Has the talent capped under Butch?

#1
Bassmaster_Vol

Bassmaster_Vol

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#1
On the Basilio blog this morning, one of his writers said that he had doubts that Butch will ever have as talented a roster going forward as he had last year. Do you believe that? I know this year and last years class underwhelmed (tho I would argue that last years class was much better than the ranking), but who's to say he can't get back in the top 10? If Butch can win this year, 2018 in state class is really good. Keep those guys home and the roster will be stacked again going forward. Are y'all optimistic about 2018 recruiting?
 
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#2
#2
I think it goes one of 2 ways, either really good or really bad. If butch has a winning season and beats UGA,UF and doesn't crap the bed vs USCE and Vandy then it will be an outstanding class. But if he loses to UGA or UF and craps the bed again on the bottom feeders then our recruiting class takes a major blow. If we have a coaching change mid season or shortly after, we will probably take a big blow as well. Odds are against butch for this class imo but we will have to see. Losing those 2 games against South Carolina and Vandy this year really hurt us in many aspects.
 
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#3
#3
All the naysayers are just piling on. If we come out and do better than expected the next couple years they'll all be talking about how smart he is. It's a what have you done for me lately industry. Everyone is a genius when they're doing well and an incompetent failure when they're not, and you can go from one to the other very quickly.
 
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#4
#4
Grudenator said:
I think it goes one of 2 ways, either really good or really bad. If butch has a winning season and beats UGA,UF and doesn't crap the bed vs USCE and Vandy then it will be an outstanding class. But if he loses to UGA or UF and craps the bed again on the bottom feeders then our recruiting class takes a major blow. If we have a coaching change mid season or shortly after, we will probably take a big blow as well. Odds are against butch for this class imo but we will have to see. Losing those 2 games against South Carolina and Vandy this year really hurt us in many aspects.
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Yeah I think if we lose those games we are looking for a new coach. Hopefully that doesn't happen.
 
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#5
#5
I really think without injuries we at worst split usce and candy. Probably could have pulled college station out with our roster intact. You just never know in the sec,It's all ifs and buts, but I just don't get why people over look us losing our key defensive players.

We still have a very talented team and this new group of freshman provide depth in key areas. If we stay healthy, we have a chance for a good season.

I do agree we need to solidify locking down top talent in tn.
 
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#6
#6
Skullbone said:
All the naysayers are just piling on. If we come out and do better than expected the next couple years they'll all be talking about how smart he is. It's a what have you done for me lately industry. Everyone is a genius when they're doing well and an incompetent failure when they're not, and you can go from one to the other very quickly.
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That's a big if....I haven't seen the ability to do "better than expected" on the field or in recruiting...
 
#8
#8
Pacer92 said:
That's a big if....I haven't seen the ability to do "better than expected" on the field or in recruiting...
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Fair criticism on wins but you're recruiting statement is very inaccurate.
When he was hired, the general consensus was that he would never recruit a top 10 class in the SEC.

He definitely did "better than expected" twice already, in four years.
 
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#9
#9
Isn't interesting that Bama loses two players (Scarbrough and Jackson) and it cost them a NC, we lose 10 players or more and everyone expects to win the East.
 
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#10
#10
Memphisvol87 said:
I really think without injuries we at worst split usce and candy. Probably could have pulled college station out with our roster intact. You just never know in the sec,It's all ifs and buts, but I just don't get why people over look us losing our key defensive players.

We still have a very talented team and this new group of freshman provide depth in key areas. If we stay healthy, we have a chance for a good season.

I do agree we need to solidify locking down top talent in tn.
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Yes, we would have beaten SC and Vandy without the unusually high number of injuries. And maybe aTm, too. Glad to see someone else realizes this.
 
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#12
#12
This class was the best he could do after beating Florida and Georgia in the same season.

Let that sink in.

They didn't lose faith over night but it's slipping away
 
#14
#14
CTM said:
Isn't interesting that Bama loses two players (Scarbrough and Jackson) and it cost them a NC, we lose 10 players or more and everyone expects to win the East.
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We had 20 players miss time. McElroy was on Finebaum saying that injuries were no excuse for us! Everyone has injuries. But after the championship game, same McElroy was saying had Bama not lost Jackson and a Scarborough they would probably have another title. Give me a break. No question in my mind that we go 10-2 or 11-1 without injuries. Who knows, I like i churches against Bama with a healthy roster. But we don't lose to Vandy and SC without those injuries on defense and that's a fact
 
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#17
#17
Dudleys87 said:
This class was the best he could do after beating Florida and Georgia in the same season.

