Closing the recruiting gap

[jakez4ut]

I agree partly. I would like to see more top end talent in this class. But at the same time, I do not believe for one second that Gibson and Smith are 3 stars. I am surprised also that Telander and Conyers are rated as low as they are. I think we have some guys who will out perform their ranking.

But I'm disappointed that we aren't seeing any traction with more elite recruits in this class based upon our season. I'm surprised we aren't hearing from Lucas Simmons or Rico Walker, or that M'Pemba never really gave us a shot, or that Cobb won't even pick up the phone when we call, or that Francis won't reconsider, or that Searcy shut his recruitment down for Florida, or that we're not hearing about a highly ranked recruit who wasn't on our radar suddenly showing interest. None of that is happening and I don't get it.

flip that coin....it's not like any of our current commits are taking calls or making considerations either.

i think you just have to accept that the majority of the work done on this class was done last summer, fall and in to this spring/summer.

and i think the portal will be good to us to fill some needs.

close this class with Keith, Lang, hopefully Hobbs....flip Ramil.....and i'm calling it a W.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

flip that coin....it's not like any of our current commits are taking calls or making considerations either.

i think you just have to accept that the majority of the work done on this class was done last summer, fall and in to this spring/summer.

True, but we're winning. These other schools aren't.

and i think the portal will be good to us to fill some needs.

close this class with Keith, Lang, hopefully Hobbs....flip Ramil.....and i'm calling it a W.

The rankings on Keith and Lang.... man. I hope they're better than that. They are bottom tier 3 stars. But Hobbs and Ramil would be W's.

 

[Fullfillmer]

Clemson Football: A look at Recruiting Class Rankings under Dabo Swinney

The path for Clemson has been much, much easier. Last I checked they play in a weak ACC so their pathway is much easier and they don’t play Georgia, Alabama, Florida every year. Way easier to string good season after good season when playing significantly weaker competition.

 

[MarcoVol]

The path for Clemson has been much, much easier. Last I checked they play in a weak ACC so their pathway is much easier and they don’t play Georgia, Alabama, Florida every year. Way easier to string good season after good season when playing significantly weaker competition.

Not talking about a good season. Talking about a NC season. They beat Bama both times on their way to a title. But a team can definitely win 10 games every season in the SEC without recruiting in the top 3 or 5 of the country.

2016 FL won the East with a mighty overall record of 9-4 including a loss to Vols. Another was to an ACC team. 2016 UGA went 8-5. Bama went 14-1 and lost to Clemson.

2018 FL lost to UK and Mizzou. Bama lost to Clemson in title game 44-16. That azz whooping without a top 3 or 5 class.

Those teams you mention aren’t unbeatable. They have talent, yes, but they can be beaten.

We’ve just had such terrible coaching that you’ve been brainwashed into thinking the talent delta is why we lost. No it’s bc we had coaches who lost Georgia St, Vandy, and other sh*t teams.

I’m not saying we beat them every year. But they’ve only been un-winnable games bc of coaching mixed with the talent level. Coaching/schemes can elevate talent

 

[RAVOL]

I agree partly. I would like to see more top end talent in this class. But at the same time, I do not believe for one second that Smith and some others. I am surprised also that Telander and Conyers are rated as low as they are. I think we have some guys who will out perform their ranking.

But I'm disappointed that we aren't seeing any traction with more elite recruits in this class based upon our season. I'm surprised we aren't hearing from Lucas Simmons or Rico Walker, or that M'Pemba never really gave us a shot, or that Cobb won't even pick up the phone when we call, or that Francis won't reconsider, or that Searcy shut his recruitment down for Florida, or that we're not hearing about a highly ranked recruit who wasn't on our radar suddenly showing interest. None of that is happening and I don't get it.

