House Oversight Committee- Biden family money laundering & foreign shakedown thread

#376
#376
BowlBrother85 said:
What Are the Costs of the Trump Tax Cuts to You?

Supply side horse $hitters will spin it differently, of course ... there are numerous ways to arrive at the answer to your question ... but the correct answer is "Yes, it did."
Click to expand...

So…tax cuts didn’t cut the amount of taxes collected by Uncle Sam. Seems like the right solution is to make them permanent and let the people who work for their dollars keep them.

The swines in DC need to spend less.
 
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#379
#379
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#380
#380
Orangeburst said:
That doesn't say net revenue was down.
Click to expand...

One of my biggest issues with most Democrats is their view on earned income. They seem to think it’s a bad thing for people to keep more of what they have worked for. It’s really disgusting. What’s worse is they will call you greedy for holding that viewpoint.
 
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#381
#381
DC_Vol said:
One of my biggest issues with most Democrats is their view on earned income. They seem to think it’s a bad thing for people to keep more of what they have worked for. It’s really disgusting. What’s worse is they will call you greedy for holding that viewpoint.
Click to expand...
My favorite is when they trot out quotes from Buffett or Gates saying that they think they agree they should pay more. It's an are you dumb moment. Of course that's what they say. Do you not get the blow back if they didn't say that? But they don't pay it. Don't pay over. You can.
 
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#382
#382
Orangeburst said:
That doesn't say net revenue was down.
Click to expand...
Did the 2017 tax cut—the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act—pay for itself?

Like I said before, there are numerous ways to arrive at the answer to your question.

However, as the article above accurately points out ...

"While some TCJA supporters observe that nominal revenues were higher in fiscal year 2018 (which began Oct. 1, 2017) than in FY2017, that comparison does not address the question of the TCJA's effects. Nominal revenues rise because of inflation and economic growth. Adjusted for inflation, total revenues fell from FY2017 to FY2018 (Figure 1). Adjusted for the size of the economy, they fell even more."

Simply looking at net gains and losses, may allow you to arrive at your desired conclusion, but that won't tell you much about the impact of the tax cut. You must account for inflation and the growth of the economy, when making such an analysis, especially when the economy is in a period of expansion, as it was in 2017 and 2018.
 
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#383
#383
BowlBrother85 said:
Did the 2017 tax cut—the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act—pay for itself?

Like I said before, there are numerous ways to arrive at the answer to your question.

However, as the article above accurately points out ...

"While some TCJA supporters observe that nominal revenues were higher in fiscal year 2018 (which began Oct. 1, 2017) than in FY2017, that comparison does not address the question of the TCJA's effects. Nominal revenues rise because of inflation and economic growth. Adjusted for inflation, total revenues fell from FY2017 to FY2018 (Figure 1). Adjusted for the size of the economy, they fell even more."

Simply looking at net gains and losses, may allow you to arrive at your desired conclusion, but that won't tell you much about the impact of the tax cut. You must account for inflation and the growth of the economy, when making such an analysis.
Click to expand...

https://www.cato.org/blog/federal-t...federal tax revenues were,the tax cut in 2017.

So tax cuts made the economy boom

  • After the GOP tax bill passed, CBO projected that individual income tax revenues would rise to $1.900 trillion by 2021, but they came in 8 percent higher than projected at $2.052 trillion.
  • Corporate tax revenues stagnated from 2018 to 2020 but then rose sharply in 2021.
  • After the GOP tax bill passed, CBO projected that corporate tax revenues would rise to $327 billion by 2021, but they came in 13 percent higher than projected at $370 billion.
  • Revenues in 2021 are higher than projected even though GDP for 2021 is down 2 percent from what CBO had projected after the tax bill passed.
Total federal tax revenues were $3.32 trillion in 2017, $3.33 trillion in 2018, $3.46 trillion in 2019, $3.42 trillion in 2020, and $4.05 trillion in 2021. Revenues in 2021 are 22 percent higher than prior to the tax cut in 2017.
 
