'24 GA WR Mike Matthews (Tennessee)

[Ericvol2096]

And yet, some of y’all act like these rsnkings are scientific analyses.



They’re just clickbait created by website nerds. The sooner y’all get that, the less ignorant you’ll be.

Best thing said on these boards in a while. So true and I needed that reminder.

 

[thunder5]

I looked into this a little more...247's approach to 5* status is to mimic the NFL draft...there are 32 1st round picks in a given draft so 247 only awards 32 5*'s per class...that's their logic essentially for dropping Matthews...it's not that they think he's not a 5* talent they are literally just making the numbers work for their idiotic rule...to me this just further invalidates their star system....dropping 8 or more players that you truly believe have 5* talent just to make a silly rule work is ridiculous IMO

 

[ConwayFitty]

Florida is my number one. I just truly hate them and their fans. F the whole STATE of Florida...

ehhh...the Keys are nice, but I don't really count them as Florida

 

[overseasorange2]

I looked into this a little more...247's approach to 5* status is to mimic the NFL draft...there are 32 1st round picks in a given draft so 247 only awards 32 5*'s per class...that's their logic essentially for dropping Matthews...it's not that they think he's not a 5* talent they are literally just making the numbers work for their idiotic rule...to me this just further invalidates their star system....dropping 8 or more players that you truly believe have 5* talent just to make a silly rule work is ridiculous IMO

This says it all about Matthews, and has TN as most exciting team: Program with the most to be excited about: Tennessee

Nough said!!!!

Final superlatives from the 2024 Polynesian Bowl

 

[rgvol]

I looked into this a little more...247's approach to 5* status is to mimic the NFL draft...there are 32 1st round picks in a given draft so 247 only awards 32 5*'s per class...that's their logic essentially for dropping Matthews...it's not that they think he's not a 5* talent they are literally just making the numbers work for their idiotic rule...to me this just further invalidates their star system....dropping 8 or more players that you truly believe have 5* talent just to make a silly rule work is ridiculous IMO

All I know is GMac junior hudl is one of the best I ever seen. Including Nico as a junior. Arm talent and very athletic. All the way.... sorry wrong thread I better get back to work.

 

[overseasorange2]

And yet they just dropped him 7 spots in the final 5* release and basically said he wasn't a big play WR like other 5* WR's on their list

Doesn't make sense!

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

So a JJ, Jalen and Tillman combination?

I may be overplaying the impact of that combination of skills, but I still have confidence that in the RB room Seldon has a chance to be special too. Hope he learned not to dance on 3rd and 4th and short situations in the bowl game. The rest looked really good. Not BO or Hershel good, but good. Hoping for Jay Graham type production, and of course hope for better.

Throw in a High level game changing wideout to Nico’s arsenal and wow. That is my old man’s dream and I am sticking to it.

The total roster trending up is of course key and trends are currently pretty good. I believe what we are gaining far exceeds what we lost, especially in the portal. Not a potential cull in the bunch, all UPWARDLY mobile.

 

[LittleVol]

I may be overplaying the impact of that combination of skills, but I still have confidence that in the RB room Seldon has a chance to be special too. Hope he learned not to dance on 3rd and 4th and short situations in the bowl game. The rest looked really good. Not BO or Hershel good, but good. Hoping for Jay Graham type production, and of course hope for better.

Throw in a High level game changing wideout to Nico’s arsenal and wow. That is my old man’s dream and I am sticking to it.

The total roster trending up is of course key and trends are currently pretty good. I believe what we are gaining far exceeds what we lost, especially in the portal. Not a potential cull in the bunch, all UPWARDLY mobile.

roster is getting better every year under Heupel.

Lets not forget Sampson tho. Heś got 2 years left, and finished that bowl game with 133 yards against that tough Iowa defense. Iḿ expecting a 1000 yard season for him in 2024

Seldon needs to run with better pad level. He showed great patience though, and we all know he has a special gear when he hits daylight.

Then thereś Keith and Lewis. Seldon just needs to learn to run lower, and the rest will come. He will never get worn down because we have so many good RBs.

 

[#Vol4Life1991]

I looked into this a little more...247's approach to 5* status is to mimic the NFL draft...there are 32 1st round picks in a given draft so 247 only awards 32 5*'s per class...that's their logic essentially for dropping Matthews...it's not that they think he's not a 5* talent they are literally just making the numbers work for their idiotic rule...to me this just further invalidates their star system....dropping 8 or more players that you truly believe have 5* talent just to make a silly rule work is ridiculous IMO

It’s ridiculous and a flawed system b/c every class doesnt have the same amount of quality players year in, year out. Some years there may be 40 legit 5 star prospects and some years may have 15. And for them to project high schoolers as potential nfl draft picks is ludicrous as well . Nfl scouts and GM’s have a hard enough time, and that’s after their college careers are completed.