Why are you surprised. We have loyalty with our commitments so I like loyalty in these kids that is the school they want to attend spending the majority of these next years of life at. Yes I'm sure few we got out Bid it happens. I do see the next few years gaining traction amoung the Elite Talent.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Why are you surprised. We have loyalty with our commitments so I like loyalty in these kids that is the school they want to attend spending the majority of these next years of life at. Yes I'm sure few we got out Bid it happens. I do see the next few years gaining traction amoung the Elite Talent.

Because it is happening for other schools. MSU about to flip Dante Moore? Cobb visiting UGA. And when we were bad, players were jumping like flies.

'24 class is going to be great. But I'm surprised at the lack of momentum in the current class. Who knows, maybe a Tyre West pops up out of nowhere. Hope so. We won't finish top 10 with the current players we have a chance at adding.

 

[jakez4ut]

True, but we're winning. These other schools aren't.



The rankings on Keith and Lang.... man. I hope they're better than that. They are bottom tier 3 stars. But Hobbs and Ramil would be W's.

FSU all the sudden is trending the right way, UNC is having a great year.....i don't think it's as dire as we make it out to be. are we having a better season then either? yeah. but neither of those programs fell on their face either. UNC has a qB having maybe the best season in all of CFB. a shot at an ACC title. FSU beat a top 6 LSU team and just destroyed their biggest rival.

it is what it is.

I think you have to look at Keith on the SR tape, and the attention he's gotten this fall. safe to say he's probably ahead of his current ranking. Lang, hey, it's an OT that will need to develop. we'll never NOT need OT's.

i do think it would be important to land HObbs and flip Ramil, just for perception, if that's what you're getting at. Mpemba has been trending UGA for a very long time....would have been a big upset to land him. but he gave us a shot.

just have to get your mind right about this 23 class, it's definitely not bad lol, and look to 24 as the potential splash.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

FSU all the sudden is trending the right way, UNC is having a great year.....i don't think it's as dire as we make it out to be. are we having a better season then either? yeah. but neither of those programs fell on their face either. UNC has a qB having maybe the best season in all of CFB. a shot at an ACC title. FSU beat a top 6 LSU team and just destroyed their biggest rival.

it is what it is.

I think you have to look at Keith on the SR tape, and the attention he's gotten this fall. safe to say he's probably ahead of his current ranking. Lang, hey, it's an OT that will need to develop. we'll never NOT need OT's.

i do think it would be important to land HObbs and flip Ramil, just for perception, if that's what you're getting at. Mpemba has been trending UGA for a very long time....would have been a big upset to land him. but he gave us a shot.

just have to get your mind right about this 23 class, it's definitely not bad lol, and look to 24 as the potential splash.

It's not bad. But it's not elite. It's top heavy. Barring some late gets we aren't expecting, it's going to finish in the 12-15 range. We have to do better than that in '24 and beyond.

 

[jakez4ut]

The path for Clemson has been much, much easier. Last I checked they play in a weak ACC so their pathway is much easier and they don’t play Georgia, Alabama, Florida every year. Way easier to string good season after good season when playing significantly weaker competition.

Not talking about a good season. Talking about a NC season. They beat Bama both times on their way to a title. But a team can definitely win 10 games every season in the SEC without recruiting in the top 3 or 5 of the country.

2016 FL won the East with a mighty overall record of 9-4 including a loss to Vols. Another was to an ACC team. 2016 UGA went 8-5. Bama went 14-1 and lost to Clemson.

2018 FL lost to UK and Mizzou. Bama lost to Clemson in title game 44-16. That azz whooping without a top 3 or 5 class.

Those teams you mention aren’t unbeatable. They have talent, yes, but they can be beaten.

We’ve just had such terrible coaching that you’ve been brainwashed into thinking the talent delta is why we lost. No it’s bc we had coaches who lost Georgia St, Vandy, and other sh*t teams.

I’m not saying we beat them every year. But they’ve only been un-winnable games bc of coaching mixed with the talent level. Coaching/schemes can elevate talent

i think it's been proven enough over the years 2 things can be true.

