Further Nil Chaos??

[WoodsmanVol]

I'm in favor of players getting their rightful share of the money pie. But now, I wonder where this is all going to end up being.
NLRB claim to argue USC athletes are employees

 

[Manchester Vol]

Without TV contract money none of the schools would be breaking even. The coaches wouldn’t be making millions every year either. Pay every last one of these kids on the field and practicing a salary.

If the University of Tennessee football team were pro what would it be worth? $500 million $2 billion?

Like everything else in life there needs to be rules. There aren’t many yet unless NCAA gets their crap together Congress will.

 

[0nelilreb]

Without TV contract money none of the schools would be breaking even. The coaches wouldn’t be making millions every year either. Pay every last one of these kids on the field and practicing a salary.

If the University of Tennessee football team were pro what would it be worth? $500 million $2 billion?

Like everything else in life there needs to be rules. There aren’t many yet unless NCAA gets their crap together Congress will.

There’s an old saying , be careful what you wish for .. being an employee of the school would be a lot different than having and enjoying a great NIL package with a ton of wiggle room .

 

[Mightyvol]

The NCAA is powerless to govern this. They will lose every court case. Whatever governing body emerges will need antitrust protection. A players union isn’t far behind imho. College football, as we knew it is gone.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Without TV contract money none of the schools would be breaking even. The coaches wouldn’t be making millions every year either. Pay every last one of these kids on the field and practicing a salary.

If the University of Tennessee football team were pro what would it be worth? $500 million $2 billion?

Like everything else in life there needs to be rules. There aren’t many yet unless NCAA gets their crap together Congress will.

If the football and basketball team members are employees of the school with salaries, why aren't the tennis, baseball, track, swimming, etc etc team members also employees of school with salaries?

You see where this gets EXTREMELY expensive for the schools very quickly.

You'll find it very difficult to argue a difference between the effort one college sport athlete puts in vs another college sport athlete as far as being an employee of the school.

It gets messy very very fast for the schools.

 

[GreveHaller]

salary caps for colleges in 3....2....1....

 

[rev_911]

If the football and basketball team members are employees of the school with salaries, why aren't the tennis, baseball, track, swimming, etc etc team members also employees of school with salaries?

You see where this gets EXTREMELY expensive for the schools very quickly.

You'll find it very difficult to argue a difference between the effort one college sport athlete puts in vs another college sport athlete as far as being an employee of the school.

It gets messy very very fast for the schools.

Make them all employees but offer no scholarship. They can use that salary to pay for the education. Seems to be where it is heading anyways.

 

[Manchester Vol]

Pay them all based on revenue per sport.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Make them all employees but offer no scholarship. They can use that salary to pay for the education. Seems to be where it is heading anyways.

There is ZERO, less than zero, chance the schools can force an employee to attend school. ZERO.

The athletes, all the the athletes employed by the school, will be unionized and seeking a nice piece of the TV revenue pie. It'll be a pro league, run by the schools, but the "student athlete" BS disappears when they become employees.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Make them all employees but offer no scholarship. They can use that salary to pay for the education. Seems to be where it is heading anyways.

Even companies like chic-fil-A or McDs pay kids to work and provide education benefits. If you think the players union won't negotiate that in when their employers are schools, I don't know what to tell you.

But if a kid doesn't want to attend the school, you can't hire them to be an athlete then insist they get an education in something unrelated to what you hired them for.

Can your employer make you go to school to learn something entirely unrelated to what they hired you for? Unless UT wants to fold the Manning Academy into the university, there will no such thing as a "student athlete" requirement.

 

[eaglevol]

So, if they become employees, does all the NIL money and possibly benefits (scholarships) become taxable income?

 

[peaygolf]

Posted this in RF…..

 

[rev_911]

Even companies like chic-fil-A or McDs pay kids to work and provide education benefits. If you think the players union won't negotiate that in when their employers are schools, I don't know what to tell you.

But if a kid doesn't want to attend the school, you can't hire them to be an athlete then insist they get an education in something unrelated to what you hired them for.

Can your employer make you go to school to learn something entirely unrelated to what they hired you for? Unless UT wants to fold the Manning Academy into the university, there will no such thing as a "student athlete" requirement.

You are looking at this from an education/school standpoint. If they are being forced to treat them as employees.... that is what they are. Sure chic-fil-A or McDs offers some education benefits. What about the 1000s of jobs that don't? The assistance, in most cases, doesn't cover the full cost of tuition / related expenses. As you said.... this is super messy and no one has the right answer. I agree a player's union would try to force that.

On a completely different note, most of these players don't realize they have to pay taxes on the NIL money.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

You are looking at this from an education/school standpoint. If they are being forced to treat them as employees.... that is what they are. Sure chic-fil-A or McDs offers some education benefits. What about the 1000s of jobs that don't? The assistance, in most cases, doesn't cover the full cost of tuition / related expenses. As you said.... this is super messy and no one has the right answer. I agree a player's union would try to force that.

On a completely different note, most of these players don't realize they have to pay taxes on the NIL money.

If the players attend NIL seminars offered by the schools, they know exactly the potential tax issues and how to structure it so they're minimized. There's already an industry for pro athletes of wealth management professionals.

That's such a weak "problem" that "If they make money they'll have to pay taxes." So do you and if you make enough, you have someone helping you keep your taxes as low as possible. These players have the advantage of the schools actually being able and encouraged by the NCAA make them aware of "money problems." Sheesh......

As for education, the players that are NFL prospects can either attend school after their career or take a few classes in the "off season" or whatever they want. In the scheme of what they'll make as pros, getting and paying for an education is the least of their worries. I suspect the union will want to "take care of their brothers" with education benefits because many will never see the NFL.

