

indian-electricity-theft.jpg
 
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Caterpillar, John Deer, Boeing, General Electric. Nobody is buying stuff from them?

Are you trying to derive rules from exceptions? IIRC, all of those companies are "American" but have international production and assembly.

I know for a fact that Caterpillar buys alot of its parts from non-US sources.

All of these companies are also recipients of corporate welfare... especially Boeing.
 
I see what you are saying, but the US isnt interested in manufacturing coat hangers and plastic toys

You cant build a major manufacturing plant when the water and electricity only works for a couple of hours a day. It will take them decades

From the actions of the last 20 years or so, it would seem our "leaders" aren't interested in refining petroleum, making plastic, making steel, making any useful metal, making auto parts, making electronic parts, making textiles, making furniture, and on and on and on. We sold our ability to compete under the mantra of "free trade". Free trade as conceived by our politicians meant that we had to compete with countries that did not have our labor and environmental constraints.

It should have been "fair trade" not free trade. Pay your people slave wages- incur a tariff. Have loose environmental enforcement and standards- pay a tariff. Instead we gave whole industries away that will be difficult if not impossible to regain.
 
I see what you are saying, but the US isnt interested in manufacturing coat hangers and plastic toys

You cant build a major manufacturing plant when the water and electricity only works for a couple of hours a day. It will take them decades

Tell that to Jindal Steel and Aditya Birla.
 
They are all Fortune 100 companies, and most products are assembled here in USA.

Shall I list other companies like United Technologies, IBM, Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Ford, etc
 
They are all Fortune 100 companies, and most products are assembled here in USA.

They mine, refine, and manufacture most of their products outside of the US, the vast majority inside India. Both these conglomerates were started within India and grew to into the industrial powerhouses that they are today. Your argument does not hold water, feel free to post another worthless picture of electrical wiring that does not fit your idea of neat and organized. After that, though, give this argument up; it is ridiculous.
 
Boeing is building planes in India? News to me. Caterpillar doesnt manufacture one thing here in the US? John Deer factory in Waterloo, Iowa is closed?
 
Boeing is building planes in India? News to me. Caterpillar doesnt manufacture one thing here in the US? John Deer factory in Waterloo, Iowa is closed?

I figured you were responding to the Jindal Steel and Aditya Birla post (since it was right below and you did not quote anything).
 
From the actions of the last 20 years or so, it would seem our "leaders" aren't interested in refining petroleum, making plastic, making steel, making any useful metal, making auto parts, making electronic parts, making textiles, making furniture, and on and on and on. We sold our ability to compete under the mantra of "free trade". Free trade as conceived by our politicians meant that we had to compete with countries that did not have our labor and environmental constraints.

It should have been "fair trade" not free trade. Pay your people slave wages- incur a tariff. Have loose environmental enforcement and standards- pay a tariff. Instead we gave whole industries away that will be difficult if not impossible to regain.

I've always thought this, but not many people seem to agree. I never got the full argument but I believe it has to do with raising prices to support low wage jobs doesn't help the economy adapt.
 
that they have to build themselves requiring billions in investments. Or they can build a factory here in the south and have ample access to water and electricity

I would choose higher up front costs and lower operating costs if I were planning to build a manufacturing plant.

Aside from that though, I still think you are wrong and egregiously misinformed.
 
I would choose higher up front costs and lower operating costs if I were planning to build a manufacturing plant.

Aside from that though, I still think you are wrong and egregiously misinformed.

So explain to me why Hyundai, BMW, KIA, Mercades, Volkswagen, Nissan, Honda all building plants here in the US?
If India is so great, why isn't Boeing building it's 787 in India? Your only industry you have spoken about is an industry that thrives on cheap labor and zero environmental regulations

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So explain to me why Hyundai, BMW, KIA, , Mercades, Volkswagen all building plants here in the US?
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1. The new auto-manufacturing plants are not labor intensive.
2. Shipping automobiles is much more cumbersome and much more costly than shipping other manufactured products (of course, many of these automobiles are equipped with vital parts produced outside of the US).
3. Automobile tariffs and quotas.
 
So a stable, quality workforce and access to cheap electricity, water and transportation have nothing to do with those plants being located here in the US?


Do you realize what the affects would be if electricity output here in the US dropped 25%? It would be an economic mess, but you claim it's no biggie in India and won't hurt business
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So a stable, quality workforce and access to cheap electricity, water and transportation have nothing to do with those plants being located here in the US?

Not much; hence the steel and rubber industries have vanished from America.

Do you realize what the affects would be if electricity output here in the US dropped 25%? It would be an economic mess, but you claim it's no biggie in India and won't hurt business
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It will not hurt business in India; it will disrupt living conditions. Feel free to take a trip, it only costs around $1,000 to fly to Chennai or Hyrderabad and, once you get there, living expenses are low. You could do that or continue to make asinine assumptions based on what you consider the norm from a lifetime spent in the US.
 
Name me two things that India builds that we need here in the US and I will name you 10 things that they need from us
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India

U.S.-India bilateral merchandise trade in 2008 topped nearly $50 billion. Principal U.S. exports are diagnostic or lab reagents, aircraft and parts, advanced machinery, cotton, fertilizers, ferrous waste/scrap metal, and computer hardware. Major U.S. imports from India include textiles and ready-made garments, Internet-enabled services, agricultural and related products, gems and jewelry, leather products, and chemicals.

We sell them the expensive, high quality goods. They send us goods that are labor intesnive and environmentally unfriendly.
 
Name me two things that India builds that we need here in the US and I will name you 10 things that they need from us
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I would be more interested in learning exactly how you can speak for the needs of the average denizen of India.

Judging simply from my own experience and observations, I will state that every American household I have ever entered contains more things that were in some way, shape, or form manufactured and/or assembled in India than there are items in Indian households that were in some way, shape, or form manufactured and/or assembled in America.

Indian businesses use American business products; however, the vast majority of items purchased in India are produced in India.
 
India



We sell them the expensive, high quality goods. They send us goods that are labor intesnive and environmentally unfriendly.

Cotton and scrap metal are high quality? Gems and jewelry are environmentally unfriendly?

The answer to both of those questions is: "VNSF is an idiot".
 

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