Game Thread: Lady Vols 75 - Ohio State 87

[Voluble2]

Dang, Miles +/- was negative 12 in her 4 minutes of play.

Suarez didn't look capable of playing at this level.

Walker, also terrible, no offensive game.

Horston has blinders on when she barrels toward the basket.

IMO Powell needs to take over this team. She made some mistakes but you can tell she has a high bb IQ.

Jackson and Darby played okay. Darby was wide open for some corner 3s but Horston wouldn't kick out.

This was CKH's worst coaching job. Whatever she drew on the whiteboard at half time, toss it in the toilet.

She also killed us with a couple of the lineups she put out there.

Looking at the new players.

Powell - She is obviously an upgrade for the position, but I thought she took a couple of shots too early and did not look to set up the offense. She also had a couple of unforced turnovers. Easy enough to iron that stuff out.

Hollingshead - Did not see much helpful from her. She can move well and that is about it. No offensive game at all, and really poor defense.

Franklin - undersized post who could probably be productive if she got some minutes, but not as athletic or flashy as the others and has to be utilized a certain way. Doesn't look to move all that well so the injury may be lingering.

Jackson - Obviously a scorer with a scorer's mentality, but plays poor defense and turns the ball over too much. You have to find a way to use her strengths.

A HUGE problem today was running too many players in and out so that we could not have any consistency. When you get a team down you need to keep that lineup out there as much as you can and pile it on. This isn't little league where everyone gets a chance to play.

Ohio State's press isn't all that great. They run it like it should be run, but they don't have a bunch of great athletes out there and it should be very easy to position yourself so that you can beat it. Our small guards couldn't throw over it, and several times passed up opportunities to dribble through it. This is the sort of thing a timeout should have cured early in the game where you point out which presses they are running and what to do in each case. Having the same people on the floor means you don't have 15 different people each seeing the press for the first time so that it is effective for far longer than it should be as each new set of players has to adjust. Knowing who is out there with you and where they are is key to beating a press. A platoon system assures you can never settle down against it. A good coach would know who to put out there to break it and would play that line-up.

 

[glv98]

Horston, senior guard, has 7 turnovers. You can't be a senior guard and have 7 turnovers.

She can. And always has. I decided last year it just comes with the territory and she does plenty of good to make up for it. Unfortunately, her coach also has a history of high turnover teams. After tonight I'm wondering if volume t.o.s just come with the Harper territory too.

Tonight Jordan fell into her old role of having to do too much by herself and that causes her to turn it over alot of times.

 

[jeebie]

Injured according to the announcers.

Does anyone know what Justine's injury might be? I hope our superstar isn't injury prone and that her injury isn't serious. She was on the bench and didn't appear to have any wraps on any part of the body. The Lady Vols keep having such bum luck with injuries to key players. She could have been the difference in this game. The Lady Vols just need to work in practice on how to break a press. This was a learning experience, they should be OK.

 

[glv98]

A HUGE problem today was running too many players in and out so that we could not have any consistency. When you get a team down you need to keep that lineup out there as much as you can and pile it on. This isn't little league where everyone gets a chance to play.

We've complained about early season sub patterns in each of KJH's previous seasons. She always does this, as if the early games are all exhibitions. Problem this year is the early schedule is alot tougher.

 

[JohnTN]

LV just need to figure out how to break a press. That was the source of the 28 point run.

 

[JohnTN]

Sorry, 18 point run

 

[Prophet1]

Looking at the new players.

Powell - She is obviously an upgrade for the position, but I thought she took a couple of shots too early and did not look to set up the offense. She also had a couple of unforced turnovers. Easy enough to iron that stuff out.

Hollingshead - Did not see much helpful from her. She can move well and that is about it. No offensive game at all, and really poor defense.

Franklin - undersized post who could probably be productive if she got some minutes, but not as athletic or flashy as the others and has to be utilized a certain way. Doesn't look to move all that well so the injury may be lingering.

Jackson - Obviously a scorer with a scorer's mentality, but plays poor defense and turns the ball over too much. You have to find a way to use her strengths.

A HUGE problem today was running too many players in and out so that we could not have any consistency. When you get a team down you need to keep that lineup out there as much as you can and pile it on. This isn't little league where everyone gets a chance to play.

Ohio State's press isn't all that great. They run it like it should be run, but they don't have a bunch of great athletes out there and it should be very easy to position yourself so that you can beat it. Our small guards couldn't throw over it, and several times passed up opportunities to dribble through it. This is the sort of thing a timeout should have cured early in the game where you point out which presses they are running and what to do in each case. Having the same people on the floor means you don't have 15 different people each seeing the press for the first time so that it is effective for far longer than it should be as each new set of players has to adjust. Knowing who is out there with you and where they are is key to beating a press. A platoon system assures you can never settle down against it. A good coach would know who to put out there to break it and would play that line-up.