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#385
#385
Orangeburst said:
https://www.cato.org/blog/federal-tax-revenues-soar#:~:text=Total federal tax revenues were,the tax cut in 2017.

So tax cuts made the economy boom

  • After the GOP tax bill passed, CBO projected that individual income tax revenues would rise to $1.900 trillion by 2021, but they came in 8 percent higher than projected at $2.052 trillion.
  • Corporate tax revenues stagnated from 2018 to 2020 but then rose sharply in 2021.
  • After the GOP tax bill passed, CBO projected that corporate tax revenues would rise to $327 billion by 2021, but they came in 13 percent higher than projected at $370 billion.
  • Revenues in 2021 are higher than projected even though GDP for 2021 is down 2 percent from what CBO had projected after the tax bill passed.
Total federal tax revenues were $3.32 trillion in 2017, $3.33 trillion in 2018, $3.46 trillion in 2019, $3.42 trillion in 2020, and $4.05 trillion in 2021. Revenues in 2021 are 22 percent higher than prior to the tax cut in 2017.
Click to expand...
No ... that is just flat out stupid. The economy was already booming ... and did not require stimulus.
 
#388
#388
Orangeburst said:
You said tax revenue went down after the cuts.
Tax cuts make economy go boom and look at the chart..More revenue.
Not that silly revenue to GDP chart.
Click to expand...
Tax revenue did go down ... I wasn't breaking down the data, merely in terms of net gains/losses ... as you are.
 
#389
#389
DC_Vol said:
Isn’t that just called math?

I think I can lower tax RATE and it will pay for itself with increased productivity. Therefore tax receipts as a percent to GDP would be lower while the denominator would be higher.
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Did the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act Pay for Itself in 2018?

^^^^ Just limiting the discussion to Trump's "Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017." ^^^^

When you account for inflation, the tax cut did not pay for itself through increased productivity ... although, it is a balanced article, which states that it is possible under certain conditions for a tax cut to achieve this (I have seen no evidence of that ever happening myself) - Trump's "Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017" wasn't it.
 
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#391
#391
BowlBrother85 said:
What Are the Costs of the Trump Tax Cuts to You?

Supply side horse $hitters will spin it differently, of course ... there are numerous ways to arrive at the answer to your question ... but the correct answer is "Yes, it did."
Click to expand...
Well with the Biden economy killing me in the stock market, instead of paying a LOT in taxes, I am getting a refund for the first time in 35 years. I paid a LOT more under Trump because I was MAKING a lot more.
 
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#392
#392
BowlBrother85 said:
Did the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act Pay for Itself in 2018?

^^^^ Just limiting the discussion to Trump's "Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017." ^^^^

When you account for inflation, the tax cut did not pay for itself through increased productivity ... although, it is a balanced article, which states that it is possible under certain conditions for a tax cut to achieve this (I have seen no evidence of that ever happening myself) - Trump's "Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017" wasn't it.
Click to expand...

I’ve really got no interest in whether tax cuts pay for themselves. In my book, taxes should be cut and spending reduced. The fed govt is too large, too bloated, and wastes the majority of our tax dollars.

However, I was interested in this particular piece. I noticed it was limited to just 2018. Make yourself a little table of tax receipts by year and inflation rate by year.

Tax Receipts (source: U.S. government - receipts 2028 | Statista)
3.32
3.33
3.46
3.42
4.05
4.90
22.48

Inflation Rate (source: Historical Inflation Rates: 1914-2023)
1.6
2.9
1.6
0.6
5.4
9.1

2017 baseline adjusted for inflation:
3.32
3.38
3.48
3.50
3.69
4.02
21.39

It looks to me like the conclusion in your linked article was premature. I would suspect the lag is primarily driven by Corp tax revenue, but I didn’t look underneath the numbers to verify.

Would this change your mind?
 
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#393
#393
DC_Vol said:
I’ve really got no interest in whether tax cuts pay for themselves. In my book, taxes should be cut and spending reduced. The fed govt is too large, too bloated, and wastes the majority of our tax dollars.

