Fulmer's decision

[secking]

THIS, is the measuring stick for Fulmer. Is he too loyal?

Will he fire her or let his friendship get in the way?

I think she lets him off the hook and resigns, if not, he has no choice.

 

[tenecvol4]

First call should be to Becky Hammon. Make her say no.

I've been on the Hammon train a long time-- shes the one coach that can make a dramatic impact immediately-- write the big check and give her free rein-- she may decide its too tough to get HC job in NBA

 

[leejoek]

This is what I alluded to in another thread. I hope I'm wrong.

I do have to be honest. I'm not tore up about losses anymore. The Lady Vols have not been an elite program since Holly took over. I saw the writing on the wall years ago. Yesterday's loss did not bother me. I just think she is a bad coach that needs to be replaced if the program has a chance to be championship caliber again. If they don't then it won't bother me that much. It will send a message that they are ok with the status quo. Expect more results like this year.

GBO

She is a BAD PERSON!

 

[Woodlawn VOL]

Keeping her around at this point really makes things fall apart. It's time for Holly to step down. GBO!

 

[glv98]

Keeping her around at this point really makes things fall apart. It's time for Holly to step down. GBO!

Any future LV game coached by CHW should feature yellow crime tape surrounding the sacred boundaries of the court known as The Summitt. Crimes against the Legacy.

 

[GameTime]

Fulmer has to let her go...Fans and players have had enough.

 

[FrozenLVFan]

It's not about starting a new chapter yet, but closing the Holly chapter. The sooner that's done the better IMO, for all involved. If Fulmer wants/needs to wait a couple of weeks to make the hire, it really isn't a big deal...

I agree that Holly has to go, but kicking her in the ass on her way out the door would be classless. She may have failed as a HC, but she's given her life to the Lady Vols, stood by Pat through her diagnosis and decline, and has her jersey hanging up. Let her "retire," give her a ceremony, and move on.

 

[Coach Jumper]

Keeping her around at this point really makes things fall apart. It's time for Holly to step down. GBO!

The longer she remains quiet and the longer they let this fester,,,the harder it will be for me to fix things when I get there.

But,
if that's part of the challenge,,,bring it on

 

[bobkitten]

don't need one

we need a coach who can manage big name talent

I agree with you on this , Coach. Either that, or quit recruiting the stars who are accustomed to being the princesses of the communities or AAU teams and get some hungry young women of promise in here to teach, guide, and mold. No more autopilot, no more assumptions!

I wonder if even a well CPS would have had some trouble with our players over the last 4 years or so. The thing is, I don’t know if she would have recruited many of them! With some notable exceptions, I think she looked less at how many stars they had, and more at grit, desire, intangibles.

I’d love to hear what those of you with more discernment think.

 

[Model12]

I agree that Holly has to go, but kicking her in the ass on her way out the door would be classless. She may have failed as a HC, but she's given her life to the Lady Vols, stood by Pat through her diagnosis and decline, and has her jersey hanging up. Let her "retire," give her a ceremony, and move on.

I agree 100% in theory, but a development this past weekend made that increasingly more difficult. HW said that she still wanted to coach. That gives Fulmer zero room to maneuver. Any "retirement" at this point is easily seen for what it really is. A firing. No face saving for anyone. I like HW personally, but when I heard that I thought, "Jeez, she screwed that up too."

Unless she positively knows that she is safe, that was a BAD political move. Bad for the school, bad for her legacy. This whole thing is just working out badly all the way around. I couldn't be more jaded at this point.

 

[Coach Jumper]

I agree with you on this , Coach. Either that, or quit recruiting the stars who are accustomed to being the princesses of the communities or AAU teams and get some hungry young women of promise in here to teach, guide, and mold. No more autopilot, no more assumptions!

I wonder if even a well CPS would have had some trouble with our players over the last 4 years or so. The thing is, I don’t know if she would have recruited many of them! With some notable exceptions, I think she looked less at how many stars they had, and more at grit, desire, intangibles.

I’d love to hear what those of you with more discernment think.

