Common Core

[jjay2518]

Common Core Base 10 Way To Add 9 + 6 Takes 54 Seconds | The Daily Caller

In my opinion, this is no different than a child using their fingers to understand why 9+6 is 15. This just makes it more complicated.

I cannot get behind common core.

Here is a quote from the article posted here that you (Chris) may not have read very closely.

Earlier this month, Canada’s National Post reported that a group of neuroscientists has issued a study finding that rote memorization of discrete math facts plays a critical role in mathematical development in young children.

In short, the study found, memorizing multiplication tables and answers to basic arithmetic problems is cognitively vital because, without such memorization, children will have a much harder time later on with complex math problems.

Again, if you judge the entirety of CC off of your frustration with that particular problem, you're not really giving it a fair chance. Think of how many kids struggle with long division or algebra. That's where it really makes more sense because everything is so much more organized and coherent. If you do a problem like 27 x 32, you probably know you have to add two numbers together to get the final product after the first couple steps. If you really look at all the steps up until that point, they are pretty random and you can't really explain why you do them, you just know it's the rule. When you see the problem worked out the tradional way and CC way side-by-side, it's glaringly obvious to see how that would make more sense to a student who is learning this level of multiplication for the first time.

I highly doubt there are as many people who share the sentiment of not caring about means to an end as you think.

If the kids are taught this stuff from the beginning, they'll be much better at intermediate and advanced math classes than we ever were IMO. Of course, the simple stuff is overcomplicated, and no one is ever going to go through all those steps in a real-world situation, but you have to grind it out to understand the more complicated stuff down the road.

It seems that this group of neuroscientists don't share your opinion. I think it's a good idea to present new and different ways to approach math problems, but if a kid doesn't need to use this system to understand what's going on, I don't see the point of forcing them to use it.

 

[VOLatile]

Why would that be any different with CC?

I didn't say it would, just pointing out that crucial things are left out or rewritten.

 

[VOLatile]

Ah I see. And tell me whose has been taught truthfully? Which country?

What? I have never had a class on anyone else's history than the US.

 

[VOLatile]

He had no real point.

But glad you had the honest teachers.

My point is pretty apparent. US history courses leave out or rewrite crucial aspects of US history. I don't seem to remember learning about McCarthy's witch hunts in class, but they're pretty important. Plenty more examples you can find, too. Stuff like how the settlers and government stole land from the Native Americans is grotesquely under represented. But hey... The winners get to write the history, right?

Apparently I have no point, though.

 

[joevol33]

My point is pretty apparent. US history courses leave out or rewrite crucial aspects of US history. I don't seem to remember learning about McCarthy's witch hunts in class, but they're pretty important. Plenty more examples you can find, too. Stuff like how the settlers and government stole land from the Native Americans is grotesquely under represented. But hey... The winners get to write the history, right?

Apparently I have no point, though.

Since you're more informed than me, was there really transformers on the dark side of the moon, and that was left put of our history books? Before you get hot, I'm bored and joking!

 

[VOLatile]

Since you're more informed than me, was there really transformers on the dark side of the moon, and that was left put of our history books? Before you get hot, I'm bored and joking!

No, but the moon was actually made of cheese. Niel Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin ate it all, though, so the Illuminati had to replace it with an actual moon.

 

[joevol33]

No, but the moon was actually made of cheese. Niel Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin ate it all, though, so the Illuminati had to replace it with an actual moon.

Dangit, I wanted transformers!

 

[TNsnyper20]

Dangit, I wanted transformers!

The moon is actually Cybertron. The earth is the core of Unicron. Earthquakes are cover ups for tripticon and metroplex scuffles, tidal waves are seacons being seacons, and seekers explain ufo's.

All hail Megatron!

There, feel better?

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

I have a 7 yr. old learning cc. It was ridiculous in the beginning, because it makes you do 3+ different math equations to get to an answer to things like 2+6 (for instance). It's stupid because it drags homework out for hours longer than it needs to be and frustrates children and parents into giving up.

But CC is not teaching mathematics. That's what you have to realize. Your child doesn't need to know 2+6. Computers do that routine kind of grunt work now. What it's teaching is how to find the answer to a problem. It is teaching that there are many different ways to solve a problem. It is trying to teach logic, not mathematics. That's where the frustration comes from. I don't know how I feel about it yet, but I can say that parents have been clambering for something besides memorization for a test for a long time. Instead of common sense, they got LOGIC. Which is very frustrating to parents that were never taught logic. It's more like philosophy than basic math. It's learning how to solve a problem instead of solving it directly.

 

[DarthVisor]

Not sure if accurate, but I've heard kids start using calculators in elementary math classes now.

If I recall correctly, my first calculator for school was in Jr high (7th grade).

How are kids supposed to learn basic arithmetic skills while using a calculator?

They were allowed to use the calculator on TCAP for every problem. This won't be the case on the new TNReady assessment.

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

Not sure if accurate, but I've heard kids start using calculators in elementary math classes now.

If I recall correctly, my first calculator for school was in Jr high (7th grade).

How are kids supposed to learn basic arithmetic skills while using a calculator?

...and when, exactly, are any of the children in school now going to need to do basic math? They are introduced to it quickly in 1-2 grade and then moved on to problem solving. In case you guys don't realize it. The future is about to descend on you like a ton of bricks. All that sic fi future fiction that you thought you would never see...is in the pipe. Lazer blasters, flying cars, automated robots doing your work for you, the all knowing eye in the sky, dna and gene therapy on infants., enhanced brain and body using cyborg tech, artificial intelligence, living on mars, ...it's all about to happen.

 

[joevol33]

The moon is actually Cybertron. The earth is the core of Unicron. Earthquakes are cover ups for tripticon and metroplex scuffles, tidal waves are seacons being seacons, and seekers explain ufo's.

