Are you better off today than...

[allvol123]

If you make income in USD and spend it in just about any other currency globally, you have effectively lost money. So, in a nut, yes.

I don't and I am better off. And again, I don't put this on the shoulders of Bush. So what change are we looking for?

 

[Lexvol]

Yes, I am better now than I was in 2000, not just financially, but in many ways. There are certain circumstances in our lives which can only be controlled by ourselves and the POTUS has no bearing on it. EVER

Is our nation better??? Not even close, and that is what we should be asking ourselves. America has now, more than ever, become a "ME" society and no matter what any of you say, just because you are better off now doesn't mean things are fine. I will stop there

That is also an unfair value judgement.

At the root conservatives should be much more about what people can do for themselves. Of course the modern conservative movement has definitely lost its way.

At the heart of the matter real conservatism is not about what government or anyone else can do for me. It is about what me can do for me.

In liberalism it is about what ANYBODY...government...the rich....my grandma...can do for me.

Which is really inherently more selfish? One who wishes to earn their way or one who simply expects a handout?

There should be a natural correction for corruption and greed. There always is. Redistributing wealth is not a natural correction.

 

[BigPapaVol]

If you make income in USD and spend it in just about any other currency globally, you have effectively lost money. So, in a nut, yes.

but that money should be easily made up in the services you are selling for the new, more valuable, int'l currency. Something isn't adding up here. It should easily be a wash. More realistically, given that your personal and business expenses are a fraction of gross sales, you should actually be getting wealthier. I'm struggling to understand your complaint.

 

[droski]

I'm much better off.

 

[WA_Vol]

IMO the question should be, is the country better off now then it was 8 years ago. Bush has doubled the national debt since he's been in office. He's been a disaster for the country.

 

[utvolpj]

I am better off but of course I graduated college in 99. My salary has increased every year as have my bonuses. But then again I'm relatively smart and work hard so I guess they would call me an outlier in the US.

Pretty sure this will continue for me until the world decides indoor plumbing was a bad idea.

 

[allvol123]

IMO the question should be, is the country better off now then it was 8 years ago. Bush has doubled the national debt since he's been in office. He's been a disaster for the country.

You are of the opinion Obama will spend less?

 

[TennNC]

..you were the day Bush took office? I am. That said, I do not credit or blame the POTUS for my personal successes or lack thereof. But do realize that the decisions and philisophies made by the man in that office will trickle down and affect me on some level. If that is so, and he is so bad, then why I am doing better than I was 8 years ago? What about you?

Allvol123, how old were you 8 years ago?

Ask someone who just retired and lives off their investments how they feel right now. Or someone who lost their job. Or someone who bought more house than they could afford and lost it. Or someone trying to sell a house that's been on the market for a year. Or someone who said goodbye to their loved one to fight a war most Americans don't support.

I also don't blame Bush for all of this, but I do blame his administration for completely whiffing on an opportunity following 9-11 to re-energize the country, to build upon our patriotism, to build upon worldwide support and respect for our country, to mount a serious campaign for what we stand for: peace, democracy, justice, human rights.

I do care that Europeans (and other parts of the world) hate us, not b/c of how I'll be treated next time I visit one of those countries, but b/c of what we won't be able to do b/c of our sullied reputation. We've seen it happen in Iraq (disregard the fact that we shouldn't have been there in the first place), and that is affecting our ability to protect our interests in other places as well.

I may be better off right now as a human being b/c I went from a single grad student to a happily married, gainfully employed homeowner, but as an American, I don't feel as good as I did 8 years ago.

 

[volinbham]

Ask someone who just retired and lives off their investments how they feel right now. Or someone who lost their job. Or someone who bought more house than they could afford and lost it. Or someone trying to sell a house that's been on the market for a year.

All of these situations exist in every election cycle.

 

[allvol123]

Allvol123, how old were you 8 years ago? 27

Ask someone who just retired and lives off their investments how they feel right now. Or someone who lost their job. Or someone who bought more house than they could afford and lost it. Or someone trying to sell a house that's been on the market for a year. Or someone who said goodbye to their loved one to fight a war most Americans don't support.

