Coaching Search- The Reality

#26
#26
My thoughts are Phil needs to go after a top level coach. Love them or hate them....Brenda Frese, Dawn Staley, Vic Shaeffer, Jeff Walz, and even Cori Close are our best available options. They can get us there. We need to get aggressive and pursue one of them. If it's a $$$$$ issue, its ridiculous....all the money Pat brought to the university, the legacy, and the weight Lady Vols basketball USED to carry deserves a top level coach....shell out the $$$$. I'd imagine Pat would be pee'd to see how what she had built up, has been pushed to the side like a red headed stepchild over the years.

This ridiculous thought that our next coach should be someone with Lady Vols ties is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS. If they were a great player here then they graduate and become a mediocre coach somewhere, they come here and fail....next thing you know....4 or 5 years later, we are calling for her head and she becomes the next person hated in Knoxville! We need the best available option regardless of past affiliation! Spoiler alert.....the best option out there for the next Lady Vols basketball coach is definitely not someone who has previous ties to the Lady Vols! Get real and get with the program!
 
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#29
#29
BowlBrother85 said:
I just hope it is a broad search and Fulmer doesn't feel locked into hiring someone with ties to Tennessee (Kellie Jolly-Harper) or a woman. I also hope that he has the freedom to make a fair market value offer.
Click to expand...

I feel confident that all those things are true. Fulmer has proven to me that he is doing things right. Until that changes, I will trust that he is getting the best people available.
 
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#30
#30
I disagree OP. Because, there were many faithful UTLV fans on here calling for Tyler Summitt to get this job before he ever even went to LATech. Those
are some saavy fans.
 
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#33
#33
OldNSlow said:
I just posted this in another thread and wanted to share my thoughts so I gave it its own thread:

For those of you calling for coaches with no head coaching experience or Power 5 experience as a head coach here are some facts to chew on.

This is a beast. This will require the best that have proven they can handle a job like Tennessee. Coaches that have been power 5 and failed should not be considered. This is not the basketball landscape that it was when Pat was hired. Things have changed and changed a lot.

I think if the truth is known, whats happened here is easy to see. The coaches did a pretty good job recruiting top kids, but failed at being able to handle all the egos. This is or could be the biggest thing a top program has to deal with when getting high profile athletes and parents. I say parents because thats part of the package, as it was not in the days of Pats reign. Coach would have pulled her hair out dealing with some of these kids and parents. Ill bet if you ask Holly or her assistants they would echo this or any other high level programs coach. Just look at the world we live in now and tell me I am wrong.

As far as to say this coach has won at mid major and been successful and we should hire them, well I have said before at this point in the Lady Vols history we do not have the time nor the patience to train a coach. The fan base wont let that happen, not can the program sustain another few years of trying to get it right. We must have a proven coach who has already been through the process and proven they can do what needs to be done here at this level, and the ability to get this done in a couple three years. Its what we demand.

So where does that leave us with choices? Ask yourself what you would do given this large looming task. Hire a mid major coach? Hire someone with no experience as a head coach? Hire an assistant? I see lots of names thrown out since CHW was fired. I wonder how many know how things work behind the scenes to put a team on the floor that will make our fan base happy? Some say only hire a woman. No men. How sexist. Also how stupid to limit our great tradition that we want back to its glory that we should take such a close minded look at a coaching search based on anything but who would be the best candidate to restore this once great program to its rightful spot in this great sport we love so much.

With that being said, if we get the right person, expect turnover. Its coming and coming soon. This is the by product of what you have seen publicly, behind the scenes and on the court. Change is a awesome thing. Change is also something that people dont adapt to well. Look no further than this very message board. Gotta have a coach from " the tree" or a "female" only coach. Change is coming Lady Vol fans, lets just hope the Phillip Fulmer is smart enough to understand this hire might be his biggest.
Click to expand...
Great post!:cool:

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#34
#34
OldNSlow said:
For those of you calling for coaches with no head coaching experience or Power 5 experience as a head coach here are some facts to chew on.
.
Click to expand...
tenor.gif
 
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#35
#35
Darth_Vol said:
Best coach in the SEC. I would love to get him, I just haven't seen anything to indicate he is a realistic option...
Click to expand...
Vic is one helluva coach... takes personal accountability for his team and doesn't blame others. He's an Aggie alum -- from Houston, and was Blair's assistant when they won the NC. If I were a betting person, I'd bet he returns home to take over once Blair (turns 74 this year) calls it quits.
 
