Barry Obama's Really Earning that Peace Prize

#26
#26
volinbham said:
Oddly enough because we intervene the Arab world basically demanded we intervene here. It is a crazy situation we've created since WWII. We are hated for intervening yet criticized when we don't.

Time to wind down involvement and change our role. This would have been a good place to start. Support the Brits and French but don't take the lead.
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Good post.
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#27
#27
volinbham said:
Different in scale and who lead (Brits/French) but similar in principle.

Those in power in Yemen and Bahrain are killing protesters but we aren't doing squat.
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We are still 90% of the force.
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#29
#29
JayVols said:
Yes. I don't necessarily advocate isolationism, but we stick our nose into other countries' business way to often. We can't afford to, nor should we want to, be the police force of the globe.
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Exactly. I'm no isolationist, because that implies you don't trade, but for sure I'm for non-intervention.
 
#30
#30
Vol_4_Life said:
I'm in the same boat as you. Iraq and Afghanistan have convinced me that our military should be used only to defend our country. Putting American lives at risk for some "moral obligation" reason is folly.
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They have convinced me that any overseas military involvement should be undertaken only when we have a clear, precise, and articulable goal that can be measured and weighed against the cost. As is, we have been too quick to get into these open-ended quagmires with no plan to get out and no real idea of when we can say we've done what we wanted.
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#33
#33
lawgator1 said:
I'd argue sometimes its the opposite. That we remember what we did in one endeavor and assume that it translates well to another.
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Just matter of time until crap hits the fan again and endeavors translating mumbo jumbo will mean nothing.
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#34
#34
It's crazy that congress hasn't declared war in over 60 years and what do we have to show for it? Nothing but war.
 
#35
#35
hohenfelsvol said:
Just matter of time until crap hits the fan again and endeavors translating mumbo jumbo will mean nothing.
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Hman, my deal on going to war is like Robin Williams once opined, "Partially going to war makes about as much sense as partial circumcision. Either go all the way or forget it."

We have not executed a war completely resolved to do whatever it takes to win since WWII. I guess my measuring stick on a decision to go to war is: are you willing to commit to the WWII level in order to win? If yes, go all out. If no, best to not get involved. JMO.
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#36
#36
nbakerld said:
Clearly. You know why terrorists don't target Canada? Because they generally keep to themselves. To say intervention is in the interest of national security is madness. They target us because we **** around in their part of the world and strangely they don't like it.
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That's why Canada is a worthless counrty full of spineless pukes.
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#37
#37
nbakerld said:
It's crazy that congress hasn't declared war in over 60 years and what do we have to show for it? Nothing but war.
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Turning a blind eye doesn't make a problem go away.

We dont need to put ourselves in every issue, but it's certainly necessary at times.
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#38
#38
Vols520 said:
Turning a blind eye doesn't make a problem go away.

We dont need to put ourselves in every issue, but it's certainly necessary at times.
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What does that have to do with the constitution and congress's duty to declare war before we engage in it?
 
#41
#41
Vols520 said:
That's why Canada is a worthless counrty full of spineless pukes.
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There's only 30 million of them, it isn't like they are even big enough or have the historical inertia to be major players in military affairs.


Damn, I don't get the ally-bashing.
 
#42
#42
BigPapaVol said:
What risk is that to you?
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What risk? I don't know, 2 wars, possibly 3. The president can get away with trampling the constitution while engaging in unauthorized foreign conflict as long as the people approve of interventionist behavior. You can't build an empire out of a democracy if the people aren't nationalists.
 
#43
#43
IPorange said:
There's only 30 million of them, it isn't like they are even big enough or have the historical inertia to be major players in military affairs.


Damn, I don't get the ally-bashing.
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I'm being a little facetious.
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#46
#46
Vols520 said:
And so does somebody that's too scared to act.
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It's not about being scared to act, it's about rule of law and liberty. I'd be scared if I were in Afghanistan fighting on the front lines, but it doesn't take a brave person to politically support intervention.
 
#47
#47
Vols520 said:
Apparenlty I have a say in our foreign policy.
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That was my point, which is just as valid as any of the folks who think worldwide acceptance of our view and pacifism as a knee jerk policy are the way to go.

Jingoism wasn't viewed as a problem when we decided that being the big boy on the block was better for America that ceding all to the League of Nations.
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#48
#48
nbakerld said:
It's not about being scared to act, it's about rule of law and liberty. I'd be scared if I were in Afghanistan fighting on the front lines, but it doesn't take a brave person to politically support intervention.
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I don't blindly follow intervention, or think I am 'tough' when I do support it.

But I think always avoiding conflict is equally as bad as what you are criticizing.
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#49
#49
Vols520 said:
I don't blindly follow intervention, or think I am 'tough' when I do support it.

But I think always avoiding conflict is equally as bad as what you are criticizing.
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I am all for taking on conflict when appropriate. If a nation is stupid enough to attack us on our turf, I'm ready to go to war.

We aren't authorized to be the world police and we can't afford it. Rome and Greece fell because they spread their empires beyond what was feasible and had to devalue their money to pay for it. Sound familiar?
 
#50
#50
nbakerld said:
I am all for taking on conflict when appropriate. If a nation is stupid enough to attack us on our turf, I'm ready to go to war.

We aren't authorized to be the world police and we can't afford it. Rome and Greece fell because they spread their empires beyond what was feasible and had to devalue their money to pay for it. Sound familiar?
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They were trying to conquer the globe. We are not.
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