Also crisp passing beat the pass or a big to throw to.

 

[37620VOL]

LV just need to figure out how to break a press. That was the source of the 28 point run.

I figured the coaches would have picked something up from getting destroyed by Louisville. This game mirrored that one in a few ways.

 

[LV renaissance]

Refusing to call a time out in the third quarter as the wheels were falling off, that is something you have to do.

That was perhaps my biggest disappointment in the coaching tonight, which says a lot. It was so reminiscent of the Florida, Auburn, and Alabama debacles last year in which it was so clear that the team was falling apart and Coach would not call a timeout until the damage was already done. This is becoming a clear pattern that when the team is starting to lose emotional focus on a visitor's court, she waits way too long to call a time out. This is the opposite strategy to the well-placed time out strategy that is embraced by almost all coaches at all levels of basketball, especially on the road when emotional breakdowns are more commonplace. I had originally thought that calming a team down would be a strong point for KJH given her relatively calm demeanor and seemingly emotional strength, so perhaps my assessment is wrong. It my original assessment is correct, then letting a team fully derail emotionally without calling a time for the coach to skillfully calm the players down is nuts.

 

[Prophet1]

Unselfish team play and decent coaching are a hellva combination.

 

[Voluble2]

That was perhaps my biggest disappointment in the coaching tonight, which says a lot. It was so reminiscent of the Florida, Auburn, and Alabama debacles last year in which it was so clear that the team was falling apart and Coach would not call a timeout until the damage was already done. This is becoming a clear pattern that when the team is starting to lose emotional focus on a visitor's court, she waits way too long to call a time out. This is the opposite strategy to the well-placed time out strategy that is embraced by almost all coaches at all levels of basketball, especially on the road when emotional breakdowns are more commonplace. I had originally thought that calming a team down would be a strong point for KJH given her relatively calm demeanor and seemingly emotional strength, so perhaps my assessment is wrong. It my original assessment is correct, then letting a team fully derail emotionally without calling a time for the coach to skillfully calm the players down is nuts.

You can give a team PTSD is you let this happen too much. I really think Holly's teams were always thinking "Well, here it goes again" like they were just passively watching the game in mirror image of their coach.

This was very bad to have happen as the formative experience for this new bunch of players.

 

[Volfan1000]

Key does not need to be picking up two early fouls and limiting turnovers are going to be big keys for the Lady Volunteers this season.

 

[LV renaissance]

You can give a team PTSD is you let this happen too much. I really think Holly's teams were always thinking "Well, here it goes again" like they were just passively watching the game in mirror image of their coach.

This was very bad to have happen as the formative experience for this new bunch of players.

Fans can develop trauma reactions as well

 

[ttharp]

You can give a team PTSD is you let this happen too much. I really think Holly's teams were always thinking "Well, here it goes again" like they were just passively watching the game in mirror image of their coach.

This was very bad to have happen as the formative experience for this new bunch of players.

This. It’s so not fair to the players. To see that what you’re doing on the court clearly isn’t working, and the person who is supposed to be your leader doesn’t quickly intervene to give you the guidance you need.

It would be very difficult for me to trust and buy in with such a coach.

 

[Volfaninfl2]

Scoring difference in the game, our scoring percentage was actually good. We made 4 of 11, 3 pointers, they made 7 of 23, that’s a 9 point difference, and they made 3 more free throws than we did. The obvious difference was they took many more shots because we kept giving them the ball.

 

[Rons1989]

What was the issue with Pissott and Wynn seen they were both in street clothes

 

[Govols922]

I know this team is new and trying to build chemistry and sure enough there is grace for this lost. That said, they must play together. Everyone was after their own shots and it looks like no one knows their roles. The ball was stagnant. This offense should be free flowing. If this is Horston’s team everyone around her should be getting better. That means she has to look for open players before she looks for her own shot. Since she’s a playmaker and can make baskets easily. (Sidebar) Key could have dominated the paint if they would have placed her in the pick and roll action. She has a reputation of not showing up offensively for big games. Hopefully the pros won’t tag her for that.

That said….There’s only one ball. Share it! This isn’t a unique situation. The greatest teams with the greatest talents shared the ball. We aren’t even that impressive. This is a humbling lost and will show them that they need each other to win games. Take a word from scripture..consider others more than yourself! Good effort Lady vols.

 

[madtownvol]

Chill people. I can guarantee that this team, even missing Justine, is going to be miles ahead of last year's fast starting team.

Championships are not won in November, Think how many new, key players are having to learn the system and find their roles. If the LVs had played a mediocre team, they would have by twenty + and everyone would be in lala land.

OSU at home forced mistakes and took advantage. There is work to be done but it was unrealistic to think the LVs were going to be a finished product game one.