1. Clemson recruiting at a top 12 level consistently would not have been the power house they have been in the ACC had they played in the SEC. there's 3, at least, teams in the SEC that recruit as good, or better, than they do, so the competition level would dictate they probably don't win as many conf titles.
2. Clemson's recruiting, coaching, development has been plenty good enough to win the ACC and put themselves in position to play for and win national titles. and even though they've beaten the Bama's, Georgia's, LSU's of the world, in a one game setting on a neutral field, they're plenty good enough to do that in any given year.

both can be true. i think we're kind of proof of that this year, to a certain degree. though what we've done up to this point i would say is a lot harder than anything Clemson has had to do lately.....lol.

 

[jakez4ut]

It's not bad. But it's not elite. It's top heavy. Barring some late gets we aren't expecting, it's going to finish in the 12-15 range. We have to do better than that in '24 and beyond.

agreed. i think we will. i just don't have any real angst over it right now. i do think the portal will be big for us, and if we're sitting here in April and we've not done much in the portal, then i might get a little twitchy....but until then, i like this class, i love what's going on in the 24 class early on.....and i do think the portal will benefit us for immediate concerns.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

agreed. i think we will. i just don't have any real angst over it right now. i do think the portal will be big for us, and if we're sitting here in April and we've not done much in the portal, then i might get a little twitchy....but until then, i like this class, i love what's going on in the 24 class early on.....and i do think the portal will benefit us for immediate concerns.

I expect the portal to be good also. But we missed our top targets there this year too. Hopefully this season helps us. At the same time, many of these kids enter already knowing where they're going and don't even give you a shot. We never had a shot at Gibbs for example, it was just talk. Bama bought him before he entered the portal.

There are elite players in this class. Love the secondary, love the edge guys, Hobbs is elite if we land him, and of course Nico is the best QB prospect we've signed since Peyton. But man, we need more. I am stunned at the lack of skill players. We can't get an elite RB. We've got Leacock and no one else at receiver. SHOCKING to me. Seldon is elite, but I'm not sure if he's a receiver or back or some combination who knows. I can't believe we don't have elite skill players beating down our doors.

Hopefully Smith and Telander are good and these OL guys become players. We've got to have dudes who can block Ga's dudes because they're always going to have them.

 

[MarcoVol]

I expect the portal to be good also. But we missed our top targets there this year too. Hopefully this season helps us. At the same time, many of these kids enter already knowing where they're going and don't even give you a shot. We never had a shot at Gibbs for example, it was just talk. Bama bought him before he entered the portal.

There are elite players in this class. Love the secondary, love the edge guys, Hobbs is elite if we land him, and of course Nico is the best QB prospect we've signed since Peyton. But man, we need more. I am stunned at the lack of skill players. We can't get an elite RB. We've got Leacock and no one else at receiver. SHOCKING to me. Seldon is elite, but I'm not sure if he's a receiver or back or some combination who knows. I can't believe we don't have elite skill players beating down our doors.

Hopefully Smith and Telander are good and these OL guys become players. We've got to have dudes who can block Ga's dudes because they're always going to have them.

We’re gonna be ok, Bass. This is part of the climb.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

We’re gonna be ok, Bass. This is part of the climb.

It's part of the climb for us. Wasn't part of the climb for other schools. That's what I don't get. LSU signed an elite class in the middle of their run. Of course we know what Kirby did at Ga following one season he signed the number 2 class or so. Of course, Saban signed number 1 at Bama after 1 year.

I'm not worried about us not being okay. We are far ahead of schedule. But if we want to win year in and year out we need dudes.

 

[jakez4ut]

I expect the portal to be good also. But we missed our top targets there this year too. Hopefully this season helps us. At the same time, many of these kids enter already knowing where they're going and don't even give you a shot. We never had a shot at Gibbs for example, it was just talk. Bama bought him before he entered the portal.

