Gold Confiscation Act of 2013

#51
#51
Its not the silver they are taking. I have silver.

Its the silver fashioned into a fake currency and sold to Glen Beck-listening morons who don't know any better than that they are getting totally ripped off and committing a federal crime when they try to spend it.

A federal crime? Very broad interpretation of "counterfeit":

...a minted round of nearly pure silver, that is neither the same size nor denomination as any existing US coin and does not display identical imagery...

If they were making counterfeit money wouldn't it be the same size, same denomination, the same material, and the same imagery and wording as US minted coins?

BTW, $7 Million worth has been confiscated, almost all of it from private coin collectors.

Quote from Brian Doherty of Reason Magazine
 
#52
#52
A federal crime? Very broad interpretation of "counterfeit":



If they were making counterfeit money wouldn't it be the same size, same denomination, the same material, and the same imagery and wording as US minted coins?

BTW, $7 Million worth has been confiscated, almost all of it from private coin collectors.

Quote from Brian Doherty of Reason Magazine




It is made to look like legitimate U.S. currency.

I just don't see why anyone would defend this charade .... unless they bought some of it.

That's a question.
 
#53
#53
It is made to look like legitimate U.S. currency.

I just don't see why anyone would defend this charade .... unless they bought some of it.

That's a question.

I own exactly 0 liberty coins. I don't even own any gold or silver.

It's not counterfeit. Nobody buys or accepts one of these coins thinking it's US currency. That's just ridiculous. Counterfeiting is an imitation or a copy. If we allow them to call this counterfeiting it will expand the definition and will be applied a lot more broadly. No more precious coins, period. That sort of thing.

I know you don't care because you are all for the suppression of freedom when it comes to things you don't value, but some of us do want to live in a free country.
 
#54
#54
I own exactly 0 liberty coins. I don't even own any gold or silver.

It's not counterfeit. Nobody buys or accepts one of these coins thinking it's US currency. That's just ridiculous. Counterfeiting is an imitation or a copy. If we allow them to call this counterfeiting it will expand the definition and will be applied a lot more broadly. No more precious coins, period. That sort of thing.

I know you don't care because you are all for the suppression of freedom when it comes to things you don't value, but some of us do want to live in a free country.

Ya. I'd say most people are like that - they want the freedoms they like - don't want the freedoms they don't support. It's funny how the only real freedom idealist running GOP isn't getting as much support as some other candidates who fit the description you just stated.
 
#55
#55
I own exactly 0 liberty coins. I don't even own any gold or silver.

It's not counterfeit. Nobody buys or accepts one of these coins thinking it's US currency. That's just ridiculous. Counterfeiting is an imitation or a copy. If we allow them to call this counterfeiting it will expand the definition and will be applied a lot more broadly. No more precious coins, period. That sort of thing.

I know you don't care because you are all for the suppression of freedom when it comes to things you don't value, but some of us do want to live in a free country.


You don't have the freedom to possess counterfeit money. The company that came up with this does not have the freedom to make counterfeit money.

btw, a jury disagrees with you. The founder of the company was convicted by a jury of counterfeiting.
Liberty Dollar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
#57
#57
You don't have the freedom to possess counterfeit money. The company that came up with this does not have the freedom to make counterfeit money.

btw, a jury disagrees with you. The founder of the company was convicted by a jury of counterfeiting.
Liberty Dollar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Can you maybe point me in the right direction with that link? There's a lot to read, including:

The promoter of the Liberty Dollar asserts that Claudia Dickens, spokeswoman for the U.S. Treasury Department's Bureau of Engraving and Printing, had previously said American Liberty Currency is legitimate. Dickens was quoted as having said "There's nothing illegal about this", after the Treasury Department's legal team reviewed the currency. "As long as it doesn't say 'legal tender' there's nothing wrong with it."
 
#59
#59
LG... they are silver coins made of 1oz pure silver. Its not fake silver, its not tin, its silver. Everyone with a brain knows I cant fill up my tank with a silver coin, but everyone with a brain knows a 1oz silver coin is worth something.

By your logic, this is counterfeit $$ too

1 oz .999 silver Life and Liberty Millennium Bar | eBay


A silver bar is not a replica of a coin.


Here's a pic of a Liberty Dollar and also an actual U.S. dollar, the Peace Dollar.
 

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#60
#60
And here is the reverse of the Liberty Dollar.
 

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#62
#62
Oh, and here's a "certificate" by them, marked "negotiable."
 

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#63
#63
LG... both of those coins are selling for the exact same price on ebay.

If i put a counterfiet $100 bill on ebay, it wont sell for $100
 
#66
#66
LG... both of those coins are selling for the exact same price on ebay.

