Baltimore Unrest

[Grand Vol]

You can't fight the police department. Are you crazy? They can't take the police head on. They don't want to die.

So they are cowards and bullies in their own right? They don't want to take on a group that will hand their ass to them, but don't have a problem attacking defenseless individuals and looting empty businesses?

Two wrongs don't make a right here. And while I agree in principle that justice needs to be served in this death, rioting and looting is not the way to achieve their goals. You want to protest, fine. You want to make your concerns heard, fine.

You want to destroy people's property that had nothing to do with the incident at all? Not in this lifetime.

 

[n_huffhines]

These people out there looting stores and hurting people don't give 2 ****s about justice.

They just get a free pass to commit crimes and know there's a good chance they won't get caught because so much of it is going on.

Don't kid yourself.

I'm sure some want to loot and some want to protest and some both. I don't assume to know everyone's motives.

 

[n_huffhines]

So they are cowards and bullies in their own right? They don't want to take on a group that will hand their ass to them, but don't have a problem attacking defenseless individuals and looting empty businesses?

Two wrongs don't make a right here. And while I agree in principle that justice needs to be served in this death, rioting and looting is not the way to achieve their goals. You want to protest, fine. You want to make your concerns heard, fine.

You want to destroy people's property that had nothing to do with the incident at all? Not in this lifetime.

Just like the Boston Tea partiers were cowards, right?

 

[mrorange211]

I wonder what the news story will be in a few years if the crime rate has risen but no one wants to be a cop?

Seriously, I use to take one side of this issue, but the more I am exposed to these riots the more I come to recognize the futility of arguing about freedom and justice when it comes to these people. Many of them do not want freedom and justice, only an excuse to vandalize and steal. Some of these videos I am watching about these protests in Baltimore are an outright embarrassment to the African-American community. If only DuBois could see them now....

 

[n_huffhines]

I wonder what the news story will be in a few years if the crime rate has risen but no one wants to be a cop?

Seriously, I use to take one side of this issue, but the more I am exposed to these riots the more I come to recognize the futility of arguing about freedom and justice when it comes to these people. Many of them do not want freedom and justice, only an excuse to vandalize and steal. Some of these videos I am watching about these protests in Baltimore are an outright embarrassment to the African-American community. If only DuBois could see them now....

Operative word. It's not going up and if we can end the war on drugs then it will come way down. Hell, we could cut police budgets by huge amounts and have less crime as well as brutality. The people are fed up.

 

[Bigurnge]

I wonder what the news story will be in a few years if the crime rate has risen but no one wants to be a cop?

Seriously, I use to take one side of this issue, but the more I am exposed to these riots the more I come to recognize the futility of arguing about freedom and justice when it comes to these people. Many of them do not want freedom and justice, only an excuse to vandalize and steal. Some of these videos I am watching about these protests in Baltimore are an outright embarrassment to the African-American community. If only DuBois could see them now....

What you said isn't some recent revelation.

 

[Grand Vol]

Just like the Boston Tea partiers were cowards, right?

Did they take the tea home with them? Break into other businesses and grab whatever they could before the authorities came on scene?

Your analogy is stupid.

 

[mrorange211]

Operative word. It's not going up and if we can end the war on drugs then it will come way down. Hell, we could cut police budgets by huge amounts and have less crime as well as brutality. The people are fed up.

I do agree with you Huff about the war on drugs. It has created a toxic atmosphere that in many cases has led to what we see happening in Baltimore right now.

And I get that they are fed up. I would be fed up as well. But this type of movement must be built on the foundation of peace or they will only be seen as 'thugs' or thieves. They need to protest, but in the only way in which protest is most effective: civil disobedience.

 

[n_huffhines]

Did they take the tea home with them? Break into other businesses and grab whatever they could before the authorities came on scene?

Your analogy is stupid.

How do you know some didn't?

My analogy is stupid to you only because it's colonials vs redcoats. Not blacks vs police. Today the protests are about violent government. Back then the protests were about a tax that was extremely easy to bypass (no one paid it, basically). There is no way the Tea Partiers were more justified in destroying public property.