There are elite players in this class. Love the secondary, love the edge guys, Hobbs is elite if we land him, and of course Nico is the best QB prospect we've signed since Peyton. But man, we need more. I am stunned at the lack of skill players. We can't get an elite RB. We've got Leacock and no one else at receiver. SHOCKING to me. Seldon is elite, but I'm not sure if he's a receiver or back or some combination who knows. I can't believe we don't have elite skill players beating down our doors.

Hopefully Smith and Telander are good and these OL guys become players. We've got to have dudes who can block Ga's dudes because they're always going to have them.

if you wanted to leave out the over reaction....i'll agree iwth you on the WR and RB in particular. RB maybe moreso than WR. i think you can explain that away to some degree because of the perception that we don't run the ball. i think this year, has shown that not to be the case that we're actually a run heavy team that wants to get RB's in space. now having a full season to show that off to prospects has to be good, for OL too. you're not gonna come here and play patty cake in pass protection. you're going to maul guys in the run game.....

for WR...i think we've already seen in the 24 class, they've noticed. lol. and there's zero reason to think anything here, but for some reason, as OSU keeps getting 5* WR commits, i wonder if Tate reconsiders after watching this season? again, there's nothing there to lead me to that, other than OSU's WR room is really crowded, and seemingly getting more crowded. hard to get to the NFL if you can't get on the field. *(this is wishful thinking, admittedly).

Bass, there are holes in this class, no disagreement. but it's not so far off that we're necessarily losing MORE ground to anyone not named Georgia or maybe Alabama. that was true before the 1st commit of this class, and was gonna be true on signing day, simply because they've stacked top 3-4 classses.

so for all those reasons, i just say keep doing what we're doing....we're going in the right direction, and we're now winning games we're not supposed to. this is what we've wanted for 10 years. it's happening.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

if you wanted to leave out the over reaction....i'll agree iwth you on the WR and RB in particular. RB maybe moreso than WR. i think you can explain that away to some degree because of the perception that we don't run the ball. i think this year, has shown that not to be the case that we're actually a run heavy team that wants to get RB's in space. now having a full season to show that off to prospects has to be good, for OL too. you're not gonna come here and play patty cake in pass protection. you're going to maul guys in the run game.....

for WR...i think we've already seen in the 24 class, they've noticed. lol. and there's zero reason to think anything here, but for some reason, as OSU keeps getting 5* WR commits, i wonder if Tate reconsiders after watching this season? again, there's nothing there to lead me to that, other than OSU's WR room is really crowded, and seemingly getting more crowded. hard to get to the NFL if you can't get on the field. *(this is wishful thinking, admittedly).

Bass, there are holes in this class, no disagreement. but it's not so far off that we're necessarily losing MORE ground to anyone not named Georgia or maybe Alabama. that was true before the 1st commit of this class, and was gonna be true on signing day, simply because they've stacked top 3-4 classses.

so for all those reasons, i just say keep doing what we're doing....we're going in the right direction, and we're now winning games we're not supposed to. this is what we've wanted for 10 years. it's happening.

I don't disagree. We're moving in the right direction. I'm just surprised we aren't seeing more fruit in the '23 class and no one can really explain why. Maybe we're NIL broke? LSU is top 5 and they were a dump last year! Yes, some of their guys are from Louisiana, but many are not. First year head coach too.

OSU was Tate's dream school. I'd be stunned.

However, I did ask in the chat last night if we were talking to any recruit that we are keeping quiet, and they never answered my question. Ignored it completely. That gives me hope that there might be someone out there that could surprise us.

 

[MarcoVol]

It's part of the climb for us. Wasn't part of the climb for other schools. That's what I don't get. LSU signed an elite class in the middle of their run. Of course we know what Kirby did at Ga following one season he signed the number 2 class or so. Of course, Saban signed number 1 at Bama after 1 year.

I'm not worried about us not being okay. We are far ahead of schedule. But if we want to win year in and year out we need dudes.

LSU and UGA have built in recruiting advantages. Kids grow up loving the home state school. Louisiana is the equivalent of an island. Very, very much all about LSU.