 

[LittleVol]

It’s ridiculous and a flawed system b/c every class doesnt have the same amount of quality players year in, year out. Some years there may be 40 legit 5 star prospects and some years may have 15. And for them to project high schoolers as potential nfl draft picks is ludicrous as well . Nfl scouts and GM’s have a hard enough time, and that’s after their college careers are completed.

Also one more point to validate what you're saying.

NFL draft picks are based off need more so than pure talent.

We've all seen 60th ranked overall prospects go in the 1st round because they play QB.

But the recruiting sites are doing their best.
@allvolrecruiting can explain that better.
There's simply too many players to scout with just their network.

 

[sjt18]

I looked into this a little more...247's approach to 5* status is to mimic the NFL draft...there are 32 1st round picks in a given draft so 247 only awards 32 5*'s per class...that's their logic essentially for dropping Matthews...it's not that they think he's not a 5* talent they are literally just making the numbers work for their idiotic rule...to me this just further invalidates their star system....dropping 8 or more players that you truly believe have 5* talent just to make a silly rule work is ridiculous IMO

I've argued this for a while. It is a way for them to "look" more accurate than they are. As you suggest, if they were truly accurate then there might be 50 5* guys one year and only 20 the next. Same for 4*.

 

[sjt18]

Also one more point to validate what you're saying.

NFL draft picks are based off need more so than pure talent.

We've all seen 60th ranked overall prospects go in the 1st round because they play QB.

But the recruiting sites are doing their best.
@allvolrecruiting can explain that better.
There's simply too many players to scout with just their network.

That's not their objective. Their objective is to make money. Somewhere at On3 and 247 there are guys tickled to death that Vol fans are clicking articles and talking about getting screwed. The sites get more traffic and get paid more both ways.

There are people here so vested in these rankings that they truly believe the sites exist to accurately rank HS football players. It would take far, far more resources and expertise than they have to do that... but it isn't their goal anyway. Like any other business, their goal is to make money.

 

[LittleVol]

That's not their objective. Their objective is to make money. Somewhere at On3 and 247 there are guys tickled to death that Vol fans are clicking articles and talking about getting screwed. The sites get more traffic and get paid more both ways.

There are people here so vested in these rankings that they truly believe the sites exist to accurately rank HS football players. It would take far, far more resources and expertise than they have to do that... but it isn't their goal anyway. Like any other business, their goal is to make money.

I agree, but I would also say one needs the other.

I mean they do have their own camps as well.
So they need to be more right than wrong is where am I getting at.

Or else they won't make as much money.

Of course all the major programs have done all the scouting for them, they just tie a cute star ranking to them.

 

[NighthawkVol]

I agree, but I would also say one needs the other.

I mean they do have their own camps as well.
So they need to be more right than wrong is where am I getting at.

Or else they won't make as much money.

Of course all the major programs have done all the scouting for them, they just tie a cute star ranking to them.

There’s also this other little “cheat” they have…They re-rank everyone at the end. That way, they can see who signed with Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, etc. and move those guys higher (if they haven’t done so already). Then, when those schools inevitably turn out more draft picks (because they always do), the recruiting sites can reap the results and say, “see look, a higher % of our 5 stars got drafted…”

But if they were actually as good at evaluating as the sheep think, they wouldn’t have to re-rank at the end. They’d be able to tell RIGHT NOW who the top players in the 2025 class are and the rankings of those guys would look the same now as it will in February of 2025. But it won’t. It’ll look vastly different. Because they’re just following the offers/signings to make their hit rate look good.

A 2025 recruit being a 3* right now means nothing in terms of what his final ranking will be. That’s because the website nerds haven’t had a chance to play follow the leader yet.

 

[butchna]

And yet, some of y’all act like these rsnkings are scientific analyses.



They’re just clickbait created by website nerds. The sooner y’all get that, the less ignorant you’ll be.

“Let us watch you kiss a girl and you’ll get a fifth star.”

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

I agree, but I would also say one needs the other.

I mean they do have their own camps as well.
So they need to be more right than wrong is where am I getting at.

Or else they won't make as much money.

Of course all the major programs have done all the scouting for them, they just tie a cute star ranking to them.

It has long been my position that they all have a really tough task. I believe they rank them as they see them, and of course the early bloomers, especially those that play in bigger and better programs get to show more. Guys from smaller schools are seen and it is harder to judge their comparative skill sets. Even then they are ranking based on current capability and cannot factor in where these guys are in their growth and maturation cycle. It is easy to rank the early arrivals, impossible to deal with late bloomers. I think too many folks believe stars indicate a players ceiling not their FUTURE probability of success.