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#37
#37
JKZ said:
Vic is one helluva coach... takes personal accountability for his team and doesn't blame others. He's an Aggie alum -- from Houston, and was Blair's assistant when they won the NC. If I were a betting person, I'd bet he returns home to take over once Blair (turns 74 this year) calls it quits.
Click to expand...


I believe that is his trajectory as well. He and Blair are best friends still and I sense that Blair will coach two more seasons until Carter is done. Then Schaefer will head home to Aggie land and take that job until he retires.
 
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#39
#39
I appreciate Muffet's point of view. Ironically, though, the most successful male coaches like Auriemma and Schaeffer don't hire male assistants, either.

And if you make a list of top young assistants who look like potentially great head coaches it consists predominantly of women. So the tide might be turning. (So would a Walz hire by TN be considered a step back for women? And was McGraw's announcement a subtle push to help Ivey's chances for the TN or other top coaching opening?)

Still, I believe that eight of this year's sweet sixteen and four of this year's elite eight are coached by men.

I remember back in the 90's and early 00's there was open discussion about a “conspiracy” by the selection committee to seed the Tournament in a way that would minimize the odds of too many male coaches in the Final Four (by putting as many top male-coached teams as possible in the same brackets). Not sure if there was any truth to that. But if there was, the scheme didn't work. (It was certain even before the tip off for the first elite eight game that this year's Final Four would have two male and two female head coaches, but I'm sure that was just luck of the draw.)

A similarly now politically incorrect notion is that some programs in years past hired male coaches because of homophobia or a belief that the parents of many recruits would prefer their daughters be coached by males. (Remember, years ago parents played an even larger role in their daughters' decisions). Rumors abounded that certain coaches even used the mostly ungrounded fears and predispositions of some parents to their advantage. I'd like to believe those days are gone.

The “coaching tree” argument is, IMHO, a lot of hokum. Assistants to the successful coaches at top programs get priority in hiring, but succeed or fail at about the same rate as all coaches, and the same goes for coaches who are “part of the family” because they've played for or been on staff at the school that hires them. Folks just like to point to the successful ones and ignore the many who disappoint! I'm a musician, and I can promise you that playing rhythm guitar for twenty years in Les Paul or Eric Clapton's band might look good on your resume but it will NOT turn you into the next Paul or Clapton any more certainly than if you played elsewhere.

When UConn hired an assistant at Virginia back in the 80's it was simply to fill a low-paid position for a mediocre team. The AD there had no illusions or hopes for the success that would follow. The situation was somewhat similar when Louisville hired an assistant from Maryland. Personally, I believe that hiring Niele Ivey could turn out to be a similarly successful hire. But then again, it might not.

A Harper hire looks like a bigger risk. Kelly has settled in nicely at Mo St, and it's a great mid-major program. But she's never coached in a P-5 conference or had success recruiting at the level needed to be a perennial Top 10 program. But the truth is, few coaches have. And, of that elite group, even fewer are looking to make a change. If TN has a chance to grab one – Walz or his equivalent – it is clearly the choice with the best upside relative to risk. Albeit an expensive one.

Most likely, a lot is going on that we don't know. Is Fulmer ready to come up with millions to get his first choice? Is Walz really ready to leave Louisville? Is there one or more boosters/donors ready to ante up to help get the coach they want? Is there pressure on Fulmer to hire a woman or a minority?

We'll just have to stay tuned.
 
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#40
#40
If the parameters are Head Coaching from a Power 5 conference with an immediate impact for an elite 8 or higher, the only choice would be Waltz unless Staley, Vic or some other big name coach was available. A lot of these coaches seem comfortable in the situation they are in and would not be willing to move. The only two I can think of from a Power 5 conference that might make sense is Wes Moore or Katie Meir as they have had success and are experienced.

If you are going to go the mid major route there are several choices other than K.J. Harper.