I just sold my house in 2 months. The second line is just emotional nonsense. Wars happen.

I also don't blame Bush for all of this, but I do blame his administration for completely whiffing on an opportunity following 9-11 to re-energize the country, to build upon our patriotism, to build upon worldwide support and respect for our country, to mount a serious campaign for what we stand for: peace, democracy, justice, human rights.

Funny, I thought he was setting these up in that dreaded and hated Iraqi war?

I do care that Europeans (and other parts of the world) hate us, not b/c of how I'll be treated next time I visit one of those countries, but b/c of what we won't be able to do b/c of our sullied reputation. We've seen it happen in Iraq (disregard the fact that we shouldn't have been there in the first place), and that is affecting our ability to protect our interests in other places as well.

You think the rest of the world is going to like the Obama protectionist agenda?

I may be better off right now as a human being b/c I went from a single grad student to a happily married, gainfully employed homeowner, but as an American, I don't feel as good as I did 8 years ago.

I feel fantastic to be an American.

 

[utvolpj]

disagree with a couple points

Or someone who bought more house than they could afford and lost it. Or someone trying to sell a house that's been on the market for a year.

Those do not cause me to lose any sleep. I'm sorry but the ones who bought too much house dug their own grave and many of the people trying to sell fall into the same.

I do care that Europeans (and other parts of the world) hate us, not b/c of how I'll be treated next time I visit one of those countries, but b/c of what we won't be able to do b/c of our sullied reputation.

I work with a lot of people from countries all over Europe and they do not hate us as a people. In fact many of them asked for a US assignment. And my boss just finished an 18mo stretch in the UK and found it to be the same. I would put the people who can't separate Americans from their gov't policies in the same boat as those who believe something like Obama is a Muslim. They're ignorant and don't care to change.

 

[UT IE 95]

if any of us forgets the tech bubble burst or 9/11, we should be severely beaten.

Just answering the original question.

 

[TennNC]

At the heart of the matter real conservatism is not about what government or anyone else can do for me. It is about what me can do for me.

In liberalism it is about what ANYBODY...government...the rich....my grandma...can do for me.

This is also an unfair value judgment.

The orientation of conservatism is on the individual as an individual. Don't rely on anyone else.

The orientation of liberalism is on the individual as part of a wider community. What you do for yourself should be weighed against what effect it has on society at large.

Both are perfect in theory. And both are extremely flawed in context of human nature.

The pitfall of conservatism is selfishness and greed - all I have to do is accumulate for myself, and not worry about anyone else.

The pitfall of liberalism is laziness and apathy - I don't need to work b/c someone else will take care of me.

Both extremes are fallacies. Society only works when everyone has an opportunity to pitch in. Some are ALWAYS going to be better off than others. That's human nature. And trying to "even it out" is a silly pursuit, and we've seen it fail.

However, when people aren't given an opportunity to pitch in to the best of their ability, then we all lose in the end.

Equality of opportunity is what it boils down to.

 

[joevol320]

how about this questions. are we better off today, than our parents and grandparents were at our age?

 

[TennNC]

All of these situations exist in every election cycle.

exactly. which is why the original question is not a valid measure of whether or not we need a new type of leadership.

UT football was humming along nicely at the end of 2001. 20/20 hindsight tells us we'd probably be better off now if we'd made a change earlier, as Ms. Fulmer suggested.

 

[615 Vol]

This is also an unfair value judgment.

The orientation of conservatism is on the individual as an individual. Don't rely on anyone else.

The orientation of liberalism is on the individual as part of a wider community. What you do for yourself should be weighed against what effect it has on society at large.

Both are perfect in theory. And both are extremely flawed in context of human nature.

The pitfall of conservatism is selfishness and greed - all I have to do is accumulate for myself, and not worry about anyone else.

The pitfall of liberalism is laziness and apathy - I don't need to work b/c someone else will take care of me.

Both extremes are fallacies. Society only works when everyone has an opportunity to pitch in. Some are ALWAYS going to be better off than others. That's human nature. And trying to "even it out" is a silly pursuit, and we've seen it fail.

