Ferguson Riots

#6,976
#6,976
n_huffhines said:
The problem with your naysaying is the alternative is to keep going with the status quo, which has been failing for decades.

What if a private force fails? Then we're right back where we were and you have an argument against privatizing that you can cling to for all eternity.

You're afraid to try, cause it might work.
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how will a private police force be better in this instance? And don't repost the link to that Texas town. That's Texas, not Missouri.
 
#6,977
#6,977
Wasn't there talk months ago of the city disbanding its police force and turning it over to the county? This occurs from time to time down here, though its usually a question of $, not some controversy.
 
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#6,978
#6,978
Grand Vol said:
So put yourself in the Mayor's shoes...

Other than firing the police and going with private security, what reforms would you make right now?
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My number one reform would be to get the heck outta Dodge as soon as possible, and let the remaining residents reap what they sowed.
 
#6,979
#6,979
lawgator1 said:
Wasn't there talk months ago of the city disbanding its police force and turning it over to the county? This occurs from time to time down here, though its usually a question of $, not some controversy.
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That is what's going to happen in my opinion. Ferguson will not maintain it's own municipal department for much longer.
 
#6,980
#6,980
MG1968 said:
how will a private police force be better in this instance? And don't repost the link to that Texas town. That's Texas, not Missouri.
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You people that oppose privatization need to stop telling me how to craft my arguments. You're a bunch of demanding women: "Don't say privatization" and "Don't post that link", SMH.

What is different about Texas that makes privatization work?

And for those that somehow missed it:

n_huffhines said:
If people are taking shots at the Ferguson police because they are perceived to be racist (historically, not just recently), why wouldn't changing the personnel and brand make a difference?
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And to go along with privatization I would decriminalize drug use and not enforce marijuana prohibition.

Show the black community you are serious about treating them differently than in the past.
 
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#6,981
#6,981
n_huffhines said:
The problem with your naysaying is the alternative is to keep going with the status quo, which has been failing for decades.

What if a private force fails? Then we're right back where we were and you have an argument against privatizing that you can cling to for all eternity.

You're afraid to try, cause it might work.
Click to expand...

Nay-saying =/= realism. Again, find me a company willing to be dropped into that cauldron right now. G4S and Securitas are the two largest licensed private companies in MO from what I can tell. So you tell me if you were in charge of one of them whether you would accept that job right now with cops getting shot. Money isn't everything and you'd soon find yourself with zero employees if you took that job on, one got ambushed and shot and you stuck to the program of non-intervention.

And I'm not afraid to try anything at this point. But your unrealistic viewpoint that everything wrong will be magically fixed by the application of this private security force is not using the brain God gave you. You're smarter than this, or I think you are, and you have to recognize the fact that a planned community in Texas (that's still serviced by the Houston PD BTW)

No, Sharpstown, Texas, Did Not Fire its Police Force and Bring About a Huge Drop in Crime | Texas Monthly

Top neighborhoods for crime in Houston | News - Home

http://www.politifact.com/texas/art...-fast-cops-fired-private-security-hired-crim/

Is not equal to Ferguson. So please stop using your single source article as "fact" since it's a huge distortion of the truth.

Now, back to my original question. What would you do other than firing the police department (which might not even be legal anyway) and what reforms would you insist on?
 
#6,982
#6,982
You're so worried about privatization that you are arguing no company will take a bid. You either don't understand capitalism or you're knowingly grasping at straws.
 
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#6,983
#6,983
n_huffhines said:
You're so worried about privatization that you are arguing no company will take a bid. You either don't understand capitalism or you're knowingly grasping at straws.
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Did you check the links?

I figure you won't since they blow your pet theory out of the water.
 
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#6,984
#6,984
So in the end, Sharpstown did not fire its police force,
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Fair enough. On a technicality...they didn't fire, they failed to renew contract, LOL

and if crime went down significantly under the watch of the security guards who replaced the constables, it remained the neighborhood with the most total crimes in all of Houston.
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So they reduced crime in a crime heavy area?

Thanks for clarifying that misinformation, LMFAO
 
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#6,986
#6,986
n_huffhines said:
You people that oppose privatization need to stop telling me how to craft my arguments. You're a bunch of demanding women: "Don't say privatization" and "Don't post that link", SMH.

What is different about Texas that makes privatization work?

And for those that somehow missed it:



And to go along with privatization I would decriminalize drug use and not enforce marijuana prohibition.

Show the black community you are serious about treating them differently than in the past.
Click to expand...


So how do private police forces get paid? By the arrest sort of like private prisons get paid by the inmate?
 
#6,987
#6,987
n_huffhines said:
You're so worried about privatization that you are arguing no company will take a bid. You either don't understand capitalism or you're knowingly grasping at straws.
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Okay, I'll put it into simple terms then...

No company will go into that ****-storm right now that values it's employees. This isn't a worry, this is ****ing real life. You can't pay contract security enough to go into dangerous situations like that and be under the same cap the police department budget happens to be.