All hail Megatron!

There, feel better?

Actually I do, thanks.

 

[TNsnyper20]

Actually I do, thanks.

Glad I could be of assistance.

 

[volinreallife]

CC = working harder not smarter

 

[marcusluvsvols]

CC is another terrible step by the public school system. Greatly over complicates simple arithmetic and just about everything else. I have only dealt with the math portion so I can't speak about the other subjects. I help my niece with her math homework which is CC. IT IS INSANELY STUPID. Fortunately my son, same grade, goes to Christian school so I don't have to deal with it from him. He is at least 2 grade levels above my niece in every core subject due to a much more aggressive curriculum and lack of CC. HOPEFULLY CC Will be repealed along with BARRYCARE. SMDH

 

[mrorange211]

But CC is not teaching mathematics. That's what you have to realize. Your child doesn't need to know 2+6. Computers do that routine kind of grunt work now. What it's teaching is how to find the answer to a problem. It is teaching that there are many different ways to solve a problem. It is trying to teach logic, not mathematics.

Out of everyone in this thread, you get it. Everyone complains about the American educational experience (19th in the world) but they chant "Communism!" when changes are made tat will help. Give CC time; we will all see the difference soon.

 

[mrorange211]

CC is another terrible step by the public school system. Greatly over complicates simple arithmetic and just about everything else. I have only dealt with the math portion so I can't speak about the other subjects. I help my niece with her math homework which is CC. IT IS INSANELY STUPID. Fortunately my son, same grade, goes to Christian school so I don't have to deal with it from him. He is at least 2 grade levels above my niece in every core subject due to a much more aggressive curriculum and lack of CC. HOPEFULLY CC Will be repealed along with BARRYCARE. SMDH

And you don't get it.

 

[marcusluvsvols]

And you don't get it.

Just because my opinion on any given subject differs from yours doesn't mean "I don't get it."

Nice hubris.

 

[mrorange211]

Just because my opinion on any given subject differs from yours doesn't mean "I don't get it."

Nice hubris.

You don't get it because you don;t understand the basic concept that perhaps the easiest way to get the answer does not produce the best learners down the road.

I have tons of students that can do a damn worksheet and do basic math. I have zero that can analyze and figure out a problem on their own. That's the difference CC makes.

 

[volinbham]

Out of everyone in this thread, you get it. Everyone complains about the American educational experience (19th in the world) but they chant "Communism!" when changes are made tat will help. Give CC time; we will all see the difference soon.

faith-based statement to end this.

My question to you is why do we have to implement this across the board. If it will yield results why not let various schools choose to adopt or not then when those wonderful results come in more will decide to adopt?

 

[VOLatile]

Out of everyone in this thread, you get it. Everyone complains about the American educational experience (19th in the world) but they chant "Communism!" when changes are made tat will help. Give CC time; we will all see the difference soon.

I have made this argument so many times on Facebook that I've become numb to CC. The parents weren't taught that way so they assume that the change is stupid because they're too bull-headed to understand.

 

[volinbham]

You don't get it because you don;t understand the basic concept that perhaps the easiest way to get the answer does not produce the best learners down the road.

I have tons of students that can do a damn worksheet and do basic math. I have zero that can analyze and figure out a problem on their own. That's the difference CC makes.

As a teacher you surely recognize that learning styles are quite varied among students.

 

[volinbham]

I have made this argument so many times on Facebook that I've become numb to CC. The parents weren't taught that way so they assume that the change is stupid because they're too bull-headed to understand.

I'll counter this by saying that any learning style should not be applied universally.

The problem is not whether or not a CC style can work for some, it is the blanket application.

The other problem I have (stated earlier) is that it is presented as "standards" which implies learning outcomes but in practice it is teaching methodology.

CC proponents should be upfront about what CC is AND provide validated research that the CC methods work best for ALL learners. Otherwise, it should be an optional approach.

 

[mrorange211]

faith-based statement to end this.

My question to you is why do we have to implement this across the board. If it will yield results why not let various schools choose to adopt or not then when those wonderful results come in more will decide to adopt?

Forgive me: I'm already seeing the difference because I am the one that does this for a living and sees the difference that it makes if done correctly. CC helps students think at a higher level because I make them do it on their own, instead of just telling them all the answers. And don't get me started on this America History garbage being thrown around the board a couple pages back. Complete BS. The curriculum of AH has remained largely unchanged since the 1950's.

CC DID start on a more state-by-state basis and their were some encouraging results across the board. Thus, nationwide implementation has been pushed for ever since. If we wait a decade to implement nationally, we will have already run out of time. That's the point.

As a teacher you surely recognize that learning styles are quite varied among students.

What's the point? CC allows for greater teaching styles than any other standards-based education strategy implemented since NCLB, and it's not even close.

 

[marcusluvsvols]

You don't get it because you don;t understand the basic concept that perhaps the easiest way to get the answer does not produce the best learners down the road.

I have tons of students that can do a damn worksheet and do basic math. I have zero that can analyze and figure out a problem on their own. That's the difference CC makes.

Again...how could you possibly know what concepts I do or do not understand ? We are strangers. Hubris.

Learn to disagree with people without being an azxhole. It will help you in life. Public school system is a pile of ****...and I spend more of my income on school for my kids than I do my mortgage to make sure they don't have to deal with it. My son is in 8th grade and has made 1 B since he started school on a curriculum that is miles and miles ahead of public schools. My daughter has yet to make a B but she is only in 1st grade. When my son took his California tests at the end of the year he placed PHS..meaning post high school...level in every single subject. His lowest percentile nationally was 97. I am sure CC produces tons of 13 year Olds who literally test off the charts like my kids do. Good luck with that.