Five Players That Got Screwed By The Hall

#51
#51
butchna said:
I spend a lot of the valuable remaining real estate that is my lifespan defending baseball and its fans and its mentality. Always refused to be an apologist for dumb crap like the unwritten rules and refuse to embrace the concept that catching and throwing the baseball real good eclipses the hallmarks like run production. At least no one’s going full looney and discounting pitching over how well you hold someone on base.
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No one said defense eclipses offense. But it is a pretty big part of the game.

Trout’s offensive production was also pretty damn good that year.
 
#52
#52
knoxvol52 said:
Trout wasn't going to win A.L. MVP in 2012.

Only 2 rookies have ever won American League M.V.P. as a rookie.

Fred Lynn
Ichiro Suzuki

Plus Miggie won Triple Crown and Tigers won Division.
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I never said Trout should have won the MVP.

The triple crown is a cool distinction, but pretty meaningless.
Cabrera’s 2013 offensive output was better than his 2012 offensive output.

I’m betting there are those that will argue his 2012 triple crown year was better though, cause, triple crown 😂
 
#53
#53
Ehhhhhhh…..

They deserve recognition for what they accomplished, and certainly for why.

But I have a hard time buying Rate records when you’re playing 60 game seasons.

www.mlb.com

What to know about Negro Leagues stats entering MLB record

Major League Baseball’s embrace of the Negro Leagues is now recognized in the record book, resulting in new-look leaderboards fronted in several prominent places by Hall of Famer Josh Gibson and an overdue appreciation of many other Black stars. Following the 2020 announcement that seven...
www.mlb.com www.mlb.com
 
#54
#54
85SugarVol said:
Ehhhhhhh…..

They deserve recognition for what they accomplished, and certainly for why.

But I have a hard time buying Rate records when you’re playing 60 game seasons.

www.mlb.com

What to know about Negro Leagues stats entering MLB record

Major League Baseball’s embrace of the Negro Leagues is now recognized in the record book, resulting in new-look leaderboards fronted in several prominent places by Hall of Famer Josh Gibson and an overdue appreciation of many other Black stars. Following the 2020 announcement that seven...
www.mlb.com www.mlb.com
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It’s a really hard, complicating debate.

Because while yes, Negro League players shuld absolutely be recognized as legitimate baseball and I agree that they had players as talented as MLB stars, the record keeping and the lack of organized games makes this also unfair to past players. And I think a significant part of the decision was in bad faith to take away some of Bonds’ and Cobb’s record (although ironically enough, Josh Gibson had his own demons).

And it’s not like MLB hasn’t incorporated Negro League players. They built the museum, they’ve elected numerous players to Cooperstown. And I think that should continue for sure. I believe that a lot this was motivated to blackball Bonds and earn some pandering points.
 
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#56
#56
zjcvols said:
It’s a really hard, complicating debate.

Because while yes, Negro League players shuld absolutely be recognized as legitimate baseball and I agree that they had players as talented as MLB stars, the record keeping and the lack of organized games makes this also unfair to past players. And I think a significant part of the decision was in bad faith to take away some of Bonds’ and Cobb’s record (although ironically enough, Josh Gibson had his own demons).

And it’s not like MLB hasn’t incorporated Negro League players. They built the museum, they’ve elected numerous players to Cooperstown. And I think that should continue for sure. I believe that a lot this was motivated to blackball Bonds and earn some pandering points.
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I think demoting Cobb (and what he stood for) was definitely in play. Bonds probably too.
 
#58
#58
I honestly feel that there are guys from time to time that should get in, stats be damned.
Some guys were just important to baseball overall...period.

Murphy
Mattingly
Thurman Munson
Kenny Lofton
Are a few of my examples.
 
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#59
#59
cobbwebb0710 said:
I honestly feel that there are guys from time to time that should get in, stats be damned.
Some guys were just important to baseball overall...period.

Murphy
Mattingly
Thurman Munson
Kenny Lofton
Are a few of my examples.
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Thurman Munson died. That’s the only thing that kept him out. He should be in.

Mattingly hurt his back. He was on a HOF trajectory without question. But injuries are part of baseball.

Did Murphy get hurt, or did he just fall off? Either way, kinda the same boat as Mattingly. Though I’d argue that Mattingly’s peak was better.
 
#60
#60
85SugarVol said:
Thurman Munson died. That’s the only thing that kept him out. He should be in.

Mattingly hurt his back. He was on a HOF trajectory without question. But injuries are part of baseball.

Did Murphy get hurt, or did he just fall off? Either way, kinda the same boat as Mattingly. Though I’d argue that Mattingly’s peak was better.
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Murphy’s knees got bad and his production fell off in his 30s and he did nothing his last 3 or 4 years. He hit 40+ HRs around age 30 and was a top 5 player. After that, he never got anywhere close to elite numbers again.
 
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