Climate Change Report

#251
#251
tumscalcium said:
No one scared of Thanksgiving can “get” anyone.

I did set you off rather easily. Normally it takes 2-3 posts for you to start crying. It only took one this time. I have set up shop in your rather spacious head. Now get me that beer. Lulz
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lmao. You have to try to come off this stupid.
 
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#253
#253
ClearwaterVol said:
I have not dedicated a career to studying the problem. I'd say we should start paying a little more attention to the scientists who have studied the problem extensively instead of pretending that we know better.
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You mean those people who are raking in government subsidized global whoring funds and ignoring this??? As an engineer and apparently not part of the "scientific community", I'd have to say I'm highly unimpressed with "scientists". Most people with any degree of diagnostic capability in complex systems bother to learn something about causality ... linkage between an event and the result ... feedback and controls ... transfer functions ... ; but apparently if you live in an ivy tower, common sense and looking beyond your nose are highly optional and frowned upon if it upsets the party line. This BS ranks right up there with a corporate wizard who thinks he can make a financial turnaround by ordering a 10% hit on "elective" travel when travels costs are the only target and they are like 5% of the corporate budget. And all that assumes that you actually decide it makes sense to ignore all the other climate changes ( you know ... those little things called warm periods and ice ages) throughout the earth's history and blame it all on man.
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#254
#254
AM64 said:
You mean those people who are raking in government subsidized global whoring funds and ignoring this??? As an engineer and apparently not part of the "scientific community", I'd have to say I'm highly unimpressed with "scientists". Most people with any degree of diagnostic capability in complex systems bother to learn something about causality ... linkage between an event and the result ... feedback and controls ... transfer functions ... ; but apparently if you live in an ivy tower, common sense and looking beyond your nose are highly optional and frowned upon if it upsets the party line. This BS ranks right up there with a corporate wizard who thinks he can make a financial turnaround by ordering a 10% hit on "elective" travel when travels costs are the only target and they are like 5% of the corporate budget. And all that assumes that you actually decide it makes sense to ignore all the other climate changes ( you know ... those little things called warm periods and ice ages) throughout the earth's history and blame it all on man.
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You seem strangely content ignoring any other possible factors. Which seems odd considering that is your beef with the scientists.
 
#256
#256
ClearwaterVol said:
You seem strangely content ignoring any other possible factors. Which seems odd considering that is your beef with the scientists.
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Not at all. I think we should strive to leave the planet better than we found it - or at least no worse, but there are plenty of things that don't make sense. One is claiming the problem is man made while ignoring a soaring population. Another is the thought we should tie up what's left of our industry in environmental regulation "to save the world" while we offshore manufacturing to some of the worst polluting nations and then create additional pollution by shipping products across an ocean. Then you absolutely have to marvel at car companies who have decided that trucks and SUVs are what the customer wants ... having nothing at all to do with an advertising history that has pushed people in that direction; and who knows role the CAFE standards ultimately played in the mess because corporate fuel standards didn't at least originally apply to truck (including SUV) platforms - another failure of lobby assisted big government to accomplish anything positive.
 
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#258
#258
AM64 said:
Not at all. I think we should strive to leave the planet better than we found it - or at least no worse, but there are plenty of things that don't make sense. One is claiming the problem is man made while ignoring a soaring population. Another is the thought we should tie up what's left of our industry in environmental regulation "to save the world" while we offshore manufacturing to some of the worst polluting nations and then create additional pollution by shipping products across an ocean. Then you absolutely have to marvel at car companies who have decided that trucks and SUVs are what the customer wants ... having nothing at all to do with an advertising history that has pushed people in that direction; and who knows role the CAFE standards ultimately played in the mess because corporate fuel standards didn't at least originally apply to truck (including SUV) platforms - another failure of lobby assisted big government to accomplish anything positive.
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this.
 
#264
#264
ClearwaterVol said:
I am glad that you are more knowledgeable than people that study such things.
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Lol. Why do you afford such a grand view of scientists who study? Do you think every one of them are just automatically smart because they have degrees? I

Science at one point said that sugar wasn't bad for you and that saturated fat caused heart disease. Scientists have been wrong many times about many things. There have been instances where scientists were caught falsifying climate data. Scientists aren't the end all authority simply because they study something
 
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#265
#265
ClearwaterVol said:
How bout the ones that had appendicitis?
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Did you know that last week ... anyway, scientists were claiming that people who have had an appendectomy were less likely to have Alzheimers? My guess is that a lot of "scientific" garbage comes from PhD theses - largely superficial documents without the real study and data needed to support the conclusion. Somehow we have to find a balance between the underfunded and understudied and government welfare programs for the "sciences". If you've participated in the graduate world or a National Laboratory, then you know how much time is spent acquiring government grants and funding for even the most tenuous of "scientific" reasons.