 

[n_huffhines]

I do agree with you Huff about the war on drugs. It has created a toxic atmosphere that in many cases has led to what we see happening in Baltimore right now.

And I get that they are fed up. I would be fed up as well. But this type of movement must be built on the foundation of peace or they will only be seen as 'thugs' or thieves. They need to protest, but in the only way in which protest is most effective: civil disobedience.

That's fine. Civil disobedience is my MO, but the cops are the real concern. The rioting is a bad response to the concern.

 

[Grand Vol]

How do you know some didn't?

My analogy is stupid only because it's colonial vs redcoats. Not blacks vs police. Today the protests are about violent government. Back then the protests were about a tax that was extremely easy to bypass (no one paid it, basically). There is no way the Tea Partiers were more justified in destroying public property.

Hey, let's make this into race and further fan the flames!

Smart, real smart.

And comparing modern day looters to the Tea Party?

That evening, a group of 30 to 130 men, some dressed in the Mohawk warrior disguises, boarded the three vessels and, over the course of three hours, dumped all 342 chests of tea into the water.

Boston Tea Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm sure Sam Adams would gladly take part in breaking into a hair salon and stealing extensions.

 

[n_huffhines]

Hey, let's make this into race and further fan the flames!

Smart, real smart.

And comparing modern day looters to the Tea Party?

Boston Tea Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm sure Sam Adams would gladly take part in breaking into a hair salon and stealing extensions.

So you're saying if a bunch of dudes destroyed Lipton's shipment today, because of a tax, you'd be all good with it?

 

[FLVOL_79]

Break out the water cannons... Lets see what the original charge was.

Freddie Gray, the Baltimore Man Who Died of Spinal Injury Sustained in Police Custody - The Atlantic

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gCCjFbFXn8#t=42[/youtube]

 

[FLVOL_79]

I do agree with you Huff about the war on drugs. It has created a toxic atmosphere that in many cases has led to what we see happening in Baltimore right now.

And I get that they are fed up. I would be fed up as well. But this type of movement must be built on the foundation of peace or they will only be seen as 'thugs' or thieves. They need to protest, but in the only way in which protest is most effective: civil disobedience.

^ This. violent protests just make people focus on the violence you are committing and not what the protests were about.

Sadly I think many protesters just see this as an opportunity to get free loot.

 

[Grand Vol]

So you're saying if a bunch of dudes destroyed Lipton's shipment today, because of a tax, you'd be all good with it?

I don't know. Is Lipton being fully supported by the government? And in some cases, even runs the government like the East India Trading Company was said to have with the British Government?

But I see that basically you are saying it's fully right for the looters to take and steal from others. They are patriots for burning down non-aligned businesses and taking what isn't rightfully theirs.

 

[Bigurnge]

So you're saying if a bunch of dudes destroyed Lipton's shipment today, because of a tax, you'd be all good with it?

Are you saying these black people are starting a revolution by looting and damaging innocent people's property in the name of criminal like them?

 

[n_huffhines]

I don't know. Is Lipton being fully supported by the government? And in some cases, even runs the government like the East India Trading Company was said to have with the British Government?

But I see that basically you are saying it's fully right for the looters to take and steal from others. They are patriots for burning down non-aligned businesses and taking what isn't rightfully theirs.

Either you can't follow my argument, or you choose to pretend not to understand it. I didn't call anybody a "patriot". You called a group cowards. Inconsistently, you think a group that behaved similarly was made up of brave patriots. One group cannot be patriots while the others be cowards. They are the same. That is all I'm saying.

You don't disagree with my point. You just don't like my point. You're just being difficult. You're better than this.

 

[Grand Vol]

Either you can't follow my argument, or you choose to pretend not to understand it. I didn't call anybody a "patriot". You called a group cowards. Inconsistently, you think a group that behaved similarly was made up of brave patriots. One group cannot be patriots while the others be cowards. They are the same. That is all I'm saying.