However, I was interested in this particular piece. I noticed it was limited to just 2018. Make yourself a little table of tax receipts by year and inflation rate by year.

Tax Receipts (source: U.S. government - receipts 2028 | Statista)
3.32
3.33
3.46
3.42
4.05
4.90
22.48

Inflation Rate (source: Historical Inflation Rates: 1914-2023)
1.6
2.9
1.6
0.6
5.4
9.1

2017 baseline adjusted for inflation:
3.32
3.38
3.48
3.50
3.69
4.02
21.39

It looks to me like the conclusion in your linked article was premature. I would suspect the lag is primarily driven by Corp tax revenue, but I didn’t look underneath the numbers to verify.

Would this change your mind?
Click to expand...

According to the 22% from CATO..this would equate to revenue neutral. That would be great.

"Revenues in 2021 are 22 percent higher than prior to the tax cut in 2017."
 
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#394
#394
Majors said:
If Dems had integrity they would have never voted for Biden. His history of racism and corruption is well documented decades before Trump took office. No need to discuss integrity by the left, that left when a cigar was used.
Click to expand...

Both were awful, but the argument I heard was why waste a vote on somebody that can’t get elected, just choose between dumb and dumber.
 
#395
#395
Orangeburst said:
https://www.cato.org/blog/federal-tax-revenues-soar#:~:text=Total federal tax revenues were,the tax cut in 2017.

So tax cuts made the economy boom

  • After the GOP tax bill passed, CBO projected that individual income tax revenues would rise to $1.900 trillion by 2021, but they came in 8 percent higher than projected at $2.052 trillion.
  • Corporate tax revenues stagnated from 2018 to 2020 but then rose sharply in 2021.
  • After the GOP tax bill passed, CBO projected that corporate tax revenues would rise to $327 billion by 2021, but they came in 13 percent higher than projected at $370 billion.
  • Revenues in 2021 are higher than projected even though GDP for 2021 is down 2 percent from what CBO had projected after the tax bill passed.
Total federal tax revenues were $3.32 trillion in 2017, $3.33 trillion in 2018, $3.46 trillion in 2019, $3.42 trillion in 2020, and $4.05 trillion in 2021. Revenues in 2021 are 22 percent higher than prior to the tax cut in 2017.
Click to expand...

Two things I feel pretty certain about. The CBO doesn't have a clue what it's doing, and the CBO has never gotten a prediction right yet.
 
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#396
#396
DC_Vol said:
I’ve really got no interest in whether tax cuts pay for themselves. In my book, taxes should be cut and spending reduced. The fed govt is too large, too bloated, and wastes the majority of our tax dollars.

However, I was interested in this particular piece. I noticed it was limited to just 2018. Make yourself a little table of tax receipts by year and inflation rate by year.

Tax Receipts (source: U.S. government - receipts 2028 | Statista)
3.32
3.33
3.46
3.42
4.05
4.90
22.48

Inflation Rate (source: Historical Inflation Rates: 1914-2023)
1.6
2.9
1.6
0.6
5.4
9.1

2017 baseline adjusted for inflation:
3.32
3.38
3.48
3.50
3.69
4.02
21.39

It looks to me like the conclusion in your linked article was premature. I would suspect the lag is primarily driven by Corp tax revenue, but I didn’t look underneath the numbers to verify.

Would this change your mind?
Click to expand...
They do at some point. The Laffer curve is a logic exercise. With a tax rate of 0%, the government takes in $0 revenue. With a tax rate of 100%, the government takes in $0 in revenue. Obviously there is a tax rate in there that optimizes revenue.
 
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#397
#397
midnight orange said:
They do at some point. The Laffer curve is a logic exercise. With a tax rate of 0%, the government takes in $0 revenue. With a tax rate of 100%, the government takes in $0 in revenue. Obviously there is a tax rate in there that optimizes revenue.
Click to expand...

Logical...but you have a typo.
 
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#398
#398
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