Now Kirby recruits everywhere. Well in the 5 seasons before Kirby got there - so when recruits would be coming into high school and really starting to get into certain teams - UGA went 50-17. They had won 10+ games 4 of the 5 seasons before he arrived.

Vols, meanwhile, were 27-33 in the last 5 prior to this season. This will be the first season we will win 10 games since 2007. We were basically Missouri to these guys when they were in HS.

We have many narratives to flip. It’s happening now.

 

[MemphisVol3]

LSU and UGA have built in recruiting advantages. Kids grow up loving the home state school. Louisiana is the equivalent of an island. Very, very much all about LSU.

Now Kirby recruits everywhere. Well in the 5 seasons before Kirby got there - so when recruits would be coming into high school and really starting to get into certain teams - UGA went 50-17. They had won 10+ games 4 of the 5 seasons before he arrived.

Vols, meanwhile, were 27-33 in the last 5 prior to this season. This will be the first season we will win 10 games since 2007. We were basically Missouri to these guys when they were in HS.

We have many narratives to flip. It’s happening now.

Exactly! We're just now returning to being the "cool" school again. Our recruiting overall will get better.

 

[jakez4ut]

I don't disagree. We're moving in the right direction. I'm just surprised we aren't seeing more fruit in the '23 class and no one can really explain why. Maybe we're NIL broke? LSU is top 5 and they were a dump last year! Yes, some of their guys are from Louisiana, but many are not. First year head coach too.

OSU was Tate's dream school. I'd be stunned.

However, I did ask in the chat last night if we were talking to any recruit that we are keeping quiet, and they never answered my question. Ignored it completely. That gives me hope that there might be someone out there that could surprise us.

i get it.

i think this is the reality, right now.
It's still pretty easy to negative recruit against us. it's surely harder now. because we have results. but we're still selling, still building relationships and trying to steer kids away from UGA, Bama, LSU, OSU, CLemson that all have more equity built in terms of success, relationships, getting to the NFL. 'you don't know Tennessee is gonna be there next year, much less 2-3 years down the road, sure they're having a great year, and that's good. but we're here EVERY year. we put kids to the league EVERY year, we're in the conf title, playoffs, national title talk EVER YEAR. you're still taking a chance on an unproven commodity over there. we're a sure thing.'

i think that's the biggest reason why there's such a line of demarcation between the 23 class and 24 class and beyond, outside the fact that most of the 23 class was more or less done months ago, before this season ever started. when we were building the meat and potatoes of the 23 class we were still selling vision. the results were not in. now there are, and it's just too late in most cases.

anyway, agree an tate, i'd be stunned too...hence the wishful thinking.....fingers still crossed.

we'll see the impact of this season 2 years from now and beyond, both on the field and in recruiting.

 

[johnfnkelly]

It's part of the climb for us. Wasn't part of the climb for other schools. That's what I don't get. LSU signed an elite class in the middle of their run. Of course we know what Kirby did at Ga following one season he signed the number 2 class or so. Of course, Saban signed number 1 at Bama after 1 year.

I'm not worried about us not being okay. We are far ahead of schedule. But if we want to win year in and year out we need dudes.

You have to remember since 2000 LSU had already won 2 natties, 4 conference championships, ny6 bowls and countless relevant players in the NFL. It was also Coach O's 4th season, which gave him a lot of time to recruit these kids - way more than what Heupel has had in just his second year.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

LSU and UGA have built in recruiting advantages. Kids grow up loving the home state school. Louisiana is the equivalent of an island. Very, very much all about LSU.

Now Kirby recruits everywhere. Well in the 5 seasons before Kirby got there - so when recruits would be coming into high school and really starting to get into certain teams - UGA went 50-17. They had won 10+ games 4 of the 5 seasons before he arrived.

Vols, meanwhile, were 27-33 in the last 5 prior to this season. This will be the first season we will win 10 games since 2007. We were basically Missouri to these guys when they were in HS.