The big question for me is if you get a mid major coach are they going to be able to attract top 30 recruits. The name Tennessee still attracts recruits, so that may not be a huge problem.
 
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#43
#43
ocoandasoc said:
I appreciate Muffet's point of view. Ironically, though, the most successful male coaches like Auriemma and Schaeffer don't hire male assistants, either.

And if you make a list of top young assistants who look like potentially great head coaches it consists predominantly of women. So the tide might be turning. (So would a Walz hire by TN be considered a step back for women? And was McGraw's announcement a subtle push to help Ivey's chances for the TN or other top coaching opening?)

Still, I believe that eight of this year's sweet sixteen and four of this year's elite eight are coached by men.

I remember back in the 90's and early 00's there was open discussion about a “conspiracy” by the selection committee to seed the Tournament in a way that would minimize the odds of too many male coaches in the Final Four (by putting as many top male-coached teams as possible in the same brackets). Not sure if there was any truth to that. But if there was, the scheme didn't work. (It was certain even before the tip off for the first elite eight game that this year's Final Four would have two male and two female head coaches, but I'm sure that was just luck of the draw.)

A similarly now politically incorrect notion is that some programs in years past hired male coaches because of homophobia or a belief that the parents of many recruits would prefer their daughters be coached by males. (Remember, years ago parents played an even larger role in their daughters' decisions). Rumors abounded that certain coaches even used the mostly ungrounded fears and predispositions of some parents to their advantage. I'd like to believe those days are gone.

The “coaching tree” argument is, IMHO, a lot of hokum. Assistants to the successful coaches at top programs get priority in hiring, but succeed or fail at about the same rate as all coaches, and the same goes for coaches who are “part of the family” because they've played for or been on staff at the school that hires them. Folks just like to point to the successful ones and ignore the many who disappoint! I'm a musician, and I can promise you that playing rhythm guitar for twenty years in Les Paul or Eric Clapton's band might look good on your resume but it will NOT turn you into the next Paul or Clapton any more certainly than if you played elsewhere.

When UConn hired an assistant at Virginia back in the 80's it was simply to fill a low-paid position for a mediocre team. The AD there had no illusions or hopes for the success that would follow. The situation was somewhat similar when Louisville hired an assistant from Maryland. Personally, I believe that hiring Niele Ivey could turn out to be a similarly successful hire. But then again, it might not.

A Harper hire looks like a bigger risk. Kelly has settled in nicely at Mo St, and it's a great mid-major program. But she's never coached in a P-5 conference or had success recruiting at the level needed to be a perennial Top 10 program. But the truth is, few coaches have. And, of that elite group, even fewer are looking to make a change. If TN has a chance to grab one – Walz or his equivalent – it is clearly the choice with the best upside relative to risk. Albeit an expensive one.

Most likely, a lot is going on that we don't know. Is Fulmer ready to come up with millions to get his first choice? Is Walz really ready to leave Louisville? Is there one or more boosters/donors ready to ante up to help get the coach they want? Is there pressure on Fulmer to hire a woman or a minority?

We'll just have to stay tuned.
Click to expand...


Just because it isn't happening on the BB court doesn't mean it isn't part of the "game"

anything any coach out there can do to interrupt our success,,is open season
 
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#47
#47
It's beginning to feel like some of you guys have a bit of a man-crush on Walz. Not that there's anything wrong with that. And it would certainly explain all the negative critiques of Holly's wardrobe and mannerisms.

lol

Carry on.
 
#48
#48
lvocd said:
It's beginning to feel like some of you guys have a bit of a man-crush on Walz. Not that there's anything wrong with that. And it would certainly explain all the negative critiques of Holly's wardrobe and mannerisms.

lol

Carry on.
Click to expand...
clyde.jpg
 
#49
#49
lvocd said:
It's beginning to feel like some of you guys have a bit of a man-crush on Walz. Not that there's anything wrong with that. And it would certainly explain all the negative critiques of Holly's wardrobe and mannerisms.

lol

Carry on.
Click to expand...

I do have a man crush on him lol. I also believe he could make the turn around quick. Like one season quick. Which is why I can’t get over the possibility that he might even be an option.
 
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