Harry Reid Dead At 82

#328
#328
utvolpj said:
He has a point given the lazy "look outside" comment. No different than the "god is good!" comments when someone gets good health news but not when someone dies.
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The look outside isn’t lazy. The constants in science point to intelligent design. The argument “what about the children” is the stupidity I laugh at. Imposing his objective since of morality on something that would be above him and quite frankly beyond our comprehension. Honestly if there is a creator. Then everything within that creation is at His decision. If that creator says something is good/bad then it’s good/bad. Your objective disagreement is irrelevant to what would be defined as good/bad. but I digress
 
#329
#329
Orangeslice13 said:
. Honestly if there is a creator. Then everything within that creation is at His decision.
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That is the absolute leap. One act does not require the other.

Some less than intelligent and known racist creature telling me to look outside for proof of some omnipotent ruler is useless
 
#330
#330
utvolpj said:
That is the absolute leap. One act does not require the other.

Some less than intelligent and known racist creature telling me to look outside for proof of some omnipotent ruler is useless
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close your eyes and don’t look then. Stupid people are sometimes correct by happenstance. But that’s still moving the conversation away from my mocking his point.
The argument for a creator is you get free will. complaining that there are negatives associated with that is silly and certainly doesn’t take any steps towards proving that creator is “bad”.
 
#331
#331
Orangeslice13 said:
close your eyes and don’t look then. Stupid people are sometimes correct by happenstance. But that’s still moving the conversation away from my mocking his point.
The argument for a creator is you get free will. complaining that there are negatives associated with that is silly and certainly doesn’t take any steps towards proving that creator is “bad”.
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I've never said their bad just no longer involved in the day to day. They don't care who gets sick and they don't watch sports.Ultimately free will is a myth anyways given the myriad number of inputs outside your control that get you to your "free will" moment
 
#332
#332
utvolpj said:
I've never said their bad just no longer involved in the day to day. They don't care who gets sick and they don't watch sports.Ultimately free will is a myth anyways given the myriad number of inputs outside your control that get you to your "free will" moment
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No argument here. I think that the creator gets involved very rarely. I have some views on this that are probably best left unposted. But I am curious
Just for my own clarification are you saying free will doesn’t exist as in every thing is predestined or that there’s a controlled element too it?
 
#333
#333
Orangeslice13 said:
No argument here. I think that the creator gets involved very rarely. I have some views on this that are probably best left unposted. But I am curious
Just for my own clarification are you saying free will doesn’t exist as in every thing is predestined or that there’s a controlled element too it?
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Ultimately it doesnt exist because choices can't be independent. If your free will can be impacted or changed by someone else's then is it still free will? Can you do things like choose to not hear a loud sound or prevent random thoughts from entering your head? Those were a couple of examples I remember (and surely butchered) from an interesting discussion between Lex Friedman and Sam Harris. Of course they are both way smarter than me so who knows if I understood it all
 
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#334
#334
utvolpj said:
Ultimately it doesnt exist because choices can't be independent. If your free will can be impacted or changed by someone else's then is it still free will? Can you do things like choose to not hear a loud sound or prevent random thoughts from entering your head? Those were a couple of examples I remember (and surely butchered) from an interesting discussion between Lex Friedman and Sam Harris. Of course they are both way smarter than me so who knows if I understood it all
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Meh. I don’t buy into the “those guy are so smart” as much as I probably should. Sometimes those smart guys are just wrong and often it’s their arrogance that blinds them.
I think your examples answered my question and helped me understand your position just fine.
Thanks.
 
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