However, when people aren't given an opportunity to pitch in to the best of their ability, then we all lose in the end.

Equality of opportunity is what it boils down to.

The best post I've read in a long time. I agree 100 percent.

 

[TennNC]

I work with a lot of people from countries all over Europe and they do not hate us as a people. In fact many of them asked for a US assignment. And my boss just finished an 18mo stretch in the UK and found it to be the same. I would put the people who can't separate Americans from their gov't policies in the same boat as those who believe something like Obama is a Muslim. They're ignorant and don't care to change.

Sad but true - that's how we make judgments on other nations. Do you not think most Americans have an unfavorable impression of Iranians b/c of Ahmadinejaidshamalamadingdong? Their disapproval of the US via Bush has an effect, but the more important consequence is what their leaders think of us.

Us: "Hey guys - want to help us stabilize this region? Want to help us reduce the nuclear threat? Want to help us remove this despot? Want to help us create a democracy?"

Them: "Go to hell." OR "Ha!"

 

[allvol123]

exactly. which is why the original question is not a valid measure of whether or not we need a new type of leadership.
.

I stated as much in the original post but many people lobbying for "change" seem to use such generalizations in their support for Obama. We need Change! What change?

 

[droski]

how about this questions. are we better off today, than our parents and grandparents were at our age?

by any measure possible, yes.

 

[rjd970]

This is also an unfair value judgment.

The orientation of conservatism is on the individual as an individual. Don't rely on anyone else.

The orientation of liberalism is on the individual as part of a wider community. What you do for yourself should be weighed against what effect it has on society at large.

Both are perfect in theory. And both are extremely flawed in context of human nature.

The pitfall of conservatism is selfishness and greed - all I have to do is accumulate for myself, and not worry about anyone else.

The pitfall of liberalism is laziness and apathy - I don't need to work b/c someone else will take care of me.

Both extremes are fallacies. Society only works when everyone has an opportunity to pitch in. Some are ALWAYS going to be better off than others. That's human nature. And trying to "even it out" is a silly pursuit, and we've seen it fail.

However, when people aren't given an opportunity to pitch in to the best of their ability, then we all lose in the end.

Equality of opportunity is what it boils down to.

Great post. :good!:

 

[joevol320]

by any measure possible, yes.

it is absolutely pathetic that we even ask these questions. are we better off today? GET REAL. if you are born in this country you are better off. even the poorest person in this country has it much better than a poor person in some 3rd world country. the question sounds like more liberal whining.

 

[OrangeEmpire]

..you were the day Bush took office? I am. That said, I do not credit or blame the POTUS for my personal successes or lack thereof. But do realize that the decisions and philisophies made by the man in that office will trickle down and affect me on some level. If that is so, and he is so bad, then why I am doing better than I was 8 years ago? What about you?

Absolutely....

 

[BigPapaVol]

it is absolutely pathetic that we even ask these questions. are we better off today? GET REAL. if you are born in this country you are better off. even the poorest person in this country has it much better than a poor person in some 3rd world country. the question sounds like more liberal whining.

do what? dude asked a question about the past 8 years, not about how we're doing relative to those in Nimibia.

How is the question less than pertinent to this current election? You have noticed the cacophony from the media about how we're all worse off because of these past 8 years, right?

 

[superdave1984]

Depends on your perspective. When GWB took office I was making twice the money I am now, but had zero benefits, no college degree and bills out the wazoo. Living check to check or worse. Today I have a solid job with full benefits, few bills and little stress. Still live check to check, but at least now I have something for retirement and security for if I have a serious health issue. Most folks wouldn't go from a higher paying job to a lower paying job. But it was completely worth it for me.

 

[joevol320]

do what? dude asked a question about the past 8 years, not about how we're doing relative to those in Nimibia.

How is the question less than pertinent to this current election? You have noticed the cacophony from the media about how we're all worse off because of these past 8 years, right?

even so, we should never complain. but since you asked, i am better off than i was 8 years