P5 staffs get to use their evaluation skills on much smaller subsets than the services and since they are investing their most limited resources, schollies, and their decisions are more career limiting I will go with them. They also get to BETTER assess the character and gamer capabilities face to face that you can't see from the stands or on film of games, camps and 7v7 competitions. Any player our staff keeps on the weekly call log, and gets official visit offer, throughout their SR year I am good with regardless of star level. Some no-brainers are probably just tactical efforts, not seriously in our short straws, but the rest are in play. You win some you lose some.

The end of the talent analysis cycle is draft day, and the number of 4 stars that get passed by the 3 stars for those 300 or so spots is not inspiring me to supply them clicks or dollars. I only get their info 2nd hand info on these free boards. I am more interested in their collection of 40 times, offers, visits and even their CB's, not their rankings. Highlights are nice too.

 

[miket4god]

It’s ridiculous and a flawed system b/c every class doesnt have the same amount of quality players year in, year out. Some years there may be 40 legit 5 star prospects and some years may have 15. And for them to project high schoolers as potential nfl draft picks is ludicrous as well . Nfl scouts and GM’s have a hard enough time, and that’s after their college careers are completed.

While that is true, the system they are copying is just as flawed.
Sometimes there are way more than 32 players that belong in the first round of the NFL draft and sometimes you go how the heck is that guy drafted in the first round.
Same with the 5* system.

 

[sjt18]

I agree, but I would also say one needs the other.

I mean they do have their own camps as well.
So they need to be more right than wrong is where am I getting at.

Or else they won't make as much money.

Of course all the major programs have done all the scouting for them, they just tie a cute star ranking to them.

Absolutely.

The caveat to that on accuracy is that they have to "look" accurate whether they really are or not. I believe that's why they artificially limit the number of 4/5* grades they hand out. If someone handed you a box of 5,000 rubber balls distributed on a bell curve from 3/4" to 1 1/4" in diameter and said sort out all of the ones over 1" using only your eyes that would be a fairly difficult task. You would like struggle a lot when the difference became small. Some would be pretty obvious (5*/2*). Many would be just subjective judgment or depend on the angle of the light.

But if they came back and said, "Just try to give us the 500 largest ones" then your "accuracy" would likely go up. You would leave out a lot of bearings that should have been included but your chance of finding 500 that were part of the top 50% would go up significantly. FWIW, the recruiting sites aren't even that good. Using the NFL draft as the ultimate measuring stick, about 70% of the ones they think are can't miss... are misses. Only about 20% of 4* get drafted. In every year I've seen, more 3* and under guys get drafted than 4/5* combined.

The goal is appearance of accuracy since that sells subscriptions and gets clicks.

The recruiting sites hedge their "bet" when they limit the number of 4/5* players to around 450. IIRC, there are 10's of thousands of kids that play HSFB. I believe the recruiting sites generally rate 2,000-3,000 or so. They don't really even consider the rest which sometimes produces some great talents. But using a statistical trick... they've made themselves look a lot more accurate than they actually are or have the resources to be.

Your last statement is absolutely true in two respects. One, they take cues from the most proven recruiters and programs. Two... they often give a plus or minus to a player based on how a fanbase will react... what will make more people subscribe or click on posts is their calculation.


It is business and smart. I'll use a different real world example. You put gasoline in your car and if you have watched commercials over your lifetime then you think they do everything they can to sell you pure gasoline. They don't. All gasoline has water in it.... and if you can include process water right up to the spec limit then you can sell millions of gallons of water as gasoline. Otherwise, that water has to be treated and cleaned before release into the environment. Point being... there is a point where the cost of improving quality doesn't make financial sense. Apparently for the recruiting sites that is grading a C (70%) when selecting the cream of the cream in each recruiting class.

 

[walkenvol]

You guys that keep polluting recruit’s threads with the beaten to death generic recruiting rankings discussion just suck. How you continue to debate the same crap over and over and over is stupid enough, but posting it in every other thread on the recruiting forum is insane. Quit being idiots and take that discussion to the correct thread so the rest of us who are sick and tired of this drivel can know to avoid it.

 

[VOLINVONORE]

I looked into this a little more...247's approach to 5* status is to mimic the NFL draft...there are 32 1st round picks in a given draft so 247 only awards 32 5*'s per class...that's their logic essentially for dropping Matthews...it's not that they think he's not a 5* talent they are literally just making the numbers work for their idiotic rule...to me this just further invalidates their star system....dropping 8 or more players that you truly believe have 5* talent just to make a silly rule work is ridiculous IMO

All of this stuff just validates that star rankings are just a way to sell recruiting information to the vulnerable public. the real test is when the players line up against each other and there best man wins. I will take Matthews over any other WR in the class and win money in the competition.