You don't disagree with my point. You just don't like my point. You're just being difficult. You're better than this.

And you're better than to look at what's happening in Baltimore, Ferguson and other places and compare those that take advantage of civil unrest to achieve their own personal motives and the Founding Fathers to achieve political independence from another nation.

This isn't about "Down with the British!" or anything like that. This is all about "Ima get mine!" and little more. These people aren't looting and stealing to make a political point. They are doing it for their own greed.

How you can even compare the two is beyond me.

 

[n_huffhines]

And you're better than to look at what's happening in Baltimore, Ferguson and other places and compare those that take advantage of civil unrest to achieve their own personal motives and the Founding Fathers to achieve political independence from another nation.

This isn't about "Down with the British!" or anything like that. This is all about "Ima get mine!" and little more. These people aren't looting and stealing to make a political point. They are doing it for their own greed.

How you can even compare the two is beyond me.

Your problem is you think you are omniscient and that you know that all the founders' motives were pure and that everyone in Baltimore has selfish motives.

The scary part is you don't think there is anything wrong with attributing this sort of unfounded, blanket judgment on entire groups of people. You must be a cop?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

So they are cowards and bullies in their own right? They don't want to take on a group that will hand their ass to them, but don't have a problem attacking defenseless individuals and looting empty businesses?

Two wrongs don't make a right here. And while I agree in principle that justice needs to be served in this death, rioting and looting is not the way to achieve their goals. You want to protest, fine. You want to make your concerns heard, fine.

You want to destroy people's property that had nothing to do with the incident at all? Not in this lifetime.

Again, cause and effect. You know that there is a likelihood that the goons will come out to get some free TVs and beer if law enforcement kills some black guy over some shady circumstances... so why do cops continue to do the things that start riots?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

I wonder what the news story will be in a few years if the crime rate has risen but no one wants to be a cop?

Seriously, I use to take one side of this issue, but the more I am exposed to these riots the more I come to recognize the futility of arguing about freedom and justice when it comes to these people. Many of them do not want freedom and justice, only an excuse to vandalize and steal. Some of these videos I am watching about these protests in Baltimore are an outright embarrassment to the African-American community. If only DuBois could see them now....

You are 100% correct. Where are the riots or calls for justice when it is a black killing a black?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Sadly I think many protesters just see this as an opportunity to get free loot.

I agree. But again, cause and effect. Cops can't complain about having to deal with looters and riots if they are not going to make the effort to change how they interact with the people they "serve".

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

I don't know. Is Lipton being fully supported by the government? And in some cases, even runs the government like the East India Trading Company was said to have with the British Government?

But I see that basically you are saying it's fully right for the looters to take and steal from others. They are patriots for burning down non-aligned businesses and taking what isn't rightfully theirs.

Cause and effect. Why did they dump the tea in Boston Harbor in the first place?

 

[Grand Vol]

Your problem is you think you are omniscient and that you know that all the founders' motives were pure and that everyone in Baltimore has selfish motives.

The scary part is you don't think there is anything wrong with attributing this sort of unfounded, blanket judgment on entire groups of people. You must be a cop?

What other possible motives could those that are breaking into businesses and stealing and keeping said items could there be? And no, I'm not omniscient to think all the Founding Father's motives were pure as the driven snow. But history has recorded their overall motives pretty well over the last 240 years. Are you ready to introduce some new information that they were just out to loot and steal for personal gain rather than the protest against taxes?

Funny that your own hypocrisy knows no bounds. Are you ready to pass a blanket judgment on an entire group of people? Namely cops?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Either you can't follow my argument, or you choose to pretend not to understand it. I didn't call anybody a "patriot". You called a group cowards. Inconsistently, you think a group that behaved similarly was made up of brave patriots. One group cannot be patriots while the others be cowards. They are the same. That is all I'm saying.

You don't disagree with my point. You just don't like my point. You're just being difficult. You're better than this.

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