If i put a counterfiet $100 bill on ebay, it wont sell for $100


Some of the comments by sellers on Ebay for these things are hilarious:

Ok now Aunties not so Legal Advice.
This Silver Liberty is not to be spent as current money
the buyer is buying a collectible. I dont think you would
Spend over 20.00 on this and spend it as a $5.00
But our STONED FBI recomends
us to pass this disclamer.

Now Aunties Disclamer
People need to take back our money period
Our Government has FAILD the people
So buy Bullion and start Bartering with it.
work with local stores to take silver in trade.
the more people that do this the sooner we can
return our country back to a Gold & Silver standard.



This IS REAL MONEY, more specifically: Private Voluntary Barter Currency
BREAKING: norfed Liberty Dollars creator has just been found guilty by a North Carolina JURY of making his currency look so similar to Government money that it confuses people. therefore keep in mind that This is NOW considered to be COUNTERFEIT Coin even though it is much different looking than any US Coin. AND they WILL Soon have a hearing on whether to have other/all Liberty Dollars FORFEITED!! The prosecution attempted to do this at the end of the trial but the Judge gave us time to present a defense as to LD's NOT owned by BVNH!1!!
according to this website: Counterfeit Coins - Coin Forgeries - Coin Counterfeits
QUOTE << there's nothing in the statutory or case law in the U.S. that indicates simple possession is illegal. Similarly, no court in the U.S. has ever ruled that possession of counterfeits of collectible coins is illegal. .>>


BEWARE: The last time Liberty Dollar issued CAMPAIGN Tokens for Ron Paul, a FEARFUL Federal Government SEIZED TONS of them - leaving them quite rare. While some copy cats are issuing tokens with Ron Paul on them, NO OTHER one dares do what the original Liberty Dollar did and put a value on them AND use them for POLITICAL ADVOCACY. Tokens used for political advocacy were fairly common back before our Federal Government took TIGHT Fascist CONTROL over Elections via campaign finance laws etc - amazingly many people still think we have free and fair elections in this Country USA. I believe Ron (and Rand) Paul can help restore FREEDOM to this Country.
This is as came from Mint then protected by AIRTITE case via gloved careful hands. IMPRESSIVELY Beautiful shine and detail (Look at the White House with a magnifying glass when you get it!)
WAS usable as UNIVERSAL COUPON that never expires with intrinsic value back when it was legal. When this common sense approach to money returns YOU will have an impressive collectors' item! OR SILVER, OR spendable money! how can you lose with them options? more info at. google search
This is NOT money affiliated with the US Govt nor mint nor Fed in any way (therefore not a "coin").




so, these loons are calling it "real money" and asking people to "barter" with it at stores. Utter nonsense.
 
#68
#68
Honestly, LG, what's the benefit in enforcing the law here? I feel a need to understand your reasoning. If nobody thinks it's real money, why enforce the law? Why waste valuable resources and inconvenience honest Americans if there's no harm?
 
#69
#69
Honestly, LG, what's the benefit in enforcing the law here? I feel a need to understand your reasoning. If nobody thinks it's real money, why enforce the law? Why waste valuable resources and inconvenience honest Americans if there's no harm?

Because the owner probably donated money to the Rs and is making a mockery of the current administration. Therefore he needs to be silenced
 
#70
#70
Honestly, LG, what's the benefit in enforcing the law here? I feel a need to understand your reasoning. If nobody thinks it's real money, why enforce the law? Why waste valuable resources and inconvenience honest Americans if there's no harm?

First, I don;t think its all that obvious that it isn't real. I mean, I'd be suspicious if someone handed one to me, but its pretty apparent that the coin is designed to mimick an actual U.S. dollar. I think the fact that it carries a denomination is probably the crux of the problem because that it implies that it has some static value other than its silver content.

Second, it is a precedent issue. Remember, this outfit was also selling certificates representing ownership of these dollars saved at a "mint." Also, they had "regional offices" where people could buy and redeem these for cash. And, the outfit making them promoted the notion that people would spend them in commerce.

Imagine the bedlam that would result if anyone could just start printing their own currency, over which the Treasury had no control, and called a "dollar." This is one outfit, but they got big, fast. And their stated purpose was to create an alternative to the U.S. currency because of their politics.

Owning silver is fine. Buying and selling silver is fine. But you have to observe the distinction between that and minting or printing things that you say have x value in U.S. dollars and which is designed to replace actual currency.


Because the owner probably donated money to the Rs and is making a mockery of the current administration. Therefore he needs to be silenced

You are correct that the guy is a far right zealot.

One small problem with your argument: the raid and the prosecution occurred under George Bush.
 

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