It's economics. But I'm sure there are companies that would gladly take it on and hire anybody they can get for slightly more than minimum wage to patrol the Ferguson area. Is that what you want? You ***** enough as it is that cops are not intelligent enough. Now add the caliber of people they would draw that would be knowingly going into a situation where they could be injured or killed. You want that kind of "policing" in that community?

Stop thinking with your An-Cap brain for a second and think logically. You're proving me wrong right now.
 
#6,991
#6,991
Grand Vol said:
Check the links I provided. You want to debate the merits of the privatized police forces. Here's the contrary opinions.

Check and refute the links. Or gracefully bow out of the debate.
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I was lulzing because I checked one link (the one that looked the most devastating) and it was a joke and a waste of my time, and I already offered my critique of it.
 
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#6,992
#6,992
n_huffhines said:
You people that oppose privatization need to stop telling me how to craft my arguments. You're a bunch of demanding women: "Don't say privatization" and "Don't post that link", SMH.

What is different about Texas that makes privatization work?

And for those that somehow missed it:



And to go along with privatization I would decriminalize drug use and not enforce marijuana prohibition.

Show the black community you are serious about treating them differently than in the past.
Click to expand...

I never once said I was against privatization. You're the one who claimed that it would solve the problems in Ferguson, MO. Being challenged to prove how you know this isn't anti-capitalist or defending the status quo.
 
#6,993
#6,993
n_huffhines said:
Fair enough. On a technicality...they didn't fire, they failed to renew contract, LOL
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Okay Mister Selective Facts.

They refused to renew a contract with a company that provided additional security presence patrols.

THEY DID NOT FIRE THEIR COPS AS THE HOUSTON POLICE DEPARTMENT STILL HAS JURISDICTION OVER THAT AREA.

The agency was the constabulary. Not cops. A company that provided additional support over and beyond what the Houston PD and Sheriff's Office did.

n_huffhines said:
So they reduced crime in a crime heavy area?

Thanks for clarifying that misinformation, LMFAO
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Oh, a spokesman from the company (SEAL Security) made the claim that crime was reduced 60% after an independent survey where one group claimed crime had gone down.

But a new agency that tracks those stats still says Sharpstown has the highest rate of crime in the Houston Metro Area is wrong and misinformed because by golly, private security fixes everything!

And you dare to call me scared to admit the facts?

I was wrong. You really are a simpleton when it comes to these matters.
 
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#6,996
#6,996
hog88 said:
Simple question. How do you set up their contract? Minimum amount of arrests/tickets per month? Really can't do it on crime statistics because it's easy to show a drop in crime by ignoring it or pencil whipping it.
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Why do you have to rely on the private police force to report crime statistics? Seems like there would be really easy ways to get accurate numbers.
 
#6,998
#6,998
Anyone want a lulz?

Texas town sees crime drop by almost two thirds after firing police, hiring private security | Rare

UPDATE: Since publication of this story, it has come to our attention that our sources contained serious factual errors about the extent of Sharpstown’s change in police force, the alleged drop in crime, and even the nature of Sharpstown itself. We would like to apologize for sharing this misinformation, retract our original article below, and direct Rare readers to a more accurate account here.
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And the here link?

No, Sharpstown, Texas, Did Not Fire its Police Force and Bring About a Huge Drop in Crime | Texas Monthly

I think I posted that link myself.
 
#6,999
#6,999
Grand Vol said:
Anyone want a lulz?

Texas town sees crime drop by almost two thirds after firing police, hiring private security | Rare



And the here link?

No, Sharpstown, Texas, Did Not Fire its Police Force and Bring About a Huge Drop in Crime | Texas Monthly

I think I posted that link myself.
Click to expand...

more lulz

First, there is no such place as Sharpstown, Texas. Sharpstown is a master-planned community in southwest Houston, Texas. Sharpstown has never had its own schools, fire department, mayor, post offices, city council, or police force. It is under the jurisdiction of the Houston Police Department, just like downtown Houston, River Oaks, and Fifth Ward.
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#7,000
#7,000
n_huffhines said:
Fair enough. On a technicality...they didn't fire, they failed to renew contract, LOL



So they reduced crime in a crime heavy area?
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they didn't hire on EXTRA security from the county.

and they reduced the number of home break-ins. and the numbers are small enough where the decrease came from locking up 1 person/group.

lets say we go with this, and we get a year into the system with no cops (who do you think this private company is hiring, or what happens to these cops if there is wide spread use of private companies). Private Security YAY! and suddenly there is a major lawsuit/wrong doing by the company turning the community against private cops. where do we go from there? the county cops are down, state sheriffs numbers would also likely be down as well, does the FBI take up policing for the 2-3 months it takes the local cops (assuming you can find any) to get back up to speed?

going with your option has some major risks. i only bring up one.
 
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