Game Thread: Carson Newman v Lady Vols, Thurs Oct 31; Home-FCC; 6:30PM; SEC+ network....Win Lv's 135-49

[Rooster1]

they had plenty of desert too
S Dak St
Morgan ST
Presbyterian
Bowling Green
E Car St

Yum yum
Grantedm they did play some ranked teams too

ND, MD, Utah, Duke, UNC and UConn OOC. And SDAkSt is a perennial tourney team.

 

[Vols2015]

After seeing the stats and performance against CN, so much upside for the Lady Vols. The one thing I would like to see, and perhaps was outshined by the 3 ball against CN, some set plays for our bigs down low. Would like to see Hollingshead and Spearman have some opportunities to help if the 3 ball isn’t working.

 

[KnoxLikeUs]

Samara Spencer should be receiving far more recognition than she has this offseason since transferring to Tennessee.
There is no true reason for the lack of recognition and once the season starts Tuesday a lot of sports analysts that overlooked Spencer will be proven wrong.

 

[BruisedOrange]

Samara Spencer should be receiving far more recognition than she has this offseason since transferring to Tennessee.
There is no true reason for the lack of recognition and once the season starts Tuesday a lot of sports analysts that overlooked Spencer will be proven wrong.

The spotlight shines brightest for those who are in the dark. Stats for our players are going to be buried in our own stat sheet because of how many minutes so many are playing.

For that reason, the Lady Vols PR office needs to adjust to this on-court scheme and promote stats per minute rather than for the game in their press releases.

 

[BruisedOrange]

After seeing the stats and performance against CN, so much upside for the Lady Vols. The one thing I would like to see, and perhaps was outshined by the 3 ball against CN, some set plays for our bigs down low. Would like to see Hollingshead and Spearman have some opportunities to help if the 3 ball isn’t working.

Intuition makes me think there are stats that show that a greater percentage of offensive rebounds and second-chance points come off of 3-point shots than off of shots in the lane.

Maybe some stat-rat can prove that speculation right or wrong.

 

[KnoxLikeUs]

The spotlight shines brightest for those who are in the dark. Stats for our players are going to be buried in our own stat sheet because of how many minutes so many are playing.

For that reason, the Lady Vols PR office needs to adjust to this on-court scheme and promote stats per minute rather than for the game in their press releases.

I doubt it.
Samara Spencer or no LV player is in the dark in the eyes of WNBA scouts.
I expect Spear, Spencer, and possibly Hollingshead to get many looks from WNBA scouts this season.
It is these college analysts and sportswriters who routinely overhype certain players and programs for politics in sports.
These people are aware of the resume of Samara Spencer. It was their choice to exclude her from preseason recognition.
The Coach Caldwell scheme will bring more exposure to her players due to the production and highlights that they will be able to get on film. Just from the exhibition three players have already received highlight reels from a WNBA analyst.
Offensive production through preseason contests (96) pts vs North Carolina in the scrimmage and (135) pts vs Carson Newman in about a weeks span is sustainable.
The on-court scheme has encountered many misconceptions due to being an unorthodox approach in this sport.

 

[BruisedOrange]

I doubt it.
Samara Spencer or no LV player is in the dark in the eyes of WNBA scouts.
I expect Spear, Spencer, and possibly Hollingshead to get many looks from WNBA scouts this season.
It is these college analysts and sportswriters who routinely overhype certain players and programs for politics in sports.
These people are aware of the resume of Samara Spencer. It was their choice to exclude her from preseason recognition.
The Coach Caldwell scheme will bring more exposure to her players due to the production and highlights that they will be able to get on film. Just from the exhibition three players have already received highlight reels from a WNBA analyst.
Offensive production through preseason contests (96) pts vs North Carolina in the scrimmage and (135) pts vs Carson Newman in about a weeks span is sustainable.
The on-court scheme has encountered many misconceptions due to being an unorthodox approach in this sport.

Just to clarify, the sports analysts you cited as having overlooked Spencer are the ones I was referring to as being "in the dark," assuming you meant media analysts, not WNBA.

Anyone just looking at stat sheets instead of video are gonna be slow to pick up on what Samara is bringing to the team--but by tournament time, the spotlight will find her.

Should make for a fun season as the ladies begin seeing the court through shared eyes, developing confidence in where the ball needs to go and getting quickly to those spots. I've played on some teams like that, and it truly gets to where, on a turnover, you can immediately throw the ball to a spot without looking, knowing that your teammate is already running for that spot.

By February, these girls are going to have such fun playing basketball together!