 

[sjt18]

While that is true, the system they are copying is just as flawed.
Sometimes there are way more than 32 players that belong in the first round of the NFL draft and sometimes you go how the heck is that guy drafted in the first round.
Same with the 5* system.

Somewhat true with one major difference. The recruiting site ONLY face accountability if fans stop clicking. Fans have amazingly short memories about the inaccuracy of the recruiting sites. The 2015 UT recruiting class according to 247 was elite. It ranked 3rd and had 4 surefire 5* players. Except Kahlil MacKenzie, Kyle Phillips, and Preston Williams never performed like 5* players. The 4* in that class included Quart'e Sapp, Dormady, and Drew Richmond. You can go through most of UT's classes and particular from those years and see a bunch of 4* and some 5* guys who weren't just overrated... they were busts.

But... who remembers that when they get all jacked up over a current 4/5* recruit or another guy being taken by the staff as a lowly 3*? There's no real cost to the recruiting sites for being wrong and sometimes wrong in big ways.

NFL GMs take chances and sometimes miss. But they do so knowing that they can lose their job over it. Fans are keenly aware of who a team takes, when they take them, and how much they have to pay them. GMs are public figures. Whoever ranks recruits is not. GMs can see their careers end quickly if they're wrong. The "analysts" for the recruiting sites don't.

 

[sjt18]

It has long been my position that they all have a really tough task. I believe they rank them as they see them, and of course the early bloomers, especially those that play in bigger and better programs get to show more. Guys from smaller schools are seen and it is harder to judge their comparative skill sets. Even then they are ranking based on current capability and cannot factor in where these guys are in their growth and maturation cycle. It is easy to rank the early arrivals, impossible to deal with late bloomers. I think too many folks believe stars indicate a players ceiling not their FUTURE probability of success.

P5 staffs get to use their evaluation skills on much smaller subsets than the services and since they are investing their most limited resources, schollies, and their decisions are more career limiting I will go with them. They also get to BETTER assess the character and gamer capabilities face to face that you can't see from the stands or on film of games, camps and 7v7 competitions. Any player our staff keeps on the weekly call log, and gets official visit offer, throughout their SR year I am good with regardless of star level. Some no-brainers are probably just tactical efforts, not seriously in our short straws, but the rest are in play. You win some you lose some.

The end of the talent analysis cycle is draft day, and the number of 4 stars that get passed by the 3 stars for those 300 or so spots is not inspiring me to supply them clicks or dollars. I only get their info 2nd hand info on these free boards. I am more interested in their collection of 40 times, offers, visits and even their CB's, not their rankings. Highlights are nice too.

It isn't a tough task primarily because they don't have to be extremely accurate and have no real accountability. It is "work" and they get paid for it. The "beat" guys like AP put in significant work. But those making the actual evaluations... I'm not so sure. They have a method and that method produces a product that fans are willing to buy. I imagine there's a level of accuracy that would cost them.... but they've learned that most fans forget their inaccuracy quickly.

 

[tn4elvis]

It isn't a tough task primarily because they don't have to be extremely accurate and have no real accountability. It is "work" and they get paid for it. The "beat" guys like AP put in significant work. But those making the actual evaluations... I'm not so sure. They have a method and that method produces a product that fans are willing to buy. I imagine there's a level of accuracy that would cost them.... but they've learned that most fans forget their inaccuracy quickly.

They basically have never played football beyond high school level and just do whatever they want for attention and clicks. They are no more knowledgeable than you or I.

 

[LouderVol]

It isn't a tough task primarily because they don't have to be extremely accurate and have no real accountability. It is "work" and they get paid for it. The "beat" guys like AP put in significant work. But those making the actual evaluations... I'm not so sure. They have a method and that method produces a product that fans are willing to buy. I imagine there's a level of accuracy that would cost them.... but they've learned that most fans forget their inaccuracy quickly.

the inaccuracy is also driving sales too. maybe not with subs, but with clicks. if they are inaccurate people are going to comment and argue. people are going to be using the recruiting services to prop up their argument, either for or against the recruiting service. but as long as they are clicking on their stories or visiting the website the service is generating money even being wrong. maybe especially being wrong.

 

[sjt18]

the inaccuracy is also driving sales too. maybe not with subs, but with clicks. if they are inaccurate people are going to comment and argue. people are going to be using the recruiting services to prop up their argument, either for or against the recruiting service. but as long as they are clicking on their stories or visiting the website the service is generating money even being wrong. maybe especially being wrong.

Pretty brilliant. They are trading on the passion of CFB fans