 

[rev_911]

If the players attend NIL seminars offered by the schools, they know exactly the potential tax issues and how to structure it so they're minimized. There's already an industry for pro athletes of wealth management professionals.

That's such a weak "problem" that "If they make money they'll have to pay taxes." So do you and if you make enough, you have someone helping you keep your taxes as low as possible. These players have the advantage of the schools actually being able and encouraged by the NCAA make them aware of "money problems." Sheesh......

As for education, the players that are NFL prospects can either attend school after their career or take a few classes in the "off season" or whatever they want. In the scheme of what they'll make as pros, getting and paying for an education is the least of their worries. I suspect the union will want to "take care of their brothers" with education benefits because many will never see the NFL.

I work at an accounting firm that serves four of these athletes. I agree that they have help "normal" people don't have. All four had no clue they'd owe taxes on the money (and the level of the taxes). This is after the NIL deal was signed. Most are all 18-year-old athletes that have never worked before or had that much money. Lots of people are there to take advantage of the situation.

You and I don't agree on everything, but everyone agrees this is messy. College football is going to be different. Worse? Who knows. I enjoy Tennessee football and don't care much for the NFL anymore. I hope college football keeps the same passion.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I work at an accounting firm that serves four of these athletes. I agree that they have help "normal" people don't have. All four had no clue they'd owe taxes on the money (and the level of the taxes). This is after the NIL deal was signed. Most are all 18-year-old athletes that have never worked before or had that much money. Lots of people are there to take advantage of the situation.

You and I don't agree on everything, but everyone agrees this is messy. College football is going to be different. Worse? Who knows. I enjoy Tennessee football and don't care much for the NFL anymore. I hope college football keeps the same passion.

Unfortunately, after the Supreme Court Alstom decision went down so hard and NIL happened, I can't see an endgame that doesn't involve the athletes being called professionals. I didn't expect the NLRB to be this fast in starting the process.

Don't mistake me for a fan of all this. I'm not. What's made this happen is people in the NCAA insisting "it can't happen" and doing nothing. I don't like it but we're halfway down the slope and if I could suggest something to stop the slide, I would.

I believe that schools will have no choice but to get out of the pro sports business and that's unbelievably sad and bad for lots of kids who really enjoyed and benefitted from college football and basketball without any shot at a pro career.

I blame all of the this on the schools and the NCAA because they should've seen this coming and tried to find a solution. The current players just came along and this was what they were dealt.

 

[rev_911]

Unfortunately, after the Supreme Court Alstom decision went down so hard and NIL happened, I can't see an endgame that doesn't involve the athletes being called professionals. I didn't expect the NLRB to be this fast in starting the process.

Don't mistake me for a fan of all this. I'm not. What's made this happen is people in the NCAA insisting "it can't happen" and doing nothing. I don't like it but we're halfway down the slope and if I could suggest something to stop the slide, I would.

I believe that schools will have no choice but to get out of the pro sports business and that's unbelievably sad and bad for lots of kids who really enjoyed and benefitted from college football and basketball without any shot at a pro career.

I blame all of the this on the schools and the NCAA because they should've seen this coming and tried to find a solution. The current players just came along and this was what they were dealt.

Agreed on all points.

 

[stolitonic]

There’s an old saying , be careful what you wish for .. being an employee of the school would be a lot different than having and enjoying a great NIL package with a ton of wiggle room .

Yup. Employees are expected to produce returns. Employee is not pulling their weight, they quickly become an ex employee.

Add in all those other fun rules about behavior, drug testing, and all kinds of other things.

Situation is going to get messy as hell.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Yup. Employees are expected to produce returns. Employee is not pulling their weight, they quickly become an ex employee.

Add in all those other fun rules about behavior, drug testing, and all kinds of other things.

Situation is going to get messy as hell.

Imagine the interesting, surreal twists of "college" being declared "pro." Along with the schools/NCAA having no ability to make their employees attend school, it follows that "eligibility" related to school disappears.

UT could conceivably hire Josh Dobbs to play QB. Guys who can't make the NFL, regardless of age, might be playing on "college" teams. As an example, the G League has guys in their 30s right beside guys that are teenagers.

It's going to be just bizarre.

 

[95 Vol Alum]

So, if they become employees, does all the NIL money and possibly benefits (scholarships) become taxable income?

NIL $$ is tax exempt?

 

[eaglevol]

NIL $$ is tax exempt?

I don't know if it is or is not. I haven't read anything about it being taxed. I'm hoping someone with more knowledge of it can answer these questions.

 

[95 Vol Alum]

I don't know if it is or is not. I haven't read anything about it being taxed. I'm hoping someone with more knowledge of it can answer these questions.

It’s taxed already. There’s no basis for exemption.

 

[hog88]

NIL $$ is tax exempt?

No

 

[tennrich1]

If the players attend NIL seminars offered by the schools, they know exactly the potential tax issues and how to structure it so they're minimized. There's already an industry for pro athletes of wealth management professionals.

That's such a weak "problem" that "If they make money they'll have to pay taxes." So do you and if you make enough, you have someone helping you keep your taxes as low as possible. These players have the advantage of the schools actually being able and encouraged by the NCAA make them aware of "money problems." Sheesh......

As for education, the players that are NFL prospects can either attend school after their career or take a few classes in the "off season" or whatever they want. In the scheme of what they'll make as pros, getting and paying for an education is the least of their worries. I suspect the union will want to "take care of their brothers" with education benefits because many will never see the NFL.

On the last statement…I’d change the word “many” to “most”.

 

[number1volfanfrom76]

What hasn"t been mentioned is now there are lawyers involved with these NIL deals. Have no problem players getting $, but with it come the slime baggers wanting their share too and more $ will drive the $ even higher. So you think ticket prices are high now...