 

[volnationnj]

Chill people. I can guarantee that this team, even missing Justine, is going to be miles ahead of last year's fast starting team.

Championships are not won in November, Think how many new, key players are having to learn the system and find their roles. If the LVs had played a mediocre team, they would have by twenty + and everyone would be in lala land.

OSU at home forced mistakes and took advantage. There is work to be done but it was unrealistic to think the LVs were going to be a finished product game one.

I don't think the fans expected a finished product. But what they didn't expect was a total meltdown in the 3rd quarter. We committed 11 turnovers in that quarter alone (Without our coach calling a single timeout, I might add).
And it's not like this team is composed of underclassmen. The lineup is filled with upperclassmen. Experienced players who shouldn't fall apart when met with resistance.
Yes, it's only 1 game. But I can't think of a worse way (outside of incurring injuries) to start the season. It's not that they lost. It's the way they lost that upsets fans the most.
Oh well, there's only up after this.

 

[zaqhhh]

I didn’t watch the game so I’ll refrain from bashing KJH too much but one thing I’ve been continuously disappointed by is her inability to clean up the turnovers.

 

[Rooster1]

Does anyone know what Justine's injury might be? I hope our superstar isn't injury prone and that her injury isn't serious. She was on the bench and didn't appear to have any wraps on any part of the body. The Lady Vols keep having such bum luck with injuries to key players. She could have been the difference in this game. The Lady Vols just need to work in practice on how to break a press. This was a learning experience, they should be OK.

They said on TV she was in “head protocol” so apparently she must have got her bell rung in practice. That’s all I can think of.

 

[GameTime]

Too much individual play, not enough team play....A lot of hero ball.

Kick the ball out to the 3 point shooter waiting for the ball in the corner, or at the demon line, instead of taking on 2 or 3 defensive players....

They always double teamed the inbound pass receiver...Make a quick pass and dribble out of trouble...It's not that difficult...Tighten up.

Coach Kellie, you are beautiful woman, but don't let your team get smacked around for almost a whole quarter without stopping the carnage for a breather and a pep talk to your girls.....They need you to calm them down...Be a better coach, darlin.

Run the picket fence at em (Hoosiers), set hard effective screens, anything, but more one on one ball, that turned into our one against their two or three.

Ms. Key, you know not to pick up two silly fouls in the first wo minutes of the game...The team's identity is built around you...Stand tall and don't foul.

As a fan, due to her injury, I was disappointed that Justine did not play...I'm sure she was mentally picturing what she could have done to change the negative momentum with her deep 3 ball game.

It was a tough night for most of us...It will get better...

 

[feathersax]

I didn’t watch the game so I’ll refrain from bashing KJH too much but one thing I’ve been continuously disappointed by is her inability to clean up the turnovers.

Same here. Seems to be a pattern of confusion.

 

[Memvol44]

Obviously some people here know more about Coach Harper coaching background than I do, tonight for the first time I’m going to really question her ability to lead this program back where it belongs. First, this was a very winnable game. The coaches strategy with using timeouts to stop runs and get players settled is mind blowing. You don’t let your team go through what she did in the 3rd qtr without stopping play to regroup and change up defenses/strategies to stop that 18-0 run by OSU. This woman simply kneeled on the sideline and watched it happen like a spectator.
I’m actually blown away by that kind of coaching from an obviously strong minded and successful leader. I know this team is better than that performance.
Second, there’s no justification for Puckett not playing in the 2nd half. None whatsoever. That’s how you lose players. Puckett should’ve played and so should have Marta more in the 2nd half. Rickea started out solid but once she sat most of the 2nd qtr with 2 fouls that took her out of the game. I’m hoping this player can get her career back on track.. she seems to be searching a little bit at the moment. She has remarkable ability as a basketball player.
Last, when players pick up fouls there will come a time when the coach has to show trust and let them play through it. If they foul out then use it as a teaching moment to adjust and use the depth on your roster. But there’s no point in taking players out the game then not seeming to have a backup plan other than allow Horston to generate all the offense.
Last season, there were times the offense ran through Horston, Puckett, Dye and Key while Burrell return from injury. This year, with Powell, Hollingshead, & Jackson added alongside the returners there’s no reason in any game to score just 34 points in the 2nd half. That’s a sign of the system. The system has to get better. The coaching has to get better. I can’t put this loss on the players.

With that press the game was too fast for Sara and marta

 

[Memvol44]

She can. And always has. I decided last year it just comes with the territory and she does plenty of good to make up for it. Unfortunately, her coach also has a history of high turnover teams. After tonight I'm wondering if volume t.o.s just come with the Harper territory too.

Tonight Jordan fell into her old role of having to do too much by herself and that causes her to turn it over alot of times.

Yes..Horston had to do everything!