Another fun fact: there's a growing list of common blood pressure meds made in wonderful places like China and India that are being recalled because they do or may contain a carcinogen? I guess it's all a twist of the "looking for love in all the wrong places" thought process.
 
#267
#267
if you want to solve the problem give the engineers a blank check, both literally and figuratively. they can actually get stuff done, and they will be the ones doing it anyway. they won't waste time coming to a consensus, or at least near as much time. and with real world experience and knowledge I am willing to bet my bank account they have a better grasp of what is actually the problem and how to fix it than any scientist does.
 
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#268
#268
LouderVol said:
if you want to solve the problem give the engineers a blank check, both literally and figuratively. they can actually get stuff done, and they will be the ones doing it anyway. they won't waste time coming to a consensus, or at least near as much time. and with real world experience and knowledge I am willing to bet my bank account they have a better grasp of what is actually the problem and how to fix it than any scientist does.
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Except the engineers will design something that makes maintenance a PITA.
 
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#269
#269
The thing about this entire climate change is being caused by humans kind of blows back to science. I learned a long time ago and I proved it when I started working that "those that cannot do teach and those that can, do".

I didn't realize that the professors that taught me were so F'n stupid when it came to being practical. They knew theory, but they didn't have a damn clue how things worked in the real world.
 
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#270
#270
hog88 said:
Except the engineers will design something that makes maintenance a PITA.
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That's a reflection on how few engineers had hands on experience as a kid. You have to actually have taken stuff apart to see how it worked to get a feel for good craftsmanship and design. Trying to get to a bolt that isn't accessible in an assembled car is a learning experience - one that fewer and fewer future engineers are getting. With an urban shift and stuff that gets replaced and not repaired, future engineers are getting little of anything other than the academics necessary for a degree ... gotta get your hands dirty to understand how things really work. Of course, even the best engineers are sidetracked by clowns with MBAs who only see schedules and dollars as important - that significantly affects best practices, too.
 
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#271
#271
Obsessed said:
The sun lies at the heart of the solar system, where it is by far the largest object. It holds 99.8 percent of the solar system's mass and is roughly 109 times the diameter of the Earth — about one million Earths could fit inside the sun. ... The sun is one of more than 100 billion stars in the Milky Way.
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Obsessed said:
It’s not us as a planet either. Think about these things as well

Taxes and carbon credits won’t stop the sun doing what it does.
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It’s not the sun. We can measure this directly. Total solar irradiance has been decreasing over the past 50 years while Earth’s surface temperature has been rising.

Additionally, the stratosphere has been cooling while the lower atmosphere is warming. This is inconsistent with an external forcing such as the sun. It is consistent with the greenhouse effect.
 
#273
#273
hog88 said:
They agree with the people funding them.
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This is a silly conspiracy theory. For one, scientists advance their careers and earn funding through groundbreaking research, not reaffirming the consensus. A Nobel prize awaits anyone that disproves AGW.

But all that aside, your statement is still historically incorrect. Koch payed former (at the time) skeptic Richard Muller to do their own climate study, but the result was not what Koch wanted as Muller concluded that the overwhelming majority of scientists were correct after all. Likewise, oil companies have been conducting (and burying) their own climate research since the 70s and most of it also confirms the scientific consensus.
 
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#274
#274
VolStrom said:
The thing about this entire climate change is being caused by humans kind of blows back to science. I learned a long time ago and I proved it when I started working that "those that cannot do teach and those that can, do".

I didn't realize that the professors that taught me were so F'n stupid when it came to being practical. They knew theory, but they didn't have a damn clue how things worked in the real world.
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Huff knows theory.
 
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#275
#275
C-south said:
Nobody totally denies it just the fact that it’s supposed to be solely a man made issue that throwing money at money will fix. I remember all the “scientific evidence” about acid rain 30+ years ago.
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There are plenty that still deny the fact that it’s even happening, but most have at least moved on to stage 2 climate denial in recent years.

Anyway, do you also remember that Reagan and Bush used the power of the market through cap-and-trade to fight lead pollution, ozone depletion, and acid rain? Do you remember how industry lobbyists bitched and moaned that any regulation would destroy the economy? No, you didn’t, and now 30 years later we use unleaded gasoline, have less acidic rain, the ozone hole is recovering, and it was all so painless you didn’t even notice!
 
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