Pat didn't have to look at stars
She was an Alpha and her assistant was a Beta
They had all spectrum of athletes covered
Those that needed direction had Pat
Those that needed acknowledgement and encouragement had Holly

My theory
Holly was an assistant to Pat (Alpha) for 30 years,,,this is why there are none on staff.
There's no yen to her yang

Bottom line is ( In nature, or, in human beings) an Alpha will challenge leadership if it isn't as strong as the leadership it thinks it would bring to the mix.
Only Evina has done this
Don't get on Evina for doing what a true leader would do..."put themselves at risk for their team"
As long as she remains humble and does not let this dictate her future, she'll be fine

 

[glv98]

I agree 100% in theory, but a development this past weekend made that increasingly more difficult. HW said that she still wanted to coach. That gives Fulmer zero room to maneuver. Any "retirement" at this point is easily seen for what it really is. A firing. No face saving for anyone. I like HW personally, but when I heard that I thought, Jeez, she screwed that up too."

Unless she positively knows that she is safe, that was a BAD political move. Bad for the school, bad for her legacy. This whole thing is just working out badly all the way around. I couldn't be more jaded at this point.

Exactly. Because we deserve more mess and pain apparently? Took a turn down Ugly St. the minute she said that. I swear I thought she got the picture weeks ago, about the time of the Vandy home loss, and would go away quietly. But no. The human capability for delusional denial is stronger than I thought.

I so hoped it wouldn't end this way and I'd never want to kick her in the arse on the way out the door. Unless that's the only way to get her out of it.

 

[Tennesseefan2019]

Exactly. Because we deserve more mess and pain apparently? Took a turn down Ugly St. the minute she said that. I swear I though she got the picture weeks ago, about the time of the Vandy home loss, and would go away quietly. But no. The human capability for delusional denial is stronger than I thought.

I so hoped it wouldn't end this way and I'd never want to kick her in the arse on the way out the door. Unless that's the only way to get her out of it.

Holly Warlick is one of those self-absorbed delusional people you have to shove vigorously out the door

 

[glv98]

Holly Warlick is one of those self-absorbed delusional people you have to shove vigorously out the door

So unfortunate, harmful to everyone, her, players, program, even the University. Hey World, did you know Big Orange Nation goes totally nutso every time an athletic coach position is restaffed? Only this time, I think most of the damage is done to Holly herself, not the fans, because she has made such a strong public case that she's really not any good at her job.

 

[lvocd]

HW said that she still wanted to coach. That gives Fulmer zero room to maneuver.

I scared my dogs screaming so loudly when I heard her say that. I'd suspected for a while that she was deluded, and recently have wondered if she's really as selfish as she is coming off lately. So when I heard her say that, all I could think of was, "Seriously? You even screwed THIS up???!!!! You are the WORST!!!!!"

 

[Advol]

I agree that Holly has to go, but kicking her in the ass on her way out the door would be classless. She may have failed as a HC, but she's given her life to the Lady Vols, stood by Pat through her diagnosis and decline, and has her jersey hanging up. Let her "retire," give her a ceremony, and move on.[/QUOTE ]

You have NO idea what you are saying. Holly was practically never with CPS during her illness. She practically was staying away on purpose. And given her life.....give me a break....that is the same crap we hear about Filmer.....both of them have large homes and are sit for life. They are being paid for a job and did it VERY poorly and should be gone. And wouldnt you love to have those parting gifts??

 

[BruceInLouisville]

If ADPF has any sense of timing, he will hold off until after the men's run in the tourney has finished. There is no reason to do it before then; stomping on your own PR would be a bad move.

And, again, if he is doing his job, he already has his list ready, and has begun making inquiries behind the scenes. (He should have already learned about each candidate months ago.)

I am ready to watch the men get to the Final Four, and also ready to see what happens with the Lady Vols. But in the proper order.

 

[gule]

why wait one minute more? git er done, philbert!

 

[Coach Jumper]

If ADPF has any sense of timing, he will hold off until after the men's run in the tourney has finished. There is no reason to do it before then; stomping on your own PR would be a bad move.

And, again, if he is doing his job, he already has his list ready, and has begun making inquiries behind the scenes. (He should have already learned about each candidate months ago.)

I am ready to watch the men get to the Final Four, and also ready to see what happens with the Lady Vols. But in the proper order.