We have many narratives to flip. It’s happening now.

I'm not going to disagree on any of this. But it all feels like excuses. We've lost recruits to other schools who had momentum and we were told that's what happened. Here we are with momentum, and aren't seeing fruit of it in '23. Something is off here. Either we aren't a very good recruiter, we don't have enough NIL money, or something. We've lost kids to Michigan State, North Carolina (which is a basketball school don't care about any recent success) FSU who has been a dump as long as we have and whose coach entered on the hot seat, Ole Miss which isn't on our level as a program and never has been, Miami which is a dumpster fire and has been for as long as us, Florida which is a dumpster fire and in the first year of a head coach who we dominated in Knoxville, and others also. I'm surprised we're going to lose 2 DL targets to Clemson when Veneables is in OU.

It just seems like excuse making without a definitive reason. Maybe I'm wrong. I am glad to see that '24 however is off to the type of class we all want.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

i get it.

i think this is the reality, right now.
It's still pretty easy to negative recruit against us. it's surely harder now. because we have results. but we're still selling, still building relationships and trying to steer kids away from UGA, Bama, LSU, OSU, CLemson that all have more equity built in terms of success, relationships, getting to the NFL. 'you don't know Tennessee is gonna be there next year, much less 2-3 years down the road, sure they're having a great year, and that's good. but we're here EVERY year. we put kids to the league EVERY year, we're in the conf title, playoffs, national title talk EVER YEAR. you're still taking a chance on an unproven commodity over there. we're a sure thing'.

Bama, Clemson, and UGA can recruit this way against us. Florida, Miami, and LSU cannot. Now sure, FSU, Michigan State, and NC are behind us overall in the rankings, but again, how the crap can they negatively recruit us?

We all know why Francis is at Miami. AP said that Verse chose FSU because of NIL also. That makes me wonder if we don't have as much in the bank vault NIL wise as we need. Or maybe our staff just isn't a great recruiting staff.

 

[MemphisVol3]

I'm not going to disagree on any of this. But it all feels like excuses. We've lost recruits to other schools who had momentum and we were told that's what happened. Here we are with momentum, and aren't seeing fruit of it in '23. Something is off here. Either we aren't a very good recruiter, we don't have enough NIL money, or something. We've lost kids to Michigan State, North Carolina (which is a basketball school don't care about any recent success) FSU who has been a dump as long as we have and whose coach entered on the hot seat, Ole Miss which isn't on our level as a program and never has been, Miami which is a dumpster fire and has been for as long as us, Florida which is a dumpster fire and in the first year of a head coach who we dominated in Knoxville, and others also. I'm surprised we're going to lose 2 DL targets to Clemson when Veneables is in OU.

It just seems like excuse making without a definitive reason. Maybe I'm wrong. I am glad to see that '24 however is off to the type of class we all want.

I understand your grief brother, but all of those schools have had more recent success than us.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

You have to remember since 2000 LSU had already won 2 natties, 4 conference championships, ny6 bowls and countless relevant players in the NFL. It was also Coach O's 4th season, which gave him a lot of time to recruit these kids - way more than what Heupel has had in just his second year.

This is true and LSU has always been an elite recruiter. I don't deny this. Home state also helps and our '23 in state class is atrocious. 3 of the higher ranked prospects are QB's and of course we have Nico so don't need.

I'm not denying that these things are true. I just expected more out of '23 after seeing what we've done on the field. Hopefully the transfer portal makes up for it.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

I understand your grief brother, but all of those schools have had more recent success than us.

FSU hasn't had success since Jameis in 2013. Miami hasn't had success since the early 2000's. Ole Miss has never had success. NC has never had football success.

 

[MemphisVol3]

FSU hasn't had success since Jameis in 2013. Miami hasn't had success since the early 2000's. Ole Miss has never had success. NC has never had football success.

They haven't but sadly, they've had more than us over these last several years.