[see Sara's interview] Tennessee Lady Vol News

 

[DeerPark12]

The spotlight shines brightest for those who are in the dark. Stats for our players are going to be buried in our own stat sheet because of how many minutes so many are playing.

For that reason, the Lady Vols PR office needs to adjust to this on-court scheme and promote stats per minute rather than for the game in their press releases.

NCAA and SEC standard is per game, that's what is reported to them (automatically by the stat software, I would add). They could manually do it the way you suggest, but if no other school is doing it that way, how would you provide context for what Tennessee's players are doing? To provide context that would make those numbers meaningful, they'd have to run them for every team.

 

[chuckiepoo]

NCAA and SEC standard is per game, that's what is reported to them (automatically by the stat software, I would add). They could manually do it the way you suggest, but if no other school is doing it that way, how would you provide context for what Tennessee's players are doing? To provide context that would make those numbers meaningful, they'd have to run them for every team.

Yep. I recall when the Houston media started trotting out ts efficiency % in support of Harden during a number of his MVP candidacies. Didn’t move the needle.

Wins do!

 

[lvocd]

By February, these girls are going to have such fun playing basketball together!

It's kinda shocking to me that they're already as far along as they are this early. Obviously they've got a long way to go to get to where they'll need to be to be a serious contender to go deep into the postseason, but they've made a terrific start. The extra conditioning is going to make up for some of the early lapses they will surely have.

But back to your point, they look to me to be having fun out there, and it's so nice to see that.

 

[RespectAPA]

NCAA and SEC standard is per game, that's what is reported to them (automatically by the stat software, I would add). They could manually do it the way you suggest, but if no other school is doing it that way, how would you provide context for what Tennessee's players are doing? To provide context that would make those numbers meaningful, they'd have to run them for every team.

In terms of player evaluation, (stat) per game is inferior to (stat) per minute. The former is less contextualized than the latter.

There's a hierarchy.

The most generic: "Points"... it's a stat, but it will give you apples-to-oranges comparisons between one player that's participated in 12 games, and another who has participated in 8 games.

Okay, so points per game is an improvement to that, contextualizing the stat.

But it will still give you apples-to-oranges comparisons between a player who is averaging 28 minutes per game, and a player who is averaging 10 minutes per game.

So points per minute is an improvement to points per game. Is it enough of an improvement for advocating it — at least to be occasionally used by media and fans? Yes, I think so.

Two examples from this game.

Strickland only scored 6 points. But she also only played 10 minutes. That rate (.6 ppm) is just a touch worse than Cooper (.8 ppm) and Puckett (.77 ppm) while having half the minutes. A better scoring performance than you might think.

Hollingshead recovered 4 rebounds. But she almost only played 11 minutes. That rate (.36 rpm) is actually the highest rate on the team, just higher than Boyd's rate, .32 rpm.

Trying to go even further down the hierarchy [(stat) per possession is next, I guess?] is probably past the point of diminishing returns. Points per minute is the last large jump in context, and it serves our purposes just fine.

In terms of evaluating player production, Kim should be looking at per-minute, not per-game. A player can only produce in proportion to how many minutes Kim gives them on the court. A player could manage to get into double-digits by virtue of getting 20+ minutes, while actually scoring fewer PPM than Strickland's .6 ppm in 10 minutes.

 

[37620VOL]

In terms of player evaluation, (stat) per game is inferior to (stat) per minute. The former is less contextualized than the latter.

There's a hierarchy.

The most generic: "Points"... it's a stat, but it will give you apples-to-oranges comparisons between one player that's participated in 12 games, and another who has participated in 8 games.

Okay, so points per game is an improvement to that, contextualizing the stat.

But it will still give you apples-to-oranges comparisons between a player who is averaging 28 minutes per game, and a player who is averaging 10 minutes per game.

So points per minute is an improvement to points per game. Is it enough of an improvement for advocating it — at least to be occasionally used by media and fans? Yes, I think so.

Two examples from this game.

Strickland only scored 6 points. But she also only played 10 minutes. That rate (.6 ppm) is just a touch worse than Cooper (.8 ppm) and Pucket (.77 ppm) while having half the minutes. A better scoring performance than you might think.

Hollingshead recovered 4 rebounds. But she almost only played 11 minutes. That rate (.36 rpm) is actually the highest rate on the team, just higher than Boyd's rate, .32 rpm.

Trying to go even further down the hierarchy [(stat) per possession is next, I guess?] is probably past the point of diminishing returns. Points per minute is the last large jump in context, and it serves our purposes just fine.

In terms of evaluating player production, Kim should be looking at per-minute, not per-game. A player can only produce in proportion to how many minutes Kim gives them on the court. A player could manage to get into double-digits by virtue of getting 20+ minutes, while actually scoring fewer PPM than Strickland's .6 ppm in 10 minutes.