Let that sink in.

They didn't lose faith over night but it's slipping away
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Losing to Vandy and SC is a lot more recent than those wins. But even before those wins this class struggled to get going. In the summer we had a bunch of commits but they were almost all low ranked guys. I think that title 9 mess hurt us a lot more than we realized. Plus, every talking head and coach were mocking Butch for the losses to OU and Florida last year and I'm sure that didn't help either
 
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#20
#20
Bassmaster_Vol said:
We had 20 players miss time. McElroy was on Finebaum saying that injuries were no excuse for us! Everyone has injuries. But after the championship game, same McElroy was saying had Bama not lost Jackson and a Scarborough they would probably have another title. Give me a break. No question in my mind that we go 10-2 or 11-1 without injuries. Who knows, I like i churches against Bama with a healthy roster. But we don't lose to Vandy and SC without those injuries on defense and that's a fact
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I do believe we would have won a couple more if healthy but staying healthy is hard to do. We did have way more than our share of injuries and our depth is just not good enough to overcome that. I believe our depth may not be very good next year either but I could be wrong. Just depends on how players develop.
 
#21
#21
I think it's too early to tell. I think the '18 class will reveal whether he has reached his potential. The '17 class was supposed to be the year and it turned out very average. IF it's similar class next year and a lot of the in-state talent leaves the state, I think the writing will be on the wall that recruits have lost faith that Butch will ever get it done. I realize being highly ranked by the recruiting sites isn't the end all of being a championship winning program but you cannot argue with statistics. The consistent championship teams always recruit in the top 5-10 every year. I think Butch is a very hard worker and is a great closer but I think to this point he's had some very average recruiters on his staff. Also, I think he's been hampered by things out of his privy such as the lawsuit.

Regardless, Butch will be here for at least two more years barring a total collapse. Remember, the wheels of this university turn very slow and they have little foresight into ramifications. They also tend to make decisions based solely on the financial side and they always error on the side of caution when ot comes to hiring and firing coaches. Everybody may as well strap it on and hope Butch can take it to the next level because don't expect the university to focus on a winning program. It is simply not a priority.
 
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#22
#22
Nice Read on Scout Rockytop board line of scrimmage league two parts. Maybe it will help in your thoughts on Butch and his talent he recruited.
 
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#23
#23
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Losing to Vandy and SC is a lot more recent than those wins. But even before those wins this class struggled to get going. In the summer we had a bunch of commits but they were almost all low ranked guys. I think that title 9 mess hurt us a lot more than we realized. Plus, every talking head and coach were mocking Butch for the losses to OU and Florida last year and I'm sure that didn't help either
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It never does but those where at the very least competitive Bama, last season, was a thriller. This season it was a disaster with virtually the same team. The last two games were just a mess and fall directly on Butch.


Funny you bring up title 9.
Baylor is in a worse position and they recruited fairly well considering so I don't think that should carry much weight

No doubt all the conference coaches are negatively recruiting Tennessee and Butch. Butch isn't helping with his on field and off field issues mixed with his one liners
 
#24
#24
Skullbone said:
All the naysayers are just piling on. If we come out and do better than expected the next couple years they'll all be talking about how smart he is. It's a what have you done for me lately industry. Everyone is a genius when they're doing well and an incompetent failure when they're not, and you can go from one to the other very quickly.
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THIS!! I don't get all the negativity! We've had 3 straight Top 15 classes, three straight bowl blowout wins, beat Ga twice & now Fla, yet to many Butch is an idiot...can't coach & cant recruit. This is probably the same fans that hollered for Fulmers firing & a decade later we're still trying to recover from that debacle! Get behind the program or get out of the way!! GO VOLS!!!!
 
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#25
#25
Bassmaster_Vol said:
9 turnovers will do that to you.
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9 TOs against SC or ATM?

9 against SC is crazy considering we were coming off a bye week. It proves we did nothing to prep and came in over confident

I'd expect that against ATM
In the middle of the guantlet and still had a chance to win.
 
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