Bush has nearly doubled the National Debt

#1
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WA_Vol

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#1
I put this in another thread, but it deserves its own thread.

President Bush has nearly doubled the national debt during his eight years in the White House. As he prepares to return to Texas next month, Mr. Bush is on track to add $5 trillion to the $5.73 trillion national debt he inherited when he took office. According to Treasury Department data, the number was $10.66 trillion at the end of November, and it has been rising at an astronomical rate.
During fiscal 2008, which ended Sept. 30, the national debt increased by more than $1 trillion, breaking the previous fiscal year record of more than $600 billion. The national debt includes obligations held by the public as well as the intragovernmental debt in trust funds such as those operated by Medicare and Social Security.
The government's debt situation is about to get worse.
"Federal debt should increase by $2 trillion in fiscal year 2009," said Stan Collender, a longtime budget analyst who is the managing director at Qorvis Communications.
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Washington Times - Eight years in office, a $10.6 trillion debt

Anyone in Congress in the last 8 years should have been voted out already, this is kind of fisical irresponsibility is indefensable.

Waiting for the Bush apologists, 1.....2......3.....
 
#6
#6
oklavol said:
I put this in another thread, but it deserves its own thread.



Washington Times - Eight years in office, a $10.6 trillion debt

Anyone in Congress in the last 8 years should have been voted out already, this is kind of fisical irresponsibility is indefensable.

Waiting for the Bush apologists, 1.....2......3.....
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I actually remember reading that we had a surplus
when he took over.That indeed we were in the black.
Which makes his tenure that much worse.
 
#7
#7
BigPapaVol said:
were the entitlements payments necessary?
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hohenfelsvol implied the national debt doubling was primarily because of the war, isn't entitlements payments separate?

Do you think the debt would have been higher without the Bush tax cuts? If I am not mistaken, Bush was the first president in the last 100 years to go to war and not raise taxes to pay for it. Just wondering if the tax cuts paid for the war better than raising taxes would have.
 
#9
#9
rjd970 said:
hohenfelsvol implied the national debt doubling was primarily because of the war, isn't entitlements payments separate?

Do you think the debt would have been higher without the Bush tax cuts? If I am not mistaken, Bush was the first president in the last 100 years to go to war and not raise taxes to pay for it. Just wondering if the tax cuts paid for the war better than raising taxes would have.
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I think raising taxes would have started this recession 5 years ago.
 
#10
#10
BigPapaVol said:
I think raising taxes would have started this recession 5 years ago.
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Ok.

Again...do you think the debt would have been higher over the last eight years without the Bush tax cuts? I really want to get your opinion on this.

I can't see how cutting taxes in a time of war is fiscally responsible, but I want to hear the other side of the argument.
 
#11
#11
as a % of gdp our debt is lower than virtually every first world country. much ado about nothing.
 
#12
#12
rjd970 said:
Ok.

Again...do you think the debt would have been higher over the last eight years without the Bush tax cuts?
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yes. the tax cuts produced billions of dollars in increased revenues do to increased employment and consumer spending. bush's mistake was spending like a drunken pirate, not the tax cuts.
 
#13
#13
rjd970 said:
Ok.

Again...do you think the debt would have been higher over the last eight years without the Bush tax cuts? I really want to get your opinion on this.

I can't see how cutting taxes in a time of war is fiscally responsible, but I want to hear the other side of the argument.
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recessions are enormous debt producing animals, so yes the debt would have been higher, IMO.

The other side of the argument would be how can raising taxes ever be good for the economy, regardless of international circumstances. The economy is the engine by which we fund our gov't operations, so suppressing it seems to me to be a bad move.
 
#14
#14
droski said:
as a % of gdp our debt is lower than virtually every first world country. much ado about nothing.
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I agree. Any talk about national debt must be put in perspective, but this it is still relevant because as a % of GDP, the debt has also steadily climbed over the last 8 years. We may be fine now, but fiscally we can't continue like we have over the last 8 years forever.
 
#15
#15
rjd970 said:
We may be fine now, but fiscally we can't continue like we have over the last 8 years forever.
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with the 30 year treasury at 3%, it would we darn near criminal to raise taxes rather than borrow to stimulate the economy. now if that rate goes to 6% or higher than i think you have a point.
 
#16
#16
droski said:
with the 30 year treasury at 3%, it would we darn near criminal to raise taxes rather than borrow to stimulate the economy. now if that rate goes to 6% or higher than i think you have a point.
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exactly. gov't is also about to restructure huge swaths of its debt to these lower rates. It's a boon to our economy in the end.
 
#17
#17
It's going to be hard to stimulate the economy when interest rates are already near zero. Cutting taxes works for the people working and making money. For the jobless, it's not going to help.

The increased debt is one the reasons for the falling dollar vs the euro although the dollar has been performing better.
 
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#18
#18
BigPapaVol said:
exactly. gov't is also about to restructure huge swaths of its debt to these lower rates. It's a boon to our economy in the end.
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just imagine what that $1000 will be worth 30 years from now? with inflation likely to be at least in the 3-4% range we are actually making money borrowing from these idiots.
 
#19
#19
oklavol said:
The increased debt is one the reasons for the falling dollar vs the euro although the dollar has been performing better.
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if this was true we'd start seeing treasury rates rise. there are a lot of people buying dollars to buy treasuries since it is now seen as the only safe asset in the world.
 
#20
#20
droski said:
if this was true we'd start seeing treasury rates rise. there are a lot of people buying dollars to buy treasuries since it is now seen as the only safe asset in the world.
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Right, I was referring to before the credit crunch when the dollar was falling heavily against the Euro.
 
#21
#21
droski said:
just imagine what that $1000 will be worth 30 years from now? with inflation likely to be at least in the 3-4% range we are actually making money borrowing from these idiots.
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A neural communications battery.
 
#22
#22
droski said:
if this was true we'd start seeing treasury rates rise. there are a lot of people buying dollars to buy treasuries since it is now seen as the only safe asset in the world.
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The BOP and returns on dollar denominated assets drive the value of the dollar. Clearly our national debt has an impact, but it's not as significant as you suggest.
 
#24
#24
droski said:
with the 30 year treasury at 3%, it would we darn near criminal to raise taxes rather than borrow to stimulate the economy. now if that rate goes to 6% or higher than i think you have a point.
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Rates will inevitably have to come back up. What do you think the chances are the 30 year treasury will go north of 6% in the next couple of years?
 
#25
#25
rjd970 said:
Rates will inevitably have to come back up. What do you think the chances are the 30 year treasury will go north of 6% in the next couple of years?
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Not till the recession ends and people begin putting their money back in stocks. At least 12 months.
 
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