Her Hoops already does this stat and much more for every D1 player by converting all the players' stats to 40 minutes. Well worth the subscription.

Example:

Rickea Jackson NCAA Player Page

Traditional and Advanced Statistics, Ranks, Percentiles, Game Logs, and more from Her Hoop Stats

herhoopstats.com

 

[DeerPark12]

In terms of player evaluation, (stat) per game is inferior to (stat) per minute. The former is less contextualized than the latter.

There's a hierarchy.

The most generic: "Points"... it's a stat, but it will give you apples-to-oranges comparisons between one player that's participated in 12 games, and another who has participated in 8 games.

Okay, so points per game is an improvement to that, contextualizing the stat.

But it will still give you apples-to-oranges comparisons between a player who is averaging 28 minutes per game, and a player who is averaging 10 minutes per game.

So points per minute is an improvement to points per game. Is it enough of an improvement for advocating it — at least to be occasionally used by media and fans? Yes, I think so.

Two examples from this game.

Strickland only scored 6 points. But she also only played 10 minutes. That rate (.6 ppm) is just a touch worse than Cooper (.8 ppm) and Pucket (.77 ppm) while having half the minutes. A better scoring performance than you might think.

Hollingshead recovered 4 rebounds. But she almost only played 11 minutes. That rate (.36 rpm) is actually the highest rate on the team, just higher than Boyd's rate, .32 rpm.

Trying to go even further down the hierarchy [(stat) per possession is next, I guess?] is probably past the point of diminishing returns. Points per minute is the last large jump in context, and it serves our purposes just fine.

In terms of evaluating player production, Kim should be looking at per-minute, not per-game. A player can only produce in proportion to how many minutes Kim gives them on the court. A player could manage to get into double-digits by virtue of getting 20+ minutes, while actually scoring fewer PPM than Strickland's .6 ppm in 10 minutes.

Coaches certainly evaluate differently, no one is arguing that. They keep stats like that internally.

 

[BruisedOrange]

Coaches certainly evaluate differently, no one is arguing that. They keep stats like that internally.

Thus (IMHO), the Lady Vols media dept. should effort to push those /per minute stats.

WNBA scouting departments are probably already keeping or creating those stats, but the benefit would come from recruits seeing those stats. Press releases emphasizing /per minute stats would be a truthful and effective response to any negative recruiting about "you'll be playing fewer minutes at Tennessee."

At some point, the "fewer minutes/higher production" needs to be messaged to the public (but for recruits) in the same way the football team does about playing running back here. "You will arrive at the next level with less accumulated damage* to your body, but with all the expertise to excel."

* (But this style of play will also require a new "textbook" for strength & conditioning, probably borrowing from other sports that require similar movements over short but intense periods. I'd expect the Lady Vols S&C coach is already networking with the top trainers in, for example, racquetball sports.)

 

[DeerPark12]

Thus (IMHO), the Lady Vols media dept. should effort to push those /per minute stats.

WNBA scouting departments are probably already keeping or creating those stats, but the benefit would come from recruits seeing those stats. Press releases emphasizing /per minute stats would be a truthful and effective response to any negative recruiting about "you'll be playing fewer minutes at Tennessee."

At some point, the "fewer minutes/higher production" needs to be messaged to the public (but for recruits) in the same way the football team does about playing running back here. "You will arrive at the next level with less accumulated damage* to your body, but with all the expertise to excel."

* (But this style of play will also require a new "textbook" for strength & conditioning, probably borrowing from other sports that require similar movements over short but intense periods. I'd expect the Lady Vols S&C coach is already networking with the top trainers in, for example, racquetball sports.)

Well, again, publicizing those stats is a worthless exercise unless they are calculating them for every player on every team, because presented on their own without context they don’t mean anything.

 

[37620VOL]

Well, again, publicizing those stats is a worthless exercise unless they are calculating them for every player on every team, because presented on their own without context they don’t mean anything.

Her Hoops already does this for every player on every team.

 

[ttharp]

x

 

[OrangeBeachVol]

I can see why so many on here were so high on Whitehorn and Cooper. They are elite players. Add Spear and this team has 3. Should be able to compete with anyone.

 

[Coach Jumper]

I can see why so many on here were so high on Whitehorn and Cooper. They are elite players. Add Spear and this team has 3. Should be able to compete with anyone.

Rube and Coop
Rubic's cube
Ruby's Coop

 

[VolBall09]

Was gonna tag more of them but many were way wilder

Yo where you been? Join the fun