Proper?
both ongoing events are equally impactful to each entity

The longer we remain silent on the women's side decisions,,, the more internal damage is done

Surely both things can be handled simultaneously
A decision like this one has to be made before emotion can influence the outcome

 

[ocoandasoc]

In lieu of a buyout, Holly could be given another job with the University and take a big cut in pay. But it would help her save face, the dollars would balance out by the time she retired. Give her that option if she wants, and take a few days to work out the details before announcing to the press. Her other option would be an unceremonious firing and a check for about $700K. ("Thanks for everything, Holly, there's the door.") A third option would be a straight retirement, but I don't see that in anyone's interest unless a deal is made reducing the buyout.

Don't lose sight of the fact that when you move Holly out, you also move her staff out. If you bring in a new, experienced, high-power coach (and that's what everyone wants) that new coach will want to clean house and bring in his/her own staff and they will probably make that part of their deal. (Forcing a new coach to retain existing staff would be a huge mistake!)

Westbrook will undoubtedly test the transfer waters. She can wait to see what Fulmer does before she pulls the trigger. If there's no change, she can transfer and sit out a year. If a new coach is hired she can meet with him/her and then decide. If she transfers at that point it would be easier to get a waiver to play for another school right away because of the coaching change. The same goes for the other players. New recruits, of course, would also have options. But none of this is a good reason not to make a coaching change.

Everything can be in the works long before any announcement. But if there's no announcement by mid April then there isn't going to be one.

 

[Nute Gunray]

If he encourages her to retire now or fired her, then the fans will want interviews started the following day & an announcement the next day
That can’t happen while teams are still playing in tourney. What if Fulmer wants to hire assistant from UConn and has to wait for interview. The natives will be restless from waiting 3 weeks for a hire
Wait to fire her until the tourney is over

Please, no unproven assistants or associates from UCONN or any other school. Potentially, this is CHW all over again.

 

[glv98]

Everything can be in the works long before any announcement. But if there's no announcement by mid April then there isn't going to be one

Agree. Doomsday clock set for April 15, already a bad day. I'm pretty sure the AD will use the men's tourney, as if anyone there would be the slightest bit concerned, to delay a Holly anouncement. But if we don't hear something right after that, it gets really, really scary. Surely now that local media is finally woke to the Holly drama they'll ask the question. Won't they?

 

[Amb3096]

In lieu of a buyout, Holly could be given another job with the University and take a big cut in pay. But it would help her save face, the dollars would balance out by the time she retired. Give her that option if she wants, and take a few days to work out the details before announcing to the press. Her other option would be an unceremonious firing and a check for about $700K. ("Thanks for everything, Holly, there's the door.") A third option would be a straight retirement, but I don't see that in anyone's interest unless a deal is made reducing the buyout.

Don't lose sight of the fact that when you move Holly out, you also move her staff out. If you bring in a new, experienced, high-power coach (and that's what everyone wants) that new coach will want to clean house and bring in his/her own staff and they will probably make that part of their deal. (Forcing a new coach to retain existing staff would be a huge mistake!)

Westbrook will undoubtedly test the transfer waters. She can wait to see what Fulmer does before she pulls the trigger. If there's no change, she can transfer and sit out a year. If a new coach is hired she can meet with him/her and then decide. If she transfers at that point it would be easier to get a waiver to play for another school right away because of the coaching change. The same goes for the other players. New recruits, of course, would also have options. But none of this is a good reason not to make a coaching change.

Everything can be in the works long before any announcement. But if there's no announcement by mid April then there isn't going to be one.

I won't be sorry to see anyone from this coaching staff go. They are stale. Sure, Sharrona did a nice job recruiting. I'm sure that's made harder by the fact that she had to convince players to come to UT in spite of Holly. It's unfortunate for her, but losing her is the price one pays for finally getting rid of Holly. The Tennessee Lady Vol brand isn't completely dead (Holly gave it her best shot), so I think they will be able to continue with the recruiting success if they get a real coach.

 

[gule]

Bring home Jolly if she'll come, keep Reaves if she'll stay and hire coach J for his alpha dog style! bless his little heart!

 

[Nute Gunray]

I agree that Holly has to go, but kicking her in the ass on her way out the door would be classless. She may have failed as a HC, but she's given her life to the Lady Vols, stood by Pat through her diagnosis and decline, and has her jersey hanging up. Let her "retire," give her a ceremony, and move on.

I agree with your comments. However, I wish Holly would have concern for kicking Pat